Why doesn't God want Female Priests?

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Okay fair enough, but I was talking about the Church (people, not teachings). The church basically say we should be treated equally, but in different cultures, this ‘equality’ is seen differently. The church didn’t really give specifics and you have Catholics filling in the perceived gaps with their own opinions, which is usually heavily influenced by culture. Sometimes you end up with beliefs like female priesthood, sometimes you end up with beliefs like sola skirtura.

Remember, whether we like to admit it or not, the culture we are in almost guides the way we believe certain teachings. A priest in a rural part of India’s views on women would be very different from my parish priest. Both would defend themselves and say they’re not sexist (it’s sad to see complementarianism being used an excuse to hold sexist views), which is my issue here.

People keep claiming that they don’t view women less than men, but their opinions and beliefs about women say otherwise. And then they get shocked when people flock to more secular worldviews like feminism. Without naming names, I’m sure you can at least guess a few posters (male or female) on CAF who would fit this description. And I’m telling you, based on news in Asia (and Africa, Middle East etc), this views aren’t a teeny tiny minority. Not all catholics think like Americans.

I don’t want to keep talking here because I would end up repeating myself and nobody wants that. Our conversation so far is basically me telling you that there are people out there who are saying things in vain, and you telling me it isn’t true. So honestly, this will go nowhere lol.
 
I’m not saying what you’re saying isn’t true to your experience. And you’re correct about the culture differences. But as I recall you are based in east Asia? In the West Christianity has been influencing the culture for the last 2000 years or so. So the West probably reflects the attitude most close to the Christian one. (At least it did until recently).

But Christianity in the East has not been as accepted or as ingrained in the culture over such a long period of time. So you’re right in saying that a rural Indian priest might be unconsiously sexist due to cultural influence. The same could be true of parishoners. But I think it’s important to discern how much the prevailing culture influences people’s attitudes and seperate that from genuine Church teaching.
 
South East, it’s honestly not as sexist as you would think. I’m lucky to live in a developed country where I’m expected to pull my own weight instead of depending on a guy. In fact, I was honestly shocked at the sexism and overly traditional views present in America.

I don’t think it’s fair to make that assertion. Christians in the West had been doing despicable things as well. If you’re right, it doesn’t take away my point that there’s sexism.

I don’t understand the Church’s genuine teaching, but I’m not attacking it at all here. I’m literally saying that culture influences how the church is like in a society, and the church (meaning the people) should acknowledge it and try to rectify that instead of dismissing unhappy women as people who are influenced by the evils of feminism, like I have said earlier. From your first reply to me it seems like you don’t really get what I’m trying to say, and hence I don’t understand what you’re trying to say?

Simply put, while complementarianism claims the belief of equality, the movement as a whole fail to show it since in many places, it’s basically patriarchy. Which is why people tend to have such a negative reaction to it and support egalitarianism instead.
 
The church could ordain woman if that should be what the holy spirit desires.
I don’t know how popes and leaders make their minds up about certain issues, but I would hope they don’t just cling to the idea that something that is traditional should never be updated.

And yes it is normal in this world to have men as leaders not only in faith but in politics and business etc.
 
Oneofthewomen said:
The nature of the ministerial priesthood is that the priest, at certain times, actually becomes the “person of Christ”. Well, as much as I can be “Christ-like” and try to live as He did, I cannot, ever be Christ, as I am not a man.
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I did not think that the church teaches that a priest becomes Christ, no mortal being could become a supernatural deity? :confused:
 
IF the Spirit desires. That would mean, would it not, that the Spirit would have to “Change His mind”? We aren’t talking about a development but a complete reversal of “The Church has NO AUTHORITY” to “The Church HAS authority” in the case of a SACRAMENT.

Can you give me an example of any other sacrament where The Spirit has changed His mind?
 
To me it wouldn’t be about changing ‘his’ mind, it would be about including where there is exclusion.
 
But there is no ‘exclusion’ save in the mind of limited, fallible humans. I’m glad you put ‘to me’ because it explains why you keep thinking that this teaching can be changed; it is something that you can’t accept as true because you are convinced it excludes and is wrong.

It doesn’t and it isn’t, and no amount of ‘but but but exclusion, but but but not fair’ will make the teaching wrong OR ‘exclusive’ any more than the ability of the Church to preside over marriage of a man and a woman (not two men or two women) is an example of being ‘exclusive’ or unfair.

Or do you also think that the Church’s not having authority to allow two men or two women to marry is ‘exclusion’ as well? It would be interesting to know. . .
 
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stpurl said:
It doesn’t and it isn’t, and no amount of ‘but but but exclusion, but but but not fair
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I wouldn’t put it quite like that, but yes I find it troubling that a woman can be given the sacraments (Baptism, confirmation) receiving of the "Indelible spiritual mark’ which stops at holy orders, and given only to certain males.
 
There have been many female prophets. Mary herself and Elizabeth are among them. Christ’s ministry on earth was sponsored by wealthy women. The church as we know it could not exist without women. Men simply have a different role.
 
I as a married man can’t become a priest either. And not every man who wants to become a priest can be. The Church gets to decide which men it will ordain.
 
Well said. I would add that part of the problem is actually feminism and the tendency to look at everything in terms of “equality” and “inclusion”. People see the Church as just another Human institution and think that the Pope and Bishops can change the rules willy nilly. But that’s not the case.
Modern people can’t accept that there are differences between men and women and there are certain roles that can only be fulfilled by either a man or a woman.
 
The main reason the Apocryphal story of Paul and Thecla was deemed non inspired was Thecla Baptizing herself
 
Right.
Now are you understanding that as “God is a Divine Being, farther beyond me, non-divine, than I could possibly imagine, therefore if He says something is fair, then even if it does not seem fair to me, He must be right and I must be wrong?”

Or are you understanding that as, “Human beings, not God, made up these rules. Therefore we can and should change them in order TO BE FAIR”?
 
A few post ago I asked this question about male and female…

What are the spiritual differences?

No one has replied.

Where in the bible does Christ say no woman shall be a priest, is there something concrete like the ten commandments? I don’t recall Jesus saying anything about it, the teaching doesn’t seem to come directly from God, so that one can say ‘God doesn’t want female priests, or, priestess’.

I don’t think humans ‘made up the rules’. But humans are not God, priests do not become Christ (somewhere this was said in this thread but it seems to have disappeared) Popes make mistakes, even when guided by the spirit, that was my point.
 
OH, I see. You’re saying that unless you see it in the Bible, in red words from Jesus, that it isn’t a real teaching?

You’re a sola Scripturist at heart even if a Catholic by baptism.

You DON’T believe the teaching is from God. You’ve determined that if you don’t see it ‘writ in the Bible’ then it’s ‘man-made’.

You are, my friend, very confused and grasping at straws trying to walk all over with your ‘what ifs’, ‘we don’t know’, ‘people make mistakes’ etc. You’re trying to make the argument all about things which have absolutely nothing to do with the teaching itself.

“The Church has no authority to ordain women.”

Either you accept the Church has authority, that the Holy Spirit guides it, and that you can trust the teachings, or you’ll just wander around with “but maybe they were wrong here, maybe it can change, maybe maybe” until you’ve rejected the Truth and made yourself a nice comfortable image of god in your likeness. . .fair, rational, reasonable, totally dependable because hey, if something ever bothers you, you can CHANGE it! You’ll never have to be responsible, because there is never any absolute, never any real authority, never any question of submitting your will. A perfect ‘pocket god’ that you can pull out when you want him and ignore when you don’t, that will work with anybody else just the way they want him to. . .

Priests become “Alter Christi’ or ‘in persona Christ’.
You know what, the same Christ who became incarnate of the Virgin Mary, suffered, died, rose again, etc. is not limited to your human understanding (or lack, if applicable) of what He can and cannot do, or what is or is not ‘fair’. You don’t see ‘how’ a ‘mere human’ can become not just ‘like Christ’ but Christ Himself? What do you think is going to happen to us in Heaven? Do you think we’ll be ‘like Christ’ but we won’t be 'joined to Him” in any way? That it will be just like ‘here’ where we’ll be occupying physical space A and B etc while Christ is over in some amorphous ‘quadrant’ kind of hovering over us like a giant ectoplasm while we are all separate from Him and everybody else? Please stop trying to limit Almighty God to some earthly timeline of AD 2017 in the US and insist that He has to abide by the current ‘laws’ of fairness and the earthly laws of physics!
 
You assume much, most very wrongly, so there isn’t much point in discussing it anymore.

God bless on your journey.
 
I don’t think anyone can say positively that God does not want female priest; the Church just says that they don’t have the authority to ordain women as priests. Not exactly the same thing in my opinion.
 
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simpleas said:
A few post ago I asked this question about male and female…

What are the spiritual differences?

No one has replied.
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I went back a few days’ worth in postings, but don’t see that question. Nevertheless…

The difference isn’t spiritual. No one is saying that men have some sort of spiritual feature that women don’t (in fact, that would seem to be the point of “in Christ, there is no male and female” – in terms of our salvation, there is no difference).
Where in the bible does Christ say no woman shall be a priest, is there something concrete like the ten commandments? I don’t recall Jesus saying anything about it, the teaching doesn’t seem to come directly from God, so that one can say ‘God doesn’t want female priests, or, priestess’.
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As you well know, there’s nowhere in the Bible that this is expressed explicitly. Two questions for you:
  • where in the Bible does it say that Christ says ‘find all your answers in the Bible’?
  • where in the Bible do you see that Christ chooses women for the priesthood? (Or even, as we look back into the OT, where do you see women acting as Levitical priests, or even, familial priests?)
If the Bible is the standard reference from which we derive an answer, is there any support for female priests there?

On the other hand, we do have a Scriptural passage that tells us where the authority for such a decision comes from: “what you hold bound on earth will be bound in heaven.” If the Church pronounces it, then it is upheld by Jesus. (We believe that Jesus would not uphold injustice, so we believe that the Church is protected from making doctrine that Christ would reject.)
Popes make mistakes, even when guided by the spirit, that was my point.
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On matters of faith and morals? That’s what you believe? If so, then your belief diverges from the teachings of the Church. 🤷‍♂️
 
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