Why doesn't the Bible say that Mary was sinless?

  • Thread starter Thread starter emeraldisle
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
jmcrae said:
You are a human being, but if you are in Christ, then it is to be hoped that you are not “sinful” - have your sins not been washed away in His blood? If they have, then you are no longer a “sinner” - you are among the redeemed, alongside Mary, who was redeemed at the moment of her conception.

Consider the context. He is saying that without Christ, we are in our sins. But with Christ, our sins are washed away, and we become righteous (that is, without sin).
Click to expand...
*If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.
1 John 1:8-10, 2:1-2*

.
 
sandusky said:
In Mt 16:18, the “bedrock” (Gk petra), upon which Christ will build His church is "feminine."

Now what do you do, James? Repent, perhaps? 🙂
Click to expand...
Of course you just know that Jesus was running around speaking common vulgar Greek to all His disciples who spoke Aramaic huh? :rolleyes:

Come on - I don’t expect an educated man to take the below the belt shots - that’s emasculating and fighting like a girlie-boy or a eunich. 😃

James
 
emeraldisle said:
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.
.
Are you saying that Jesus lied through His disciples when they told us:

1 Corinthians 6:11
Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

Titus 3:3-7
But when the kindness and the love of God our Savior toward man appeared, not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, whom He poured out on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior, that having been justified by His grace we should become heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

Do you think that this was not referring to the power of Grace (e.g. ‘hail Mary full of GRACE") to save us from sin? Do you doubt Jesus’ ability to save through preemption as well as through forgiveness of sin? If you don’t think God can intervene to prevent the devil from causing us to sin and spare us from temptation then you are doubting Christ’s word. You are also doubting the words in the Lord’s Prayer:
"and lead us not into temptation". Christ, the Good Shepherd can save us by leading us around and away from sin not just rescue us from the sins that eat at us like wolves.

Can you dare to imagine Christ would not have been kind to His Mother and preempted and exempted her from sin by saving her from ever suffering the pain of sin and alienation in full or part from God and Himself!!! :eek: It’s almost a blasphemy to even imagine Jesus would not exempt His mother!

Are you sure you are a TRUE BELIEVER?

James
Click to expand...
 
CentralFLJames said:
Of course you just know that Jesus was running around speaking common vulgar Greek to all His disciples who spoke Aramaic huh? :rolleyes:

Come on - I don’t expect an educated man to take the below the belt shots - that’s emasculating and fighting like a girlie-boy or a eunich. 😃

James
Click to expand...
:rotfl:
 
jmcrae said:
No; women also are born into Original Sin and pass it on to their female offspring. Where does this idea of “father only” come from?

I was under the impression that the Orthodox believe that we are all immaculately conceived - that they don’t believe in Original Sin. I was apparently mistaken.

The story of Mary’s conception and birth is recorded in the Protoevangelium of James.
Click to expand...
I am not sure about Orthodox doctrine, but it is my understanding that you are correct, that all are immaculately conceived, but since the world is in original sin, when a person is born into the world they inherit the effects of original sin. They still consider the Theotokos to be All Holy, even though the understanding of original sin is not Latinized.
 
bookgirl32 said:
This was my point, were they speaking Greek?
Click to expand...
No, they were speaking Aramaic. The New Testament was written in Greek as a means of evangelizing the Gentiles.

The name that Jesus gave to Peter was “Kephas” - a rock. There is no distinction between the name and the object; thus, what Jesus said to him was, in essence, “Thou are Kephas, and upon this kephas I will build my Church.”
 
emeraldisle said:
bookgirl32;3587529:
The following Scriptures clearly tell us all of humanity is sinful and of course we know that Mary is part of sinful humanity.

Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned: Rom 5:12
Click to expand...
.

For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; Rom 3:23
You clearly haven’t addressed the point in my post just above yours, which shows that the word ALL in ALL have sinned (pas) is RHETORICAL. Did every single person in Judea go to see Jesus? Was everyone on the planet counted by the Roman census? Your refusal to engage with this point seems to show a refusal to engage in genuine discussion. In fact it would seem more than a little dishonest to repeat the same arguments over again as if the point hadn’t been made.

In fact the very verse you choose as a final example shows the error of your argument that ALL in these verses is a universal absolute allowing no exception. Rom 5.12 says death came to ALL men. So… Did death come to Enoch or to Elijah? No? Are they not a part of sinful humanity?

So. If ALL in the first part of the verse doesn’t mean that every single human had to die, then ALL in the second part of the same verse doesn’t mean that every single human has to be a sinner. It is your interpretation of the verses that is confused, not God.
Click to expand...
 
Axion said:
emeraldisle;3587576:
You clearly haven’t addressed the point in my post just above yours, which shows that the word ALL in ALL have sinned (pas) is RHETORICAL. Did every single person in Judea go to see Jesus? Was everyone on the planet counted by the Roman census? Your refusal to engage with this point seems to show a refusal to engage in genuine discussion. In fact it would seem more than a little dishonest to repeat the same arguments over again as if the point hadn’t been made.

In fact the very verse you choose as a final example shows the error of your argument that ALL in these verses is a universal absolute allowing no exception. Rom 5.12 says death came to ALL men. So… Did death come to Enoch or to Elijah? No? Are they not a part of sinful humanity?

So. If ALL in the first part of the verse doesn’t mean that every single human had to die, then ALL in the second part of the same verse doesn’t mean that every single human has to be a sinner. It is your interpretation of the verses that is confused, not God.
Click to expand...
Something got messed up here. You are responding in challenge to Emerald but it LOOKS like you are responding to bookgirl32. Anyway: You & the Book are on the same page when it comes to the word “all”. As is Dr. Strong. That famous and venerable Protestant Scripture scholar! Count me in also.
Click to expand...
 
mercygate said:
Axion;3597404:
Something got messed up here. You are responding in challenge to Emerald but it LOOKS like you are responding to bookgirl32. Anyway: You & the Book are on the same page when it comes to the word “all”. As is Dr. Strong. That famous and venerable Protestant Scripture scholar! Count me in also.
Click to expand...
yes. The quotation script on the board seems to have got messed up somehow. It’s haoppened on your post too, mercygate. But I can’t re-edit it now. Sorry Bookgirl. The post was addressed to Emeraldisle.
Click to expand...
 
Please watch your opening and closing quote tags, people - preview, proof-read, preview; repeat until satisfactory. 🙂
 
Axion said:
yes. The quotation script on the board seems to have got messed up somehow. It’s haoppened on your post too, mercygate. But I can’t re-edit it now. Sorry Bookgirl. The post was addressed to Emeraldisle.
Click to expand...
Just remove all of the extra quote tags at the time that you’re writing your message.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top