Why don't Catholics bring Bible to Masses

[pnewton]

He is a she!

I knew it! Girls were always my nemeses at Bible drills growing up. I was one of the few boys in my church group. I WILL DEFEAT YOU YET!! I guess it is too late to win, or to hold a childhood grudge against the whole of the female gender.

Then I apologize for my outburst.

 

[TrueLight]

I knew it! Girls were always my nemeses at Bible drills growing up. I was one of the few boys in my church group. I WILL DEFEAT YOU YET!! I guess it is too late to win, or to hold a childhood grudge against the whole of the female gender.

Then I apologize for my outburst.

Ha ha. You crazy man, you.

 

[TrueLight]

We produced many holy men and women for centuries before the Bible was canonized. If it was good enough for them, why isn’t it good enough for us? We can be good Christians without having our own Bibles, though it would be great if we do. But we are fed the Word of God during Liturgy, it not like not having a Bible means we’re completely deprived of it.

Because a lot of us are literate now? If you’re illiterate, then you do what you can. God will help you.

However, if we can spend time on the internet reading message boards, we should not ignore reading and meditating on the word of God.

If we can read about the Saints and theology, why would we purposefully choose to not touch the Bible until we hear it at mass.

Notice, the men who were learned in the Bible like Paul constantly referred to the scriptures of the Old Testament and they taught from it.

And that is why so many Catholics are led astray when Protestants point to specific verses that a lot of Catholics have never heard even though they “hear” it read to them at masses.

 

[pnewton]

We produced many holy men and women for centuries before the Bible was canonized. If it was good enough for them, why isn’t it good enough for us?

The same thing can be said about the Rosary and all Marian devotion. You can be a Saint without it (canonized or not), but it is a good source of spiritual assistance. When it comes to these things, it is not an either or. We do live in an age where the Bible is readily available to all. It is a great gift and not to be lightly put aside. To whom much is given…

 

[Cat]

Because a lot of us are literate now? If you’re illiterate, then you do what you can. God will help you.

However, if we can spend time on the internet reading message boards, we should not ignore reading and meditating on the word of God.

If we can read about the Saints and theology, why would we purposefully choose to not touch the Bible until we hear it at mass.

Notice, the men who were learned in the Bible like Paul constantly referred to the scriptures of the Old Testament and they taught from it.

And that is why so many Catholics are led astray when Protestants point to specific verses that a lot of Catholics have never heard even though they “hear” it read to them at masses.

This whole post is excellent, but the last point is especially important.

I spent the first 47 years of my life as an evangelical Protestant. From CHILDHOOD, I was TRAINED in several classes on how to use the Bible to eviscerate Catholics.

I know many MANY Catholics who converted to evangelical Protestantism after hearing Biblical presentations by knowledgeable evangelical Protestants. I’m sure you know Catholics like this, too. It seems that very few Catholic families have remained totally Catholic; almost all the Catholic families I know have at least one family member who has departed and is now an enthusiastic member of an evangelical Protestant denomination, and is constantly trying to convince his/her Catholic relatives and friends to “Leave that pagan cult and ask Jesus into your heart.”

One of the sins that I confessed upon coming into the Church was deliberately leading Catholics away from the True Church into the evangelical churches.

It is just plain foolish and dangerous for Catholics to rely on Mass readings to supply them with all the “Bible” that they need. Every Catholic, especially young Catholics, should be fully educated in the Bible and be well-rehearsed in how to defend the Catholic Church USING THE BIBLE to mount their defense.

It should be so automatic that the Catholic doesn’t even have to stumble around. They should be able to fully and confidently answer every objection that the evangelical Protestant raises, and they should be able to provide those answers by turning IN THEIR BIBLES to the appropriate passages and verses, and/or quoting these passages, along with the references, to the Protestant evangelist.

And EVERY Catholic should know the books of the Bible in order and out of order, and no Catholic should have to rely on those plastic tabs. I can tell you right now that an evangelical Protestant will use that lack of knowledge of Bible structure to convince the Catholic that he/she has a flawed understanding of Christianity and the Bible. Then the evangelical Protestant will proceed to lead that poor silly Catholic to a proper understanding of Christianity, and before you know it, that Catholic will be skipping Mass to attend “praise and worship” down at the megachurch that is so full of seekers that they are building a new building to accomodate the overflow.

Do NOT underestimate the evangelical Protestants and their minute knowledge of the Bible! I’ve heard a lot of Catholics say that most evangelical Protestants only know a few passages, and are ignorant of the rest of the Bible. I’m sure that’s true for some, but most evangelical Protestants have not only read the Bible through many times (I read it through several dozen times before I turned 50), but they’ve also studied each book of the Bible on their own and in corporate Bible studies. Many have taken classes in “Bible” and know how to use their Bibles to evangelize. And many discipline themselves to memorize Scriptures.

Just this week, I was reminded of how knowledgeable many evangelical Protestants are. My daughter, who is also a convert to Catholicism, completed the Child Evangelism Fellowship Bible course when she was a young child. In case anyone thinks this is “cute,” I would challenge them to complete this same course. It took my daughter two years to finish it–she would receive the booklet, read the passages in the Bible, fill out the questions, mail them back, and then receive her corrected paper back, along with a new booklet. I read through the booklets, and I can attest that many of the questions would grow hair on a hairless chest! They were heavy questions about the basic doctrines of Christianity and about Bible history.

Anyway, my daughter sent me an e-mail with a meditation referencing an Old Testament passage. It was pretty heavy stuff, and I was rather blown away by the meditation, which was deeper and more thoughtful than most priestly homilies that I have heard. She may be a convert to Catholicism, but she STILL knows her Bible!

Again, it is pure folly for a Catholic who has associations with Protestants to think that they can get away with just hearing the Bible read at Mass every day. Catholics who think like that are in grave danger of becoming Protestants!

 

[DebChris]

The best protection against being led away from the Church is knowing your Faith. It is poor catechesis that led to Cursillo, a lay movement within the Catholic Church that begins with a weekend and continues with weekly meetings and lifelong formation.
A former pastor lamented that so many view Confirmation as a form of graduation rather than a Sacrament of Initiation. Many dioceses are recognizing this shortfall and initiating Adult formation classes.
Next month I will return overseas, to the Middle East. My parish there has monthly Enriching the Faith sessions open to all that lectors and EMCHs are required to attend. Formation to become an EMCH takes a year and lectors meet monthly. I belong to Couples for Christ which meets Fridays. A person can easily spend a full day at Church, especially on First Fridays when there is Holy Hour preceding the Obligation (Sunday) Mass. It is the most active parish to which I have belonged. Yes, the parish offers weekly Bible study on Tuesday evenings.

Pat Manahan’s Where is that in the Bible is highly recommended for anyone involved in ecumenical discussions. I also have a copy of the Catholic Answer Bible which has Biblical references for Catholic teaching.

 

[Mintaka]

The time to study the Bible on paper, for most Catholics, is not “at church”. You study the Bible while ignoring your boring CCD class or while sitting at home. Heh.

When you’re at church, you’re busy praying or listening, or maybe you’ve got a Missal and are studying the interrelationship of the readings of the day. But flipping through the Bible and taking notes is… well, those who are used to it can do it reverently, I’m sure. But if I were reading a book during Mass I’d be ignoring Christ right in front of me doing miracles. (And given how absorbed I get whenever I read, I would probably wake up two hours later with the folks from the next Mass leaving while giving me funny looks.)

Re: Protestants trying to lure Catholics away…

Oh, man, I remember people trying that on me. I also remember Bible verses coming out of my mouth left and right, and the time I seriously threatened to shake the dust off my feet against someone. God really does give you the words to defend yourself, sometimes. But it was the grace of God that I never hit anybody, all the crazy blasphemies they spewed out at me.

I also remember sinking into deep depressions afterward – not because I disbelieved Catholicism, but because I’d never realized that people were so ignorant and that I was so bad at explaining. The major problem is not that Catholics are ignorant of the Bible (I wasn’t) but that Catholics tend to study only things that interest and enrich their religious life (as is natural), instead of studying all the crazy stuff they need to know for the sake of other people who don’t know any better.

But of course, the other stuff is still going to be more interesting. You can’t really get to the good bits of the Bible unless you study as a believing Catholic. But a lot of the basic basics are very interesting to know in the Bible, even though Catholics probably already know them from Tradition.

But really, apologetic/debating/conversational skills are more essential than Bible knowledge. Without that, one of these days, I am going to hit somebody, even as I tell them all about five or six different, ancient, valid interpretations of “a door opened in heaven”. At the top of my voice. With footnotes. Because aggressive body language from people coming at me like that (and there’s usually a ton of aggressive body language – I’ve only met a couple Protestant evangelists who like to discuss things quietly and reasonably) always prompts my hindbrain to give them some aggressive body language right in the kisser, and that’s not really the way to win souls.

(American Catholic religion classes, even for little kids, used to explain to kids the stuff that Protestants and atheists would try on them and tell them what to say back. But that “paranoid stuff” was dropped during the Sixties in the name of ecumenism, while nobody told the evangelical sorts that they were supposed to be all gracious and respectful now.)

 

[Defender1]

Every year there is a Sunday dedicated to BIBLE SUNDAY encouraging the faithful to read the bible in their daily life. Why is the church worldwide having missals in the pews instead of Catholics bringing bibles ?

Some of us do bring our bibles . I bring mine .

 

[DianaCC]

Okay, I have a few:…

These trivia questionnaires are fun, but I would like to redirect: Does anyone have any clever Bible mnemonics? I have a few:

• Ten Commmandments. Appear twice, Exodus 20 and Deuteronomy 5. Second book, 20th chapter; fifth book, 5th chapter. Three about God, seven about Man. Sixth and ninth (gigglegiggle) are about sex, seventh and tenth about property. Eighth is about lying because the violations of 6 & 9 and 7 & 10 always revolve around lying. Five fingers make a fist, 5th commandment is about murder.
• Gospels. “Matthew Mark and Luke and John, bless the bed that I lie on.” Two apostles and two associates.
• Apostles. Two pairs of brothers. Three pairs who had the same first names. One got replaced and then four pairs had the same names. Three have two names. Half a pair of twins.

Not all of them are good, obviously. Got better ones?

 

[pnewton]

Not all of them are good, obviously. Got better ones?

What I think is funny is that the first one is actually in the Bible, just not in the context it is used. FYI - I always use the Bible in Church, even when I don’t have it. I mean really, how can we not? During the homily the other readings and even the music, Scripture comes to mind to meditate upon, or to cross reference to what is being said, and even occasional as a correction.

 

[xixxvmcm85]

A pair of questions I love to ask Jews:

• Who was Jesus’ mother? (They always know this. Everybody knows this.)
• Ok, so who was Moses’ mother? (So far, nobody has gotten this one.)

What makes this especially funny is that it’s same name.

I thought Miriam was Moses’ sister, and his mother had some quite exotic, hard to pronounce name which started with a J … or was it a T?

 

[DianaCC]

Do NOT underestimate the evangelical Protestants and their minute knowledge of the Bible!

When I was in college and occasionally argued about religion with EvP friends I consciously avoided the proof-text game.

• Paraphrase instead of quote. “Keeping kosher doesn’t guarantee heaven.”
• Cite author not verse number. “Paul says we are living letters.”
• Focus on arguments, not statements. “But is that really what the author is saying about mediatorship in the context of the letter as a whole? I think not.”
• Focus on obscure verses. “Yeah, but what about John 3:15? Hm?”

This is not meant to confuse them, but to send them a message that they are missing the bigger picture. We Catholics absorbed scripture for 1500 years without chipping it into numbered bits and our approach and our understanding reflects that. Sometimes I think these people have Bibles made up of unconnected verses listed by subject.

 

[asia53]

I thought Miriam was Moses’ sister, and his mother had some quite exotic, hard to pronounce name which started with a J … or was it a T?

Jochebed

Always makes me think—jockey’s bed. I think, it’s the only reason it’s stuck with me.

 

[David2010]

. . . Why is the church worldwide having missals in the pews instead of Catholics bringing bibles ?

My church does not supply missals in the pews; we have to buy our own. Each Advent, the church brings in a few boxes, which we can purchase at cost, or we can purchase them elsewhere. Or we can do without. But my church does not supply them. I buy one each year, so I can follow along with the masses, and I bring it back-and-forth to church with me each time I go.

As for reading the Bible, it is voluntary.
I read it sometimes at home, but most of my Bible reading occurs at church. We usually go to church early so that we get a good parking spot and good seat. Probably 45 to 60 minutes early. So I bring a Bible to read while we wait for Mass to start.
Other people do not bring the Bible to read at church.
It is up to the individual; I don’t think there is a church policy about bringing and reading Bibles in church.

 

[Cat]

These trivia questionnaires are fun, but I would like to redirect: Does anyone have any clever Bible mnemonics? I have a few:

• Ten Commmandments. Appear twice, Exodus 20 and Deuteronomy 5. Second book, 20th chapter; fifth book, 5th chapter. Three about God, seven about Man. Sixth and ninth (gigglegiggle) are about sex, seventh and tenth about property. Eighth is about lying because the violations of 6 & 9 and 7 & 10 always revolve around lying. Five fingers make a fist, 5th commandment is about murder.
• Gospels. “Matthew Mark and Luke and John, bless the bed that I lie on.” Two apostles and two associates.
• Apostles. Two pairs of brothers. Three pairs who had the same first names. One got replaced and then four pairs had the same names. Three have two names. Half a pair of twins.

Not all of them are good, obviously. Got better ones?

General ------ Galatians
Electric ------ Ephesians
Power ------ Phillippians
Company — Colossians

 

[DianaCC]

I thought Miriam was Moses’ sister, and his mother had some quite exotic, hard to pronounce name which started with a J … or was it a T?

My mistake. I had in mind Miriam, who of course was Moses’ sister, not mother. Miriam = Mary in Hebrew. Jochebed was Moses’ mother. The way I remember Jochebed is I recall that scene in the movie *The Ten Commandments *where Charlton Heston has the scrap of Levite cloth in which he was found wrapped as an infant and lines it up with Jochebed’s blanket, and he says, “Jochebed!” But the memory trick failed me this time lol

 

[Cat]

Just wanted to remind everyone, including myself, that “A partial indulgence is granted to the faithful who use Sacred Scripture for spiritual reading with the veneration due the word of God. A plenary indulgence is granted if the reading continues for at least one half hour.” (Enchiridion Indulgentiarum, 1968 edition, no. 62)

It seems to me that a lot of baptized Bible-reading Protestants might be getting out of purgatory before us Catholics!

 

[ProVobis]

When I was in college and occasionally argued about religion with EvP friends I consciously avoided the proof-text game.

• Paraphrase instead of quote. “Keeping kosher doesn’t guarantee heaven.”
• Cite author not verse number. “Paul says we are living letters.”
• Focus on arguments, not statements. “But is that really what the author is saying about mediatorship in the context of the letter as a whole? I think not.”
• Focus on obscure verses. “Yeah, but what about John 3:15? Hm?”

This is not meant to confuse them, but to send them a message that they are missing the bigger picture. We Catholics absorbed scripture for 1500 years without chipping it into numbered bits and our approach and our understanding reflects that. Sometimes I think these people have Bibles made up of unconnected verses listed by subject.

Can’t one make a case all English Bibles are paraphrased from the Greek/Latin? And which Bible do you bring to Church if indeed you bring a Bible to Church? There are at least this many to choose from just for one versicle:

bible.cc/john/1-15.htm

 

[pnewton]

When I was in college and occasionally argued about religion with EvP friends I consciously avoided the proof-text game.

• Paraphrase instead of quote. “Keeping kosher doesn’t guarantee heaven.”
• Cite author not verse number. “Paul says we are living letters.”
• Focus on arguments, not statements. “But is that really what the author is saying about mediatorship in the context of the letter as a whole? I think not.”
• Focus on obscure verses. “Yeah, but what about John 3:15? Hm?”

This is not meant to confuse them, but to send them a message that they are missing the bigger picture. .

I have the Bible of CD, an excellent dramatized NIV version that uses about 50 well known actors. It has the advantage of providing context that one does not get when one does not read a whole book at a time. It sure changes the spin of popular proof-texted verses.

 

[DianaCC]

And which Bible do you bring to Church if indeed you bring a Bible to Church?

The biggest.