Why don't non-catholic christians convert?

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Part of it has to do with the anti-Catholic bias left over from England and various other countries that manifested itself globally.
 
You need to answer the question why so many Catholics are lost in their own faith? They are guilt ridden, condemned and anxious about not being able to keep all the rules. When they can’t take it anymore they abandon their faith. Some say well I know I can’t ever measure up or be good enough so I might as well eat drink and be merry. Others are so afraid because they were taught they would go to hell if they left the church they still call themselves catholic but don’t really practice it and just do their own thing. Yet they don’t really believe what they were taught. Then there are the ones who leave and become born again. The part of my family that’s still Catholic don’t fit the definition of “good Catholic”.
 
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While conceding that you are right and halogirl’s statement was reductionist, was there actually any doctrinal basis for the Anglican schism other than an issue with authority of the Pope in a political context?

Luther, Calvin, Wesley etc all had doctrinal differences apart from papal authority. Did the Church of England?
 
Tis_Bearself said:
While conceding that you are right and halogirl’s statement was reductionist, was there actually any doctrinal basis for the Anglican schism other than an issue with authority of the Pope in a political context?
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Sure. Henry VIII believed his marriage to Catherine of Aragon was “blighted in the eyes of God” due to the fact that she was his brother’s widow. Henry recognized that this violated Leviticus 20:21 and was an impediment to marriage in Catholic canon law. Henry’s father secured a papal dispensation, so they could marry (and Catherine claimed that Henry’s brother never consummated their marriage, etc.).

The doctrinal question was this: Henry claimed that the pope did not have authority to dispense with a divine law.

Of course, some theologians at the time also brought up Deuteronomy 25:5, which commanded a man to take to wife his deceased brother’s widow, if there had been no child. So, it was a very interesting biblical argument.

Henry cited the fact that he had no male heir as a consequence of the Levitical curse, and theologians pointed out that they was not childless (Catherine had given birth to Princess Mary). Henry’s theologians argued that in the original language, the word “childless” in Leviticus 20:21 actually refers to sons.

So, that was the theological battleground.
 
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Right, but isn’t it a bit disingenuous to claim that this sudden theological issue from King Henry was motivated by anything other than political and probably sexual concerns?

It’s not like he was sitting around for years pondering the theology of the Church and was finally motivated to come up with this.
 
Tis_Bearself said:
Right, but isn’t it a bit disingenuous to claim that this sudden theological issue from King Henry was motivated by anything other than political and probably sexual concerns?
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Well, obviously there was politics involved because it was dealing with the heir to the kingdom. Henry VIII’s father, Henry VII, was the first king in the Tudor dynasty; he had to defeat Richard III of the House of York and win the Wars of the Roses, So, the Tudor dynasty was not as secure as we might think today. Henry VIII had reason to worry that dying without a male heir would plunge the country into warfare and chaos.

If Catherine had managed to give Henry a male heir, he would not have worried about God’s anger, but she didn’t. So, Henry had to consider that God was angry with him, and he did his best to understand why.

If it was purely sexual, Henry would have made Anne Boleyn his mistress (like he made her sister prior), like many other European monarchs did while the Church looked the other way.

Now, even Protestants like Luther and the Swiss reformers disagreed with Henry’s biblical arguments. Luther was very sympathetic to Catherine and felt that their were no grounds to annul the marriage. In 1530, he told Henry that if a male heir was needed, the only option was to live in bigamy (like the biblical patriarchs). Phillip Melanchthon suggested that Henry should legitimize his bigamy by getting a papal dispensation!

However, before we criticize these Protestant suggestions, we need to point out that a desperate pope in September 1531 also suggested to Henry that he quietly take a second wife rather than putting Catherine aside.
 
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Coming from a Protestant upbringing, I can say that a lot of Protestants have pre-existing notions about Christianity, and this affects how they view the faith.

Also, a lack of proper philosophical and theological formation is a contributing factor, as it is often simply not often taught among certain Protestant groups. It is often taught that “faith is all I need;” therefore, the major metaphysical and theological questions are not raised. This is especially true among fundamentalist and evangelical circles.
 
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Walterross said:
if the catholic church is right, why don’t more non-catholic christians become catholic?
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They weren’t called.
Walterross said:
I’ve also wondered about non-catholic christians in overcoming sin. They don’t have the sacrament of reconciliation/confession, so they just confess to one another or to God directly. The catholic church says reconciliation is needed for the forgiveness of sins, so are non-catholic christians unforgiven, even if they believe in their heart that they are forgiven?
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This is my understanding, may be totally wrong. Your sins are forgiven. That’s the Gospel. You will never die, you will live forever.

If you want to live forever in heaven, you must be pure & holy. The sacraments lead to that end.
 
The Church of England happened because one man didn’t get his own way, at the end of the day. Not something I want to be part of
 
I’m a convert. I regret becoming Roman Catholic. If I had to do it over again I would never have joined the Church. I count it as one of the worst mistakes of my life. Catholicism isn’t just a religion. Catholicism is a culture. It’s a culture I’ve grown to dislike. I love Jesus, scripture, and the Eucharist. I do not love the magisterium of the Catholic Church, Canon Law, or the catechism. I now view them as serious impediments to my relationship with Jesus; akin to the Pharisees and their myriad of rules and regulations which thwarted a close relationship with God by the people.

Catholicism as a system and culture is based on the false belief that an elite group (priests) has been given secret knowledge and chosen by God to teach the ignorant masses. It’s close to being gnostic. The Catholic hierarchy does not trust the laity. It views the laity from the point of view of wayward children. As a system, Catholicism thrives on fear and doubts God’s mercy. It does not truly believe in his ability to manage the universe. It wants a definitive answer for every situation, scenario, or event that could happen in a human life. Why else (for example) would ministers sit around and try to determine when a hysterectomy is “licit”, as if this has any bearing on salvation. The answer: It DOES NOT have a bearing on salvation! Salvation is about repentance from sin and acceptance of Christ. The only commandments we are bound to keep are the Ten Commandments. Anything else is superfluous, man made, a burden, and a block between God and his people.

This is about control, power, and ultimately fear. It’s the biggest difference between Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy. Orthodox religious leaders trust in God’s mercy. They suggest what he might want in different scenarios, but never impose. They are silent in areas where scripture is silent. They do not burden the people with unnecessary teachings. There is no obsession with addressing every situation that arises in a human life. They are silent on questions outside the gospel message. This is a fallen world. We don’t have to be perfect. We are called to be faithful. The message of Christ is that he was crucified for our sins, resurrected from the dead, and will return to judge the living and the dead.

The other branches of Christianity have their own flaws. Protestants deny the Eucharist. The Eastern Orthodox are too closely associated with national identity. The Roman Catholic Church, however hits it outside the ballpark with rules and regulations, things that build a wall around God. As stated earlier, it’s the closest to the Pharisees and what Christ condemned in the gospels. It’s not a question of reading or studying Catholicism more in depth or trusting the Holy Spirit. I truly believe the magisterium is in grave error. It’s why I no longer consider myself Catholic. I’m just a Christian.
 
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Hello,

I would say with the perspective of myself shortly after I converted to the Catholic Church. Firstly, many non-Catholic denominations believe that their belief is true; many believe that the Catholic teachings are false and thus, many prevented me from going to Catholic churches and told me that I am believing in false information that is misleaded. However, I became leaded to the Catholic faith and after many days of contemplation and studying about the Catholic ideologies, along with the help of a Catholic organization who explained the Catholic faith with kindness and love.

Many in other denominations- but not all- developed a somewhat strong opposition against my new faith, because since their separation from the Catholic Church, their beliefs are quite different in some cases. They have dedication to the Lord, love the Lord and pray in devotion and love, but I believe that they do not understand the ideologies of the Catholic Church and thus they do not agree with my conversion. I believe their relationship with God is dedicated, but rather the division within the Christian faith has caused much dispute.

Some Protestant denominations still maintain some of what we believe, for example, Lutherans and Anglicans. But there are some denominations who do not retain the belief in the Trinity or about the Virgin Mary, our mother. So there are many differences, and as a result, they might not be able to understand the beliefs that we have as Catholics.

This is just my personal point of view. I just wish that one day, we will be united in one Truth, and love one another like Jesus told us. Because kindness is always the answer to hatred- so I pray every day for those who do not know the Catholic faith, and for the day that we will be able to be united together as brothers and sisters in Christ.

Pax Christi!
 
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Catholicism as a religion that believes in the life, death, resurrection, and Second Coming of Jesus Christ isn’t the problem. Catholicism of canon law and the magisterium of the Catholic Church is the problem. It’s an unbiblical usurpation of scripture and Christ’s authority. Christ left the apostles to teach and preach the gospel, but the magisterium has gone beyond the authority of apostolic secession to control every aspect of the lives of the laity. The power and wealth amassed by the Vatican has had a deleterious effect on the Church. The absolute authority of the magisterium means that the laity is absolutely powerless. The laity has no (name removed by moderator)ut on who serves as a priest, bishop, cardinal, and most importantly Pope. This concentration of power is antithetical to Christ’s message of humble servitude. The Catholic Church is also infected with Scholasticism.
 
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While I disagree with much of your post, I do agree that Catholicism, at least in the U.S. where I live (Midwest) is a “culture.”

My husband and I converted from Evangelical Protestantism, and we love being Catholic and completely believe in the teachings of the Catholic Church. Even before we converted, we were convinced from the Bible that the Catholic Church was right.

But…we do not fit in with Catholic culture, and we miss the fellowship and friendships that we used to have in our Protestant churches over the years (whenever we moved, we had to find a new church).

I currently play piano at a Protestant church (and I also play at several Catholic churches), and I love being there with Protestants–it’s a culture that I fit into and fits me (and my daughter, too, apparently, who is also a Catholic convert, but has stopped attending Mass because after two years of attending, she still had no friends.)

I don’t think Catholics should poo poo or underestimate the incredible importance of “friendship” and “fitting in” and “fellowship.” I think that’s a big reason why Protestants do not convert.

We have tried. Oh, we’ve tried. We’ve had parties and dinners, and invited people out, and joined Bible studies and men’s groups and ladies groups and musical groups–it just doesn’t take. .

When there are threads on CAF about “talking before church or talking after church in the nave,” it makes my heart ache and frankly, upsets me a lot. Like many older Catholic churches, our parish has a tiny little narthex and people rush to get out of it. Seldom does anyone talk to us and when they do, it’s just polite small talk that we would get in any restaurant. Within five minutes after most Masses, the narthex is deserted, and the only people left in the nave are those who are cleaning up the pews, and those who are deep in private prayer.

I think that it’s not meanness or rudeness–I think that when people grow up Catholic, they form bonds in school as students, and continue to form bonds as parents, and then they just have a hard time including others outside of that bond. I get it–none of us have a lot of time, and getting together with people that we don’t know and love is hard. You don’t have to tell us that.

But again, do not underestimate or minimize or ridicule (which I’ve seen on CAF) the importance of “Christian fellowship.” Yes, I’ve seen Catholics on these forums make fun of Protestants for their “fellowship,” and it saddens me greatly and also makes me angry.

We believe all the teachings of the Catholic Church, but we wish it were the Protestant church where we had friends and got together! This is why Christians need to be unified. Catholics could teach Protestants the truth about Christian doctrine, and Protestants could teach Catholics how to have great fellowship.

In case you’re wondering, yes, we still get together with old Protestant friends outside of church.
 
Agreed. This is what I felt about after becoming Catholic. I would love to reconnect with my Protestant friends again and we can learn from their fellowship as well! Christ always calls us to love each other.

May the peace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you, always.
 
I believe in the teachings of Christ. I believe that Jesus Christ was born, died, was resurrected, and will return to judge the living and the dead. I believe ALL authority has been given unto him to forgive sins and bestow eternal life. I DO NOT believe the authority currently manifested by the magisterium of the Roman Catholic Church was given by Christ through his apostles. It’s a man made system concerned with power, control, and worldly gain. This concern with wealth and power is the root of the sex abuse crisis. Mandatory celibacy weeded out over the centuries wonderful men from the priesthood. Why? The reason is because the hierarchy did not want to care for families and possibly lose land and wealth. The priesthood has now become a haven for every unclean demon masquerading as a priest. When the house of cards finally topples the laity will be devastated to discover that the roots of the crisis were laid in the distant past when wealth usurped scripture.

*I’ve decided to begin visiting other denominations for spiritual nourishment. I’ll continue to attend Mass because I do believe in the Eucharist, however I’m no longer confining myself to Catholicism with a capital C.
 
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I think the root of the sex abuse crisis is the powerful lustful desires that many men (and some women) in and out of the church (Protestant and Catholic) struggle with.

Certain people are in a position to be able to give in to that lust (e.g., people who conduct business in private offices or buildings, people who are in positions where they hold power over others, people who work with children/teens, etc.).

I think that many priests struggled with their desires and eventually gave in and then found ways to justify their sin (and probably many didn’t try to justify their sin, but just lived with the knowledge that they were sinning mortally and hoped that somehow, the Lord would have mercy on them).

I think sexual sins are especially difficult to overcome and that all those who are casting stones at the priests should beware lest they too, are caught up in their own sexual sin. Yes, priests who have committed acts against innocents need to be charged with a crime and brought to justice. But we who are supposedly pure should be watchful of our own desires.

I think it’s obvious from the Bible that there WAS a hierarchy that Christ Himself established on this earth. It’s also obvious from watching the Protestants split over and over again that independent preachers and teachers cannot keep the Church unified.
 
Did you know that there is actually a papal document condemning any musical instrument in the Mass, except the organ? Another example of the magisterium abusing its authority; basically promoting ethnocentrism under the guise of an official Church teaching. The sole use of the organ in Mass would completely eliminate many cultures around the world from worshipping God through music, maintaining European dominance over the liturgy.

"Pope St. Pius X wrote in an official Church document (1903): “The employment of the piano is forbidden in church, as is also that of noisy or frivolous instruments such as drums, cymbals, bells and the like.”
 
The Lollards, a pre-Reformation group in England during the 1300s condemned celibacy in one of their Twelve Conclusions. They also condemned the acquisition of wealth by the Catholic Church in England.

“The first conclusion asserts that the English Church has become too involved in affairs of temporal power, led by the bad example of the Church of Rome.”

“The third conclusion asserts that the practice of clerical celibacy has encouraged sodomy among the clergy.”
 
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The focus on ethnic identity is a huge barrier to evangelization by the Eastern Orthodox Church. No matter what you do you’ll never be Greek, Russian, Armenian, etc. A friend who is Greek Orthodox told me this is an increasingly recognized problem. I still love the Orthodox and believe their faith is probably the closest you’ll find to the early Church. Personally, I think it’s the will of God that the three branches remain divided, until such time as all the gifts of the Holy Spirit are perfected in each and we become one body.
 
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