Why don't people believe Catholics are intelligent enough to understand our beliefs?

[Dreamer]

Alot of Catholics know they are Catholic but do not read or study it religiously. You average Catholic attends Church every Sunday and tries to adhere to the Word of God to the best of their ability. This is why when they are questioned, they have a dumbfounded look on their face. Some of us are here to spread the word and others help us keep our church full. We all do spread the word in our daily actions, the other groups need to listen better for what we know in body language makes up for in our words. People are afraid to discuss Religion openly for the fear of being wrong and who knows maybe other people will look at you differently. My opinion. Great Day

 

[mayra_hart]

to carol marie : hi iam a catholic an iam glad you fill this way an that you are nice to catholics when you ask them questions. but my experience was so a bad one this person use to be my friend, she is my neighbor an because a bible study i was question by her in concern with my faith, she was very directed an in somepoints she even laugh. at the time this happen i didn’t have the right answers so i went an refresh myself in a lots of topics the next time i was the one given the mortal wound an finally i stopped going to the bible studies an our friendship is not the same. that make me sad but i have to defend myself as a catholic an things that she said about the virgin an the eucharistic really got into me. i think this just depend on the person. well god bless

 

[RobedWithLight]

Cat:

I hope this doesn’t sound rude.

I meet Catholics all the time who don’t know where any of the books of the Bible are.

I agree.

While I don’t intend to sound judgmental, here in the Philippines(83% Catholic), in one afternoon television program I saw, one contestant was asked what is the first book in the Bible. to my disappointment, she didn’t know the answer. Two other contestants were likewise asked and none knew what the answer was, which was Genesis. We can reasonably assume they were Catholics, since Protestants to their credit, seriously study their bibles.

To be blunt, this isn’t the first time I saw Catholics who didn’t know what they supposedly believe. Perhaps these embarrassing instances are the result of poor catechesis.

Gerry

 

[Riley259]

There are unfortunately alot of “marginal” catholics who are poorly catechised and truly don’t understand the nuances of their faith. Obviously, most of the people who respond on this forum know their faith well and have a real love for their faith. So noncatholics with an axe to grind exploit the uninformed masses by trying to point out “errors” or areas of the faith they might not have a good grasp on. This is probably why there are alot of ex-catholics who are now evangelical protestants and jehovah witnesses. Of course, those who truly understand their faith can usually easily counter any of the worn-out charges evangelicals and the like throw at them.

 

[La_Chiara]

Riley259:

There are unfortunately alot of “marginal” catholics who are poorly catechised and truly don’t understand the nuances of their faith. Obviously, most of the people who respond on this forum know their faith well and have a real love for their faith. So noncatholics with an axe to grind exploit the uninformed masses by trying to point out “errors” or areas of the faith they might not have a good grasp on. This is probably why there are alot of ex-catholics who are now evangelical protestants and jehovah witnesses. Of course, those who truly understand their faith can usually easily counter any of the worn-out charges evangelicals and the like throw at them.

Well, maybe not “easily counter” the worn-out charges. Even those who know their faith well need to also understand how our faith differs from the other faiths to truly be able to counter those charges. It isn’t easy and we are up against people who are aggressive proselytizers (often wolfs in sheep’s clothing).

 

[Andyman1517]

It’s not that non-Catholics don’t believe that Catholics are intelligent. Most people find some of you beliefs baffling. Typically most Catholics were born into the church and many know little about their beliefs and how they came about. As a result, they have a difficult time articulating and explaining the faith which is where this forum comes in.

In Christ,

Andy

 

[Steve_M]

Andyman1517:

It’s not that non-Catholics don’t believe that Catholics are intelligent. Most people find some of you beliefs baffling. Typically most Catholics were born into the church and many know little about their beliefs and how they came about. As a result, they have a difficult time articulating and explaining the faith which is where this forum comes in.

In Christ,

Andy

The same can be said about Protestants. Until a few months ago, I had spent my entire life in Southern Baptist churches. I was always shocked how many people didn’t know what they believed at all. When I began studying Catholicism, I talked to a priest and read on my own. My Catholic friends were not much help at all. The people on this type of fourm are a lot more informed about their beliefs, both Catholic and non-Catholic, than the average person you’ll find at any church.

 

[Christy_Beth]

That’s one thing that I’ve noticed about the difference between the protestant churches I know and the catholic church. In protestant churches, you have sunday school AND sunday services. We only have the sunday service (i.e. Mass) in the catholic church. Yes, there is the occasional bible study. But the ones at my church I found to be totally inadequate.

 

[Andyman1517]

Interestingly enough, on national polls Catholics do tend to have a better grasp of theology than Protestants. What kind of theology are we talking about? Unfortunately the poll didn’t say.

 

[MariaG]

It’s not that non-Catholics don’t believe that Catholics are intelligent. Most people find some of you beliefs baffling. Typically most Catholics were born into the church and many know little about their beliefs and how they came about. As a result, they have a difficult time articulating and explaining the faith which is where this forum comes in.

And I respect that it can be confusing. What I don’t understand is the people who Say Catholics believe… We respond and say no you have misunderstood, this is what we believe. They say, no you are the one that doesn’t understand, Augustine is saying …the pope said… and procede to give us their interpretation of Catholic teachings. When I have refered them to Catholic apologists who have taken the words of people like Augustine and put it everyday language, they say, Catholic apologists misrepresent the teachings of church scholars. These people choose to believe they have a better understanding than catholics do. They think that they, who are not Catholic, or who have left the Catholic church can interpret and tell Catholics what the Church scholars “really” mean better than a Catholic apologist.
Your sister in Christ,
Maria

 

[Peace-bwu]

In the case of my Mother in law, she thinks we are all being lied to and, to put it in her words when my husband said he was going to become Catholic… “Once they get their claws in you, they won’t let go” She seems to think I am a good Christian because I don’t know or follow my religion. Nothing we say can convince her that we dont’ worship Mary or consider the pope like God, or worship statues etc. etc. etc. She acts like its all some big conspiracy of the whore of Babylon, to not allow laypeople to know anything about the church dogma.

 

[bkisia]

Cat:

I hope this doesn’t sound rude.

I meet Catholics all the time who don’t know where any of the books of the Bible are.

I realize that many of them know Bible verses and prayers by heart and that’s the important thing.

But believe me, I’m a little skeptical of their intelligence when I see them searching for Jeremiah. Or Jude. Sometimes they are not even sure whether these books are in the Old or New Testament.

It doesn’t make a good impression at all, no, siree, especially on Protestants who memorize these books of the Bible usually around third grade and remember them forever. (They may or may not ever read the books! But they know where they are!)

My suggestion is, swallow pride, stop making excuses, sit down with the Bible, and MEMORIZE those books of the Bible! Do it with a friend–have a Bible Book Memorizing Party, and when you are all finished and you can throw books of the Bible around like footballs, then celebrate!

Know them not only forwards, but backwards as well. It’s so easy and will make everyone think you are intelligent!

Don’t give anyone a reason to think you are stupid. This is such a simple thing to do.

 

[bkisia]

I agree with Cat. I am writing from Kenya and a great many Kenyan Catholic Christians do not know why they believe what they believe. Many were born into their faith, a number have taken their faith superstitiously doing all sorts of penances that really are more a sign of pride and giving the faith a bad name among people. Many Kenyan Catholic Christians do not know their bible. I was a born a protestant and managed to get a bit of my bible knowledge from this before I came to be Catholic. But quite a number of Catholic Christians that I know don’t know their bible.

 

[bkisia]

I agree with Cat in a way. Although it is true that the Catholic Christianity accepts both Scripture and Holy Tradition as the source of truth, especially in regard to our salvation. We need to give the Scripture part of the this source of truth its rightful place. It is important for Catholic Christians to realise that the Holy Scripture is the ONLY inspired word of God and we need to read frequently (daily in fact) because it is God’s gift to mankind and his Church.

Although the bible became more widely available after printing came about, people were still able to read it wherever it was. As politely as I can, I would ask my kith and kin - my Catholic Christian brothers and sisters - not to give excuses for not knowing God’s word yet their church is the custodian of the same.

I think it is true that many Catholics do not know why they believe what they believe. It is now becoming common for various public figures to use the ‘Immaculate Conception’ in reference to the incarnation of Jesus Christ. Catholics don’t seem to know that the two have no relationship to each other. There are many other examples of this ‘ignorance’. Although our faith is based on our Church’s traditions, the bible is an important part of that tradition, a very important part in fact and needs to be read.

Catholic Christianity is a great gift from God and it is amazing that we generally take this foregranted. Catholic Christianity is rich in her history and we also take this foregranted. The bible is a part of this history and tradition. Reading and understanding the bible makes the understanding of our Catholic Christian faith; it makes us realise how small we are and how good God is.

If you don’t read the bible, even with the Church’s traditions at your finger tips, you will not have all the appropriate weapons to gain your salvation. You may get saved, but the journey will have taken much longer and will be tougher.

Please note, the Church says that both Tradition and Scripture, and not just Tradition. When we take the point that Tradition is the only relevant source, then there is no difference between us and those who left the Catholic Church with Bishop Lefebevre in 1988. Both are important.

 

[Cat]

I didn’t say anything in my post about reading the Bible. That would be great and the Catechism teaches that it is important for Catholics to read the Bible and meditate on it.

I just said “Memorize the books of the Bible.”

So it’s all for show, not really very important.

Do it anyway. If you can memorize the Nicene Creed and all the other prayers and responses that Catholics use, you can memorize the Books of the Bible in order! It’s easy, easy!

(Note: Since becoming Catholic, I am working on memorizing as many prayers as I can. I love them! I especially love the Divine Praises and the Te Deum. I am currently working on the Memorare, and also the St. Gertrude prayer for the Poor Souls, and also the Veni Creator. I hope to eventually memorize all the prayers in my two little prayer books. They are very comforting and come to my mind throughout the day.)

And if it will help negate the accusation of ignorance, then why not do it? It’s such an easy way to impress people with your knowledge. YES, it’s just a show! Yes, it means nothing! But it means everything–remember I was a Protestant for over 40 years–to Protestants, especially evangelical and fundamental Protestants. If you don’t know the Books of the Bible, they won’t care what you know about what’s IN the Books. They will assume that you never read the Bible and that you are just spouting off Catholic propaganda. Am I right, here? Haven’t you been accused of this yet?

You would give alms to the poor, wouldn’t you? You would willingly serve in a soup kitchen, or help usher, or even go to a short term mission project to help build an orphanage or a school. Then do this simple thing and offer it for those who would criticize the intellect of the Catholics. Help them to trust you. Give them a bone. It’s not asking that much!

 

[dream_wanderer]

If I could memorize the books of the Bible…anyone can. Divide them up in the books of Moses, the historical books, the Poetical Books and the Prophets…Gospels…epistles etc and learn them by sections if you like. There are various ways it can be done…

Its not all that hard and yes…it could come in handy.

dream wanderer

 

[mercygate]

Cat:

If you can memorize the Nicene Creed and all the other prayers and responses that Catholics use, you can memorize the Books of the Bible in order! It’s easy, easy!

Whew! What a relief, Cat! I thought you meant, “memorize whole books of the Bible” as in:

EZEKIEL: Chapter 1. “In the thirtieth year, in the fourth month, on the fifth day of the month, as I was among the exiles by the river Chebar, the heavens were opened, and I saw visions of God. On the fifth day of the month (it was the fifth year of the exile of King Jehoi’achin), the word of the LORD came to Ezekiel the priest, the son of Buzi, in the land of the Chalde’ans by the river Chebar; and the hand of the LORD was upon him there. . . .”

Not that memorizing books of the Bible is a bad idea. I’m working on Psalms, myself.

As for ignorance and presumed ignorance, look at the following from another thread:

It [Latin] was used by the corrupt Church centuries ago to keep people from actually reading the bible, as these people didn’t understand Latin, and so it was a privelege (sic) only the clergy could hold. Eventually the people got mad about this because they were being deceived and the bible was translated.

---

The facts about the corrupt church and translating the bible came from my world history and geo book.

 

[Fiat]

MariaG:

Thanks for starting this thread. It raises a good question. It seems to me that the more you love something, the more you want to get to know it; the more you want to talk about it; the more you want to share it with others. When Protestants ask Catholics about their faith and Catholics aren’t able to answer their questions, the Protestant assumes, either fairly or not, that this “Catholic” is someone who doesn’t really love his faith, but is just going through the motions.

By God’s awesome grace I was received into the Catholic Church a few years ago in spite of some radical disapproval from some of my Protestant friends and family. My father’s chief complaint about Catholics was (and continues to be) that in all of his 61 years of life, not once had a Catholic ever invited him to mass; not once had a Catholic ever shared their Catholic faith with him; not once had a Catholic ever inquired about my father’s soul.

We need more people like you, Maria. Those who are so in love with God, Jesus, Mary, the Church, etc., that we radiate that message to all those around us. It’s disturbing to me that there aren’t more Catholics on fire for their faith.

Fiat

 

[spauline]

Dear MariaG,

I will try to respond as charitably to your post as I can, but I am angered by it. Are you even supposing that most US Catholics are good Catholics who know their faith well and practice it?

I have seen statistics that show that Catholics in this country believe more or less in the same percentage brackets as the rest of the country on all the controversial moral issues that the Church condemns. Why is that? Well, any knowledgeable and faithful Catholic (who is RARE in this country) knows why. Specifically, following what was otherwise a good council, Vatican II, liberals infiltrated the Church with gross misunderstandings and misinterpretations of it, and took positions to teach their severely misguided ideas in the Catechesis and seminaries. Consequently, the Catholic Church in the West now has a good TWO GENERATIONS of priests and laity who have been taught nothing but the liberal, spineless, water-downed fluff of Modernism. This is what the priests were taught, and it is what the laity have been catechized in, and it is what the faithful get, in general, at Mass on Sunday. Hence, the vast majority of both the faithful and laity in the West are CLUELESS about the meaning of life and of their religion. The extent of their doctrine is simply nothing but gumby, happy-happy-gerbil, smiley facie principles of “peace and love” and “sharing and caring.” And this is what they will be taught if they go to a Catholic elementary school, high school, or university. Therefore, sending your children to such places for education will only serve to destroy what little faith they have, unless you prepare them with ammunition and knowledge of TRUE Catholic doctrine. There is only a remnant minority of Catholic institutions in the country that teach the true Catholic faith, unadulterated by liberalism.

Now, I’m not saying that I can fully blame US Catholics for their ignorance because they have never been taught otherwise. However, it stands that the Church defines as dogma that a NORMAL adult person cannot live for an extended period of time before they begin to ask certain questions about the meaning of their existence. Therefore, even though the majority of Catholics in this country have been done a great disservice in their education, it doesn’t excuse them from earnestly searching for the meaning of life.
And, yet, as it stands, if some of them do come around and have a conversion, many times they will be angered by this disservice, that all their life as a Catholic, they were never warned about Hell or taught basic core doctrines that would lead them to a devout life. Consequently, they end up rebelling against the Church and joining some Fundamentalist Church that preaches a hard core message about conversion and salvation. I think the only thing that can bring them back is the grace of God to open their eyes and see that true Catholicism is not watered-down, mushy, liberal fluff, but that it is a deep and profound religion that can give them the fullness of the relationship that God wishes to have with them.

However, this problem is not so bad in other regions of the world. In Africa, the Church is growing tremendously, and it is right-on orthodox there. Also, in the former Communist nations of the East, the faith is also quite solid because the people have had to suffer, although the good faithful are a remnant there as here, for the communists all but eradicated the faith in many of these countries.

GB,

Scott

 

[losav]

RobedWithLight:

I agree.

While I don’t intend to sound judgmental, here in the Philippines(83% Catholic), in one afternoon television program I saw, one contestant was asked what is the first book in the Bible. to my disappointment, she didn’t know the answer. Two other contestants were likewise asked and none knew what the answer was, which was Genesis. We can reasonably assume they were Catholics, since Protestants to their credit, seriously study their bibles.

To be blunt, this isn’t the first time I saw Catholics who didn’t know what they supposedly believe. Perhaps these embarrassing instances are the result of poor catechesis.

Gerry

I was a Catholic Catechist in the Philippines… I would challenge any knowledgable catholics “Have we done anything?”