Why don't we have sunday school?

  • Thread starter Thread starter SAVINGRACE
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
S

SAVINGRACE

Guest
Is there a reason for this tradition? Who started it? Have Catholics ever had Sunday School? Would it be appropriate for Catholic children to attend Sunday School whilst their parents attend Mass? If not, why not?

My personal view is that the little ones 3-7 don’t much understand the sermon and get bored and get grumpy and cry from sitting in one place for too long. I do understand that the Eucharist is vital. Just wondering if there is any way of striking a balance.
 
I think no Sunday School is nice. From personal experience I know that many churches completely ignore you if you don’t join Sunday School. The preaching is for the ‘unsaved’ and Sunday School is for members. But I have sat thru many a Sunday School class which was taught by someone who was in no way suitable to teach others. And as I said, if you quit going to Sunday School you are snubbed. Baptists in particular seem to do this. Plus, the little ones are learning a valuable lesson in social skills by being with the adults during the service - and maybe they are absorbing more than you think! All this is just my humble opinion though. 😃
 
Is there a reason for this tradition? Who started it? Have Catholics ever had Sunday School? Would it be appropriate for Catholic children to attend Sunday School whilst their parents attend Mass? If not, why not?
Without getting into whether or not it is a good idea…

…some parishes DO have Sunday school.

In general this is for preschool age children. Some parishes have their religious education programs for all ages on Sunday. In any case, Sunday school does not relieve those who have reached the age of reason (generally defined as those who have reached the age of seven) from attending Mass.
 
Is there a reason for this tradition? Who started it? Have Catholics ever had Sunday School? Would it be appropriate for Catholic children to attend Sunday School whilst their parents attend Mass? If not, why not?

My personal view is that the little ones 3-7 don’t much understand the sermon and get bored and get grumpy and cry from sitting in one place for too long. I do understand that the Eucharist is vital. Just wondering if there is any way of striking a balance.
The Mas is the source and summit of our faith. To steer children away from it disturbs me. I wonder what sort of message the children are getting if parents tell them that Mass is important while sending them out?
children sometimes do misbehave. this is an opportunity to help them learn to behave, even when they would rather do otherwise. I remember beig taken out of church by my parents, settled, and then returned to mass. The message I took from this was that Mass was too important for any of us to be away from, or to be disruptive while attending.
Sunday School teachers may be well intentioned, but they are not required in my parish to have degrees in theology or to have signed agreement to be faithful to the Magisterium in all of their teaching.
I do not recall my parents keeping my youngest siblings at home while going to different masses, but my mom recently affirmed that they did do so on occasion, so that each might have an opportunity to focus completely on the mass, while the other took care of parenting/escorting to Mass responsibilities. Might this be a good middle ground for you?
May God bless you and your children. Amen.
 
Sunday School is usually held before main service, and it’s for all ages, from nursery up to seniors. We have Bible study from workbooks, discussion, prayer, and fellowship.

Sunday School teacher are usually elders or deacons, or women of strong, visible faith.

During church, some (not all) churches offer Children’s Church, where the littles from about age 4 and up gather to sing fun Christian songs, practice Bible trivia and other Christian themed games and activities, and watch a video once a month. (at least, this is how our church does it)

Kids are also welcome in the sanctuary during main service, if they/parents prefer.

Nursery is open for ages birth to 3 or so, usually, and it’s available for Sunday School and main service.

But not all churches are run the same, so ymmv.
 
The Mas is the source and summit of our faith. To steer children away from it disturbs me. I wonder what sort of message the children are getting if parents tell them that Mass is important while sending them out?
children sometimes do misbehave. this is an opportunity to help them learn to behave, even when they would rather do otherwise. I remember beig taken out of church by my parents, settled, and then returned to mass. The message I took from this was that Mass was too important for any of us to be away from, or to be disruptive while attending.
Sunday School teachers may be well intentioned, but they are not required in my parish to have degrees in theology or to have signed agreement to be faithful to the Magisterium in all of their teaching.
I do not recall my parents keeping my youngest siblings at home while going to different masses, but my mom recently affirmed that they did do so on occasion, so that each might have an opportunity to focus completely on the mass, while the other took care of parenting/escorting to Mass responsibilities. Might this be a good middle ground for you?
May God bless you and your children. Amen.
 
No doubt Holy Mass is the summit/source of our faith I quite agree to keep children out of it would be not good…however…in our Parish, after the proclaimation of the Gospel the younger children approach to foot of the Altar for a Blessing and then retreat to the Parish Center for study of the readings/Gospel…I personally don’t like the word ‘Sunday School’…but then again I admittedly have some difficutly with being ecumenical ergo I hve some difficulty with term…after the homily the children return to Mass and rejoin their families for the liturgy of the Eucharist etc…it’s pretty good…while we’re on the subject…I don’t know why we have ‘cry rooms’…in my very humble opinion what I see is parents turning it into a play room…we had 4 children…and we talked to them about what was taking place during Mass…we didn’t bring Tonka toys to Mass either…I didn’t expect my youngest to be stoic…but we insisted they remain quiet…and as still as possible…what’s really needed is some old fashioned Catechism…and lectures on the importance of not talking in church before - during or after…can I get an amen…
 
Is there a reason for this tradition? Who started it? Have Catholics ever had Sunday School? Would it be appropriate for Catholic children to attend Sunday School whilst their parents attend Mass? If not, why not?

My personal view is that the little ones 3-7 don’t much understand the sermon and get bored and get grumpy and cry from sitting in one place for too long. I do understand that the Eucharist is vital. Just wondering if there is any way of striking a balance.
First of all, Catholics have CCD (“Confraternity for Christian Doctrine” a/k/a Religious Education).

Children attend CCD from Kindergarten through 8th grade (or perhaps 10th grade for those dioceses that postpone confirmation to 16 years old).

Children need to learn to participate in Mass. And that from the earliest age. I see plenty of parents who have little problem maintaining order as they train their children. Sadly, they are in the minority, but they do exist.

And, frankly, at a TLM parish that I go to frequently (and would go to more if gasoline wasn’t $4 a gallon :(), well behaved children are the norm.

I can only speak for my experience when my daughter was young: she quickly learned that receiving a lightly applied “Vulcan Death Grip” was far less desirable than simply paying attention. And if she didn’t get the message with a lightly applied grip, the grip got firmer. No cheerios. No comic books. She paid attention. Of course, we made sure that she learned the prayers of the Mass from a young age. And we talked about what was going on and discussed the readings and all that, so it wasn’t just a boring 45 minutes - 1 hour that interrupted an otherwise fun-filled weekend.

In my experience, the majority of the ill-behaved children are ones whose parents try to keep them distracted with food, drink, or toys, rather than try to teach them. They get bored with the distractions and demand attention.
 
Many Protestant churches have a nice practice of having children there for the beginning of the service, giving them a mini kiddie sermon, the sending them off to their respective, age appropriate classes.

Mom and Dad stay for the (sometimes long and tedious) sermon.

I always thought that a practical setup.
 
I can only speak for my experience when my daughter was young: she quickly learned that receiving a lightly applied “Vulcan Death Grip” was far less desirable than simply paying attention. .
My dad judiciously applied the Invisible to Other Parishioners So My Children Appear Perfect Knee Grip at the slightest fidget.
 
My dad judiciously applied the Invisible to Other Parishioners So My Children Appear Perfect Knee Grip at the slightest fidget.
Funny thing, too. I never, ever had to apply that technique (the “death grip”) after age 6. And rarely after age 5.
 
Many Protestant churches have a nice practice of having children there for the beginning of the service, giving them a mini kiddie sermon, the sending them off to their respective, age appropriate classes.

Mom and Dad stay for the (sometimes long and tedious) sermon.

I always thought that a practical setup.
The problem I’ve seen with that set up is that the same people eneed up running the sunday school and never getting to attend the service. It is used as a baby sitter and the parents happily hand their kids over but don’t step up to do their part.
 
Sunday School is usually held before main service, and it’s for all ages, from nursery up to seniors. We have Bible study from workbooks, discussion, prayer, and fellowship.

Sunday School teacher are usually elders or deacons, or women of strong, visible faith.

During church, some (not all) churches offer Children’s Church, where the littles from about age 4 and up gather to sing fun Christian songs, practice Bible trivia and other Christian themed games and activities, and watch a video once a month. (at least, this is how our church does it)

Kids are also welcome in the sanctuary during main service, if they/parents prefer.

Nursery is open for ages birth to 3 or so, usually, and it’s available for Sunday School and main service.

But not all churches are run the same, so ymmv.
This is the way many Protestant churches do Sunday school. It’s not held at the same time as the worship service,but at at different time, and it’s for everyone, not just the children.

Children’s Church, if it is held, is done during the worship service. What Catholics need to keep in mind is that in the Protestant worship service, the main event in the service is the “message” or “the sermon.” The choir number/solos are also important, as they support what is said in the sermon.

In other words, the preaching of the word in speech and song is what it important, and even though some young children can sit quietly through these, most find it difficult to sit perfectly still and quiet through several choir numbers/special numbers, and then through a long sermon (minimum time is 30 minutes, but many pastors will speak for 45 minutes or more). These special numbers and the sermon are geared towards ADULTS, not children. The children get nothing out of it.

There is no reason for young children to attend a worship service, since there is no obligation. A children’s church allows them to experience worship at their age and development level, and it gives parents an opportunity to sit and LISTEN to the music and the sermon without having to take care of their little ones.

This is very different than the Catholic Mass, in which the “main event” is receiving Jesus Christ, Truly Present in Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity, in the Holy Communion.

The way I see it this: in a Protestant worship service, men and women talk about Jesus. In the Catholic Mass, Jesus Himself is present. We would never keep our children away from Jesus, Truly Present. But why should little children have to sit still for an hour and a half or longer while other people sing and talk?

I hope this makes sense.
 
Yes, there are pitfalls.

I always found it so distracting to watch over my children at church. I longed for a little peace.
 
First of all, Catholics have CCD (“Confraternity for Christian Doctrine” a/k/a Religious Education).

Children attend CCD from Kindergarten through 8th grade (or perhaps 10th grade for those dioceses that postpone confirmation to 16 years old).

Children need to learn to participate in Mass. And that from the earliest age. I see plenty of parents who have little problem maintaining order as they train their children. Sadly, they are in the minority, but they do exist.

And, frankly, at a TLM parish that I go to frequently (and would go to more if gasoline wasn’t $4 a gallon :(), well behaved children are the norm.

I can only speak for my experience when my daughter was young: she quickly learned that receiving a lightly applied “Vulcan Death Grip” was far less desirable than simply paying attention. And if she didn’t get the message with a lightly applied grip, the grip got firmer. No cheerios. No comic books. She paid attention. Of course, we made sure that she learned the prayers of the Mass from a young age. And we talked about what was going on and discussed the readings and all that, so it wasn’t just a boring 45 minutes - 1 hour that interrupted an otherwise fun-filled weekend.

In my experience, the majority of the ill-behaved children are ones whose parents try to keep them distracted with food, drink, or toys, rather than try to teach them. They get bored with the distractions and demand attention.
There are certain children who would only get more determined if they are given the “Vulcan Death Grip.” They relish the challenge! The parents who have these kinds of children understand what I’m talking about. 😉

Children are children. They have children’s minds and bodies, and that’s the way God made them. Even though Jesus is present at the Mass, most normal children still get bored and frustrated with a liturgy that is, for the most part, designed for older children, teenagers, and adults. Their behavior is not “ill-behavior.” The wiggling, whispering, running around, jerky movements, desire to play with a toy, hunger, thirst, bathroom needs, whining, and sniffling/crying is NOT “ill-behavior” if the child is three or under, or sometimes, older, if the child’s body and/or mind has not matured yet. This is what normal children DO. It’s normal and it shouldn’t be punished with a “Vulcan Death Grip.”

Now if the child in question is much older and has shown himself or herself capable of sitting still during movies, television, video games, etc., then a disciplinary action, perhaps a painful one, IS appropriate. But not for little ones.

There are some children who, at an amazingly young age, are able to control their childish impulses and sit still and quiet during adult activities, and chances are good that this is their natural bent and would happen even if the parents didn’t reinforce this ability.

There are other children who are NOT able to control childish impulses and sit still and quiet, even during children’s activities, let alone a long (to them) adult activity.

BOTH of these kinds of children are GOOD children. The one who cannot control his/her impulses is NOT “ill-behaved”. More importantly, both of these kinds of children should be welcome with filial love at the Holy Mass. They are our brothers and sisters in Christ.

From what I’ve seen of the Latin Mass, there are just as many “lively” children as there at an OF Mass.

And we need to keep in mind that Holy Mother Church, in her wisdom, has made it clear that little ones age 7 and under are NOT obligated to attend Mass. Holy Mother Church truly understands that children are children, and for some children, being forced to sit through an entire Mass only incites rebellion. Again, parents with these children know what I’m talking about. There is no sin if parents choose to “ease” their young children into Mass attendance by bringing them for only a few minutes at first, and gradually increasing the time. I agree that at all stages of their development, they should be TAUGHT what is happening in the Mass so that they understand what is going on and that Jesus is Truly Present.
 
Our parish offers “Sunday school” for pre-school age children. We also have PSR which many of us used to call CCD which is held away from Mass on various nights for children in grades 1-8. Then we have our youth groups for high school aged kids. The purpose of these groups are to prepare for sacraments and provide Catholic education regarding the CCC. All of these groups meet so that the family can still attend Mass together. Our adults have a variety of ways to meet with other adults for faith formation and volunteer activities also. While we don’t have Sunday school we accomplish the same goals in other ways.
 
Before i returned to the Church, I went to a Protestant church where they had a nursery. I forget where the older childern were, but the service was mainly for adults.

I read something which suggested that the transition from a fun environment where the children could play to an environment where children were expected to sit still, etc, was more difficult than teaching them from the beginning that there was a time for God during which we sat still and paid attention.

I immediately started bringing my children to the service!

When I returned to the Church, it seemed to me to be even more important to bring the children to Mass, for several reasons. One is that God designed and created humans as a social being. We work better connected to others, in opposition to the view of rugged individualism. And our highest act is worship, and so worshipping together is most important. This is something children need to be involved in as members of their immediate society the family, and as members of the wider society. Why would we deprive children of the Presence of our Lord? And why would we deprive Our Lord of the prayers and worship of the children He has both asked us to have the Faith of and whom He enjoined us to suffer and allow to approach Him.
 
I always assumed CCD was our “Sunday school.” What’s the difference between Sunday School and CCD?

Our parish sometimes has adult education between our two Sunday Masses, which is when CCD classes are held.

Sometimes my wife and I refer to CCD as Sunday school if we’re talking to non-Catholics. Most people around us are Protestant, and if we say CCD they have no idea what we’re talking about, then we end up in a long explanation that boils down to, “It’s like Sunday school.”
 
Way back in the 50’s when I was growing up, not as many people brought their very young children to Mass. The parents attended separately until they were around age 5 or so. We had a “cry room” for infants, but it wasn’t used too much. It was soundproofed and noisy.

I went to Catholic school until 7th grade, and when I started public school, I went to CCD on Sundays until I graduated high school. We went to Mass, then CCD. That was our Sunday School.

In my parish all PSR classes except high school are on Sunday mornings, and the children attend Mass either before or after. The high schoolers attend on Sunday night–they have a Mass, then their youth ministry classes.

I have an old Baltimore Catechism from the early part of the 20th century that was my Grandfather’s. Dated at 1901. In it, under the examination of conscience, the question is asked on the lines of “Have I been faithful in attending Sunday School?” Since this is a Catechism that was used nationally, I can only conclude that the common term for Catholic religious education at that time was “Sunday School”, and it was held on Sundays. I don’t know when that changed.

So the answer is that many of us did attend “Sunday School” and any of our parishes still have it on Sundays. And we even called it “Sunday School”.
 
Is there a reason for this tradition? Who started it? Have Catholics ever had Sunday School?
What makes you believe that Catholics do not have religious education?
Would it be appropriate for Catholic children to attend Sunday School whilst their parents attend Mass? If not, why not?
Children who have reached the age of reason are obligated to attend Mass.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top