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Timi_Celcer
Guest
I mean, the devil knew/know God is almighty, but he is still against him. Why did he rebell against God in the first place? Doesn’t he know he can’t win?
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sousley
Guest
I can’t reference this as I have no idea where I heard it (so expansion from someone would be great).
Christians are to be intimately joined to Christ as a family (bridegroom-bride). Satan considered it an insult that he would have to be subject to a human creation (saints). His pride wouldn’t allow it, so he rebelled against God’s plan. On an aside, that’s why demons won’t blaspheme the Blessed Mother’s name during exorcisms (yet another one I can’t reference). God’s grace protected her from all his effects so let’s just say he doesn’t like her very much.
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livingwordunity
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Satan rebelled because of the pride he had in being the first created angel. He refused to serve after it was revealed to him God’s plan for the Incarnation. Because Satan thinks of himself as being so much better than mortal humans he refused to serve God who was to take on flesh and become one of us.
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livingwordunity
Guest
And for this reason of pride, it follows that Satan likely has even more disdain for the Blessed Virgin Mary than he does for Jesus since Our Lady, not being God, is one of God’s humble creatures but has been exalted by God to being Queen of Heaven and Queen of all Angels, the second highest position in Heaven. This explains why Satan is described in Rev. 12 as being so angry with her.
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Nicea325
Guest
Because God gave free-will to each and every single angel in all the nine choirs. Free-will allows us to know and grow in love for God. God did not create robots where God would control us. God’s love is immense and human words simply cannot describe His infinite love.
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Techno2000
Guest
He was jealous of God’s glory and wanted this glory for himself.
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Robertanthony
Guest
only one thing makes sense: if Satan had seen what his rebellion was going to cost him, I’m sure he would have thought twice about rebelling. Same for Adam and Eve. Or maybe he wanted what he wanted and was blind to the consequence, or had underestimated God’s power (he must not have seen God in the fullness of his glory, aka beatific vision, because it dissolves your free-will). Nothing is definitive in demonology, knowing the exact circumstances of Lucifer’s fall has no bearing on our salvation. As for why: self-love, self-interest, selfishness, coveting someone else’s position/prestige/power etc.
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Timothysis
Guest
May I ask, from where does this information come?
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livingwordunity
Guest
I thought I had read in the Catechism that Satan was the first created angel. But now that I look again, it looks like I remembered it inaccurately. It actually says, “The Church teaches that Satan was at first a good angel, made by God” (CCC391) The other parts of what I said I mostly got from the private revelation of Ven. Mary of Agreda’s “Mystical City of God” writings. Although it comes from private revelation which Catholics aren’t required to accept, to me it makes perfect sense in light of the public revelation. But I apologize that I didn’t qualify it as being mostly from private revelation.
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Bible_Reader
Guest
If you are interested in the possible motivations for the rebellion against God, I can recommend to you a famous English poem called Paradise Lost by John Milton. The poem can be quite difficult, so I suggest finding a version with good annotation (there are many available.) The poem is widely considered to be one of the masterpieces of English literature.
It may interest you that Haydock cites Paradise Lost in his commentary.
It may interest you that Haydock cites Paradise Lost in his commentary.
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Fidelis
Guest
Others have pretty much explained the reason Satan rebelled in the first place. But why does he keep rebelling against God knowing he can’t win or defeat God’s plan?
Satan, like other angels (both unfallen and fallen) are pure intelligence, so it isn’t because he’s stupid or deluded that he is as powerful as God. He can’t win.** But he is full of hate**-- full of hate for God and anyone that God loves. He is so full of hate and jealousy, he is going to do everything in his power to strike out and do whatever it takes to drag as many of us to hell with him as he can.
It seems pointless, but–given the opportunity–even some humans do similar things out of hate and spite-- knowing they can’t have what someone else has or to somehow avenge some perceived wrong done to them, they will sabotage someone else’s happiness even if they won’t profit from it, Unlike humans, the devil has until the end of time to do his worst.
Satan, like other angels (both unfallen and fallen) are pure intelligence, so it isn’t because he’s stupid or deluded that he is as powerful as God. He can’t win.** But he is full of hate**-- full of hate for God and anyone that God loves. He is so full of hate and jealousy, he is going to do everything in his power to strike out and do whatever it takes to drag as many of us to hell with him as he can.
It seems pointless, but–given the opportunity–even some humans do similar things out of hate and spite-- knowing they can’t have what someone else has or to somehow avenge some perceived wrong done to them, they will sabotage someone else’s happiness even if they won’t profit from it, Unlike humans, the devil has until the end of time to do his worst.
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Timothysis
Guest
While I am a big fan of Paradise Lost, I do not think it a good source when speaking about Catholic teachings. As good as it is, much of it is a creation of Milton who was, after all, a protestant who supported Cromwell against the monarchy.
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Timothysis
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Actually, others have NOT explained Satan’s rebellion. Most of what has been posted is nothing more than unsubstantiated folklore, personal conjecture and pious urban legend. As far as I am aware, theologians have simply stated that there was a time when, in one way or another, the heavenly host were put to the test. For whatever reason, there was a group of angels who failed. The classic phrase attributed to Satan was “I will not serve,” but the failure was one of disobedience, much like Adam and Eve. It has been speculated that the angels were not privy to the Beautific Vision before their test, for how could one in the supreme and infinite presence of God ever seek their own ends and not God’s? I admit that it is a curious subject but there is really very little that we can state with any degree of certainty. It is sort of like wondering the state before the creation of the universe or asking what did God do before he made the heavens and the heavenly host.
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TK421
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The details aren’t really important other than to say Satan chose evil rather than good.
If a bandit is going to murder his neighbor, and another man goes to console him , and the bandit reconsiders his way and instead reconciles himself with his neighbor, then he has repented.
If a bandit is going to murder his neighbor, and another man goes to console him, and the bandit continues in his way and goes to commit murder and rob the possessions of others, but he is prevented from doing so at the tip of the sword by the legitimate authorities, and the bandit lays down his arms, then he has surrendered. He has not repented.
Satan falls into the second category, except because of his great spite, he continues - at the allowance of Providence - to be an agent of evil in the world. So likewise, God says to Pharaoh, “I raised you up for this very purpose, that I might display my power through you”. Indeed it is true, that because each rational being must choose good or evil, there would be trouble and distress in this world even if God immediately prevented each evil person from ever continuing in their wickedness after their initial fall. But, in order that we might more fully witness God’s glory and the fruits of evil, the wicked are permitted to pursue their way for a time.
If Satan were to “lay down his arms” it would not change anything. “Laying down your arms” and “repentance” are entirely different from one another. When Napoleon was defeated at Waterloo and issued his surrender, we do not say “Napoleon repented after the battle of Waterloo”.
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livingwordunity
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I agree that we can’t have the same kind of certitude when it comes to a private revelation than we can for public revelation. But when it’s a Church accepted private revelation the Church says that we can choose to believe it with a pious human faith. Another thing to note is that the OP didn’t ask what the official Church teaching is about it. If he had asked this it would have been easy to just copy and paste the section about it that is in the Catechism. But I assumed that he was looking for something more.
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Robertanthony
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Timothysis
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That’s fine but if one chooses to believe something that isn’t factually correct, then what good is that? Anne Catherine Emmerich’s canonization completely ignored her visions gathered in the book The Dolorous Passion of Our Lord Jesus Christ and, in fact, the authenticity of the book is not endorsed by the Church, yet we are free to make what we wish of it. Just because the Church says we can accept such revelations isn’t to mean that what we accept is factually true. For some topics it is best to stick to what we know and what we know about Satan is precious little.
That “something more” seems to be nothing but folklore and wild imagination. Speculating is fine but it shouldn’t be presented as fact.
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livingwordunity
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I agree that private revelations shouldn’t be presented as fact. But the ones that are permitted by the Church for private reading are permitted because the Church found that they don’t contradict what we know from public revelation. And sometimes, as with Ven. Mary of Agreda’s Mystical City of God, it not only doesn’t contradict but seems to make sense by combining what we know with reason. In this case, when the theology can be deduced, I don’t think it’s a fair to go to the other extreme by totally writing it off as “folklore and wild imagination.” Even though the Church says that it’s not on the same level as public revelation, by permitting it to be read by the faithful, She acknowledges that it is useful on some level for private reading if one chooses to believe it with a pious human faith.
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fisherman_carl
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In Wisdom 2:24 it says that sin entered the world through the devil’s envy. What could the devil be envious of? God, man? Was he envious of man’s relationship with God? Or was he envious of God himself? Or both? The Church Fathers talk about this.
The Haydock commentary has this to say:
“. Envy. Lucifer thought that the honour of the hypostatic union (C.) belonged to the angelic, rather than to the human nature; and this he was guilty of envy, (H.) and strove to become like the most High. Is. 14:14. S. Bern. ser. xvii. in Cant. Corn. A. Lap. &c.”
The Haydock commentary has this to say:
“. Envy. Lucifer thought that the honour of the hypostatic union (C.) belonged to the angelic, rather than to the human nature; and this he was guilty of envy, (H.) and strove to become like the most High. Is. 14:14. S. Bern. ser. xvii. in Cant. Corn. A. Lap. &c.”
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Bible_Reader
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When was she canonized?
I am aware that she was *beatified *in 2004, but am unaware that she was canonized. Given the controversy that attended her beatification, I would expect that any canonization would be well-covered by the Catholic and secular press.
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