Why have faith at all?

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YHWH_Christ

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Devil’s advocate here (currently debating an agnostic).

Sure maybe you can argue philosophically for the existence of God but, why believe that God is Yahweh of the Bible? There are thousands of religions out there, and the adherents of those religions believe in them just as strongly as other adherents in other religions. What evidence is there for Christianity over Judaism or Islam or Hinduism or Buddhism or any other religion? And on top of that, why does it appear that there are so many contradictions or errors in traditional belief? When reading the Hebrew Bible Yahweh appears as no more than a tribal deity, indeed Biblical criticism has demonstrated quite well the evolution of Israelite religion and it appears to not be that different from the other religions in the near east at that time. Why should I believe it’s superior? Why should I have faith in absence of compelling evidence? It seems that many religions, especially the Abrahamics, often move the goal post in defining what God is in light of theological developments or philosophical developments or scientific ones. For example, although the Bible certainly isn’t a science book and isn’t trying to teach science, the cosmology it presents is the primitive cosmology of the ancient near east and many core ideas in Judaism and Christianity come from that. The cherubim, for example, seem to be based off the ancient near eastern mythological creatures known as the lamassu, why should I then believe that the cherbuim have an ontological existence over any other near eastern mythological creature?
 
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Many men have claimed to hear from God, to have experienced God, to have see God…very well, but only ONE has claimed to actually BE GOD and then to not only have preformed miracles, but to have risen from His own grave. Jesus was a Jew, and therefore he links the old with the new. He links Judaism with Catholicism which was the original and 1st Christian religion.

So to answer the faith question: you need faith because no matter how much evidence, or intellectual prowess you have, you will never be able to truly know if Jesus was who he says he was or at a very minimum have 100% without a doubt certainty. That requires faith, and it doesn’t mean that there is not an enormous amount of reliable information out there. of which, you can use to make a reasonable assumption (faith) based on what you have experienced, heard, and learned. It takes a lot of effort to get there if your going at it alone. You may be able to get 99% there but you still have to make a small “leap” at the end.
 
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Faith is a gift from God. It’s not evidence-based, and it is given to many people who haven’t a clue about, or any interest in, philosophical arguments or evidence or comparison of world religions etc.

As for why you personally should believe, that’s a question you need to ponder yourself and ask God to help you discern.
 
Where’s the evidence for that? Why should we believe it over any other miracles claims? Other kinds of miracles have been witnessed as well, some of which contradict Christianity. Why should we believe in the claims of Christianity?
 
That’s nice and all but a lot of people just can’t accept that. And how can you blame them? When it also seems there’s so much that actually contradicts Christianity as well? You can have faith but, what if it’s not the truth?
 
(This is what the agnostic said)

When I was a little kid I was told Santa Claus was real. I believed it. Why? Because everyone else told me it was true and because everyone said you need to believe it, even without actually seeing it. When I found out he wasn’t real and told some of the other kids at school, the other kids contradicted me saying that he is real and that you just need to have faith. But as we all know, Santa Claus is most certainly not real. It seems the same logic is being applied to religious faith.
 
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YHWH_Christ said:
That’s nice and all but a lot of people just can’t accept that. And how can you blame them?
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That’s not really my problem if they don’t want to open their minds and hearts to the truth. It’s their problem.
I pray for them and ask God to grant them the gift of faith and to send his Holy Spirit to help them accept it.
 
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Tis_Bearself said:
That’s not really my problem if they don’t want to open their minds and hearts to the truth. It’s their problem.
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But these are genuine truth seekers. You can’t say they haven’t opened their minds, because many have and many have concluded in good faith that the truth is not in Christianity.
 
Like I said, I pray that they realize the error of their ways and find the real truth.

I’m a bit baffled as to why you seem to think I should do something else. I cannot compel people to think or believe correctly. They must make their own choice.
 
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Only in Christianity we find that the founder. the inner circle and many of the followers for 300 years were persecuted and killed, and yet it did not only survive but thrived against all odds. Evidence for the hand of God guiding it, for those who are open to the Truth.
 
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I agree we should pray. But I also want to give them a response and Peter tells us we should answer everyone accordingly. It is the duty of Christians to convert the world. We need to make efforts to convince people of God. That level of subjectivity isn’t going to work. Because believing that there is truth in Christianity is quite subjective. Not saying that it isn’t true, I believe that it is obviously. But atheists and agnostics obviously don’t, and as said they have acted in good faith just as much as you and I have and have concluded that Christianity does not contain truth but atheism does or agnosticism does. They have similar feelings in that they hope we Christians put off our “lie” and come to the truth which they believe is atheism or agnosticism.
 
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Well what about the arguments Muslims make for Islam? Against all odds Muhammad was able to conquer Arabia. Against all odds he and his followers were able to conquer much of the Byzantine Empire. Against all odds Islam became a dominate religion and replaced Christianity in the middle east. And Muslims will say that is due to the guiding hand of Allah.
 
To me, faith offers hope, and hope makes life worth living. Without hope, there’s nothing to look forward to when you die, which would make the death of a loved one super depressing.

Without faith, it’s easier to be amoral, which leads to societal and spiritual malaise and indifference.

The Christian faith is unique in the sense that other religions are mankind’s attempt to reach out to God or have a philosophy to live by, whereas Christianity is God reachIng out to mankind out of a deep and transcending love.

I’m not a theologian or philosopher, but that’s how I view things from a common person’s perspective.
 
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One day many Muslims and Jews will convert to Christianity. They will be strong advocates for Christ, but many Christians won’t understand what is happening.
 
YHWH_Christ said:
Well what about the arguments Muslims make for Islam? Against all odds Muhammad was able to conquer Arabia. Against all odds he and his followers were able to conquer much of the Byzantine Empire. Against all odds Islam became a dominate religion and replaced Christianity in the middle east. And Muslims will say that is due to the guiding hand of Allah.
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Neither Mohammed nor his companions were killed. Mohammed was wealthy, a warrior, and had many wives. Basically the opposite of Jesus. It baffles me that you see an argument there.
 
But Muhammad was severely persecuted. He barely had any followers at first, yet against all odds he conquered Arabia. Also there are various religions with other martyrs. Shia Islam, for example, against all odds survived despite Sunni Muslims actively trying to destroy is. Sikhism too, which had many of its earliest gurus killed and persecuted, against all odds that became a thriving religion. And it is claimed by each religion that it is due to the guiding hand of God. Why did God allow Islam to supplant Christianity in the middle east then if he was guiding Christianity? Does this not look like simple cherry picking of the data to fit a worldview?
 
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YHWH_Christ said:
Why have faith at all?
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Faith is an act of the will by which one binds oneself to another, hence the meaning of the phrase “faithful to your spouse”. It’s quite simply not possible to live as a human being without it: no man is an island unto himself.
 
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OP, there comes a point where you just have to accept that you have a faith that they don’t. No religion can be proven to 100% true…there is a leap of faith that you took to believe. As someone with no faith, I seem incapable of making that leap. I tried and I can’t.

Just as I can not understand how believers can believe, you have to accept that non believers may have tried but just can’t cross that bridge of faith. Then, go have a cup of coffee together!
 
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