Why is Africa the way it is?

[GregoryPalamas]

Tribalism would be another reason for Africas problems. Also the Colonial powers created un-natural borders for countries putting different ethnic groups togther when they never got along with each other.

I’d guess there is some truth to that but how long can that be an excuse. People overcome.

Are there relable studies on the question of Africa’s continued poverty, disease, and strife?

CDL

 

[mlchance]

I do not believe in Rushton’s racial theories, but does anyone want to comment on this page…

http://home.neo.rr.com/viv72/beating-a-dead-horse.gif

Those who keep returning to socialism/communism as the major culprit for Africa’s woes are on target. Zimbabwe, as has been mentioned, is just one primary example.

From cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/zi.html:
Robert MUGABE, the nation’s first prime minister, has been the country’s only ruler (as president since 1987) and has dominated the country’s political system since independence. His chaotic land redistribution campaign, which began in 2000, caused an exodus of white farmers, crippled the economy, and ushered in widespread shortages of basic commodities. Ignoring international condemnation, MUGABE rigged the 2002 presidential election to ensure his reelection. Opposition and labor strikes in 2003 were unsuccessful in pressuring MUGABE to retire early; security forces continued their brutal repression of regime opponents. The ruling ZANU-PF party used fraud and intimidation to win a two-thirds majority in the March 2005 parliamentary election, allowing it to amend the constitution at will and recreate the Senate, which had been abolished in the late 1980s. In April 2005, Harare embarked on Operation Restore Order, ostensibly an urban rationalization program, which resulted in the destruction of the homes or businesses of 700,000 mostly poor supporters of the opposition, according to UN estimates. Robert MUGABE, the nation’s first prime minister, has been the country’s only ruler (as president since 1987) and has dominated the country’s political system since independence. His chaotic land redistribution campaign, which began in 2000, caused an exodus of white farmers, crippled the economy, and ushered in widespread shortages of basic commodities. Ignoring international condemnation, MUGABE rigged the 2002 presidential election to ensure his reelection. Opposition and labor strikes in 2003 were unsuccessful in pressuring MUGABE to retire early; security forces continued their brutal repression of regime opponents. The ruling ZANU-PF party used fraud and intimidation to win a two-thirds majority in the March 2005 parliamentary election, allowing it to amend the constitution at will and recreate the Senate, which had been abolished in the late 1980s. In April 2005, Harare embarked on Operation Restore Order, ostensibly an urban rationalization program, which resulted in the destruction of the homes or businesses of 700,000 mostly poor supporters of the opposition, according to UN estimates.

– Mark L. Chance.

 

[vern_humphrey]

I report I found a few years ago, I think by Bill Moyers, stated that prior to WWII Black Americans owned over 17 million acres of farm land. After WWII there was a massive migration north. Now there are very few acres of land owned by blacks, huge numbers are on welfare, and black families have suffered terrible destruction.

But this isn’t about American Blacks. I have still read nothing to indicate that the present devastation of black Africa is anything more than the devastation of Socialism. Still, can this be. Can this misdirected economic system be solely to blame for this poverty?

CDL

In this particular case, I think we are dealing with Liberal Racism – the idea that Blacks cannot be as successful as other races “because of slavery” and so on and so on. Blacks are as inferior in the eyes of liberals as they are in the eyes of the KKK. But liberals say “it isn’t their fault,” so it’s okay.

Blacks are as capable as Whites – and the reasons for the mess many African nations are in must be sought in causes not due to slavery, segregation, or other past issues, but in the present – the present ruling dictators.

 

[GregoryPalamas]

In this particular case, I think we are dealing with Liberal Racism – the idea that Blacks cannot be as successful as other races “because of slavery” and so on and so on. Blacks are as inferior in the eyes of liberals as they are in the eyes of the KKK. But liberals say “it isn’t their fault,” so it’s okay.

Blacks are as capable as Whites – and the reasons for the mess many African nations are in must be sought in causes not due to slavery, segregation, or other past issues, but in the present – the present ruling dictators.

Do you think that as Christianity expands in Africa the socialist dictators will be overthrown and Africa will find a way to develop? No one can predict the future but Europe had its problems in the 8-10th centuries. Maybe this Africa will pull out of this like Europe did. I certainly believe that the liberals in the US and perhaps the entire Western world consider blacks to be inferior. I’ve always believed that peoples have gifts to give each other. The Catholic world has given the gift of faith in Christ and it is certainly taking hold in Africa. African missionaries are now effectively evangelizing parts of the US. Are there other ways to exchange help? Are there ways to rescue the poorest of the poor in Africa without further crippling the continent?

CDL

 

[vern_humphrey]

Do you think that as Christianity expands in Africa the socialist dictators will be overthrown and Africa will find a way to develop? No one can predict the future but Europe had its problems in the 8-10th centuries. Maybe this Africa will pull out of this like Europe did. I certainly believe that the liberals in the US and perhaps the entire Western world consider blacks to be inferior. I’ve always believed that peoples have gifts to give each other. The Catholic world has given the gift of faith in Christ and it is certainly taking hold in Africa. African missionaries are now effectively evangelizing parts of the US. Are there other ways to exchange help? Are there ways to rescue the poorest of the poor in Africa without further crippling the continent?

CDL

I don’t think the dictators are going to go without a fight. Look at South America – it has been Christian for almost 500 years, and they still have brutal dictators there.

 

[jc-servant]

I’d guess there is some truth to that but how long can that be an excuse. People overcome.

How about for as many centuries as tribalism caused strife and divisions in Europe? I think they are still at it after the collapse of the artificially imposed borders in places like the former Yugoslavia. Tribal feuds started in Europe well before the Dark Ages, so I guess Africans have a number of years to catch up in acting on hatred of people not of their particular group.

Tribalism is not isolated to Africa and it continues to reassert itself when power imposed from outside collapses in many places in the world. Many African nations are not that many years out of the collapse of colonial systems. I think it is a bit condescending for someone in our relatively stable country to call it an “excuse” when it is tearing someone else’s home apart. It was hate for another tribe/group that caused the mass killings and resultant chaos, starvation and migration in Rwanda, not socialists versus capitalists.

 

[vern_humphrey]

How about for as many centuries as tribalism caused strife and divisions in Europe? I think they are still at it after the collapse of the artificially imposed borders in places like the former Yugoslavia. Tribal feuds started in Europe well before the Dark Ages, so I guess Africans have a number of years to catch up in acting on hatred of people not of their particular group.

Tribalism is not isolated to Africa and it continues to reassert itself when power imposed from outside collapses in many places in the world. Many African nations are not that many years out of the collapse of colonial systems. I think it is a bit condescending for someone in our relatively stable country to call it an “excuse” when it is tearing someone else’s home apart. It was hate for another tribe/group that caused the mass killings and resultant chaos, starvation and migration in Rwanda, not socialists versus capitalists.

It is socialism – not tribalism – that justifies powerful central governments – and it is those powerful central governments that impose the conditions under which Africans now live.

 

[GregoryPalamas]

Perhaps there is a bit of chauvinism present when people of relatively stable areas criticize African nations for their killings and instability. But I’m trying to avoid that if possible.

It is helpful to see that we seem to have narrowed down the problems to two: Socialism and Tribalism. It may not be clear which is the causal factor but both seem to be involved in the ongoing struggles.

Now, do stable nations stay out, mind their own business, and allow suffering to continue?

Or, do we continue to be involved in some way?

I believe the Church can always do a better job of helping to solve problems like this than can a secular state. If I am correct, what works best in given situations? How do we support the positive work that is being done?

CDL

 

[vern_humphrey]

Perhaps there is a bit of chauvinism present when people of relatively stable areas criticize African nations for their killings and instability. But I’m trying to avoid that if possible.

It is helpful to see that we seem to have narrowed down the problems to two: Socialism and Tribalism. It may not be clear which is the causal factor but both seem to be involved in the ongoing struggles.

Now, do stable nations stay out, mind their own business, and allow suffering to continue?

Or, do we continue to be involved in some way?

I believe the Church can always do a better job of helping to solve problems like this than can a secular state. If I am correct, what works best in given situations? How do we support the positive work that is being done?

CDL

If we are to be involved, we must rememer that those brutal governments got where they are by the unrestricted use of force. They maintain themselves by the unrestricted use of force, and they will defend themselves with the unrestricted use of force.

In other words, if we are to be involved, lock and load!

 

[GregoryPalamas]

If we are to be involved, we must rememer that those brutal governments got where they are by the unrestricted use of force. They maintain themselves by the unrestricted use of force, and they will defend themselves with the unrestricted use of force.

In other words, if we are to be involved, lock and load!

I doubt that there is a secular western nation on earth that has the stomach for it…and since most Catholics have suddenly turned pacifist I doubt that the Church would officially back anything.

Sharia seems to have won again…if you are correct.

CDL

 

[vern_humphrey]

I doubt that there is a secular western nation on earth that has the stomach for it…and since most Catholics have suddenly turned pacifist I doubt that the Church would officially back anything.

Sharia seems to have won again…if you are correct.

CDL

If we have not the stomach to defend against brutality and despotism, we must expect brutality and despotism to win.

Of course, we can assuage the pain in our souls by wringing our hands and saying, “Somebody (but not us) should do something about this!”

 

[jc-servant]

I think that any involvement must come from a government entity in the countries where one of the main dividing factors is religion. In some cases, the religious status of the person does not matter so much as their other affiliations. This was the case in Rwanda in 1994 where people were actually slaughtered inside Catholic churches. It was their tribe that mattered and not their religious affiliation. Catholic Relief Services would not have been effective in such a situation to help resolve the strife.

In some other countries there is a strong clash between Islamic groups trying to impose religious rule and other groups. This situation would also present serious problems for any religious group attempting to mediate or provide aid. Governments at least have a carrot/stick option in their bag of tricks if they decide to intervene. I just have a problem with where and how our government has chosen to intervene for the last couple of decades.

I might not have been able to do a better job, but I’m not impressed with our overall record from a humanitarian standpoint given all of the expertise available to our government. I think that the US has great intentions most of the time, but we don’t always plan and execute in the best way. I don’t believe that continuing to drop food/medicine or extending more loans that end up in the pockets of corrupt individuals has been working well for us. Of course having worked for local, state and federal agencies for most of my adult life, I should not be surprised. My experience has been that those at the upper levels rarely get good info from the worker bees who will have to implement a policy before mandating some major plan.

 

[vern_humphrey]

I might not have been able to do a better job, but I’m not impressed with our overall record from a humanitarian standpoint given all of the expertise available to our government. I think that the US has great intentions most of the time, but we don’t always plan and execute in the best way. I don’t believe that continuing to drop food/medicine or extending more loans that end up in the pockets of corrupt individuals has been working well for us. Of course having worked for local, state and federal agencies for most of my adult life, I should not be surprised. My experience has been that those at the upper levels rarely get good info from the worker bees who will have to implement a policy before mandating some major plan.

With the best will in the world, we often do great harm.