Why is it wrong to love Mary?

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fbl9 said:
hi Roy 5 did Luther reform anything regardin Mary. as far as i know of he -did not-…
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I read several years back in the Catholic Digest that Martin Luther loved the Rosary (which is after all, a scriptural prayer centered on the life of Jesus) and lamented that many reformers had discouraged its use.

Regarding God’s restoration of the Davidic kingdom in Christ, besides the position of prime minister (represented in the restored kingdom by Peter, the first pope), there is the position of Queen Mother (Mary). A type (or prefiguring) of the office of Queen Mother is found in I Kings 2:12-19. In this passage, King Solomon’s mother sits on a throne at his right hand, and the King pays her homage. A petitioner who desires a favor of the king makes his request through her.
 
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"Our Lady of Good Counsel"

I love this painting! Does anybody else here who “loves Mary” the Mother of God, have a favorite painting of Mary? If so, post it here and/or post - “Why you love Mary”.
 
It isn’t wrong to love Mary, at least not in my opinion. She is really a beautiful figure in the Bible… her dedication is remarkable. To love a woman who was such a strong, loving person is not wrong in the least.

If people condemn your love of Mary, it’s probably because they think that it’s taking away from your love of God. While Mary isn’t God, she is the Theotokos, the Mother of God… so as long as you’re aware of the facts, there’s no harm done.
 
Is this the proper way to think of Mary? Does this lead to more love for Mary?

THE GLORIES OF MARY
by
St. Alphonsus de Liguori
Doctor of the Church

Vita, Dulcedo.
OUR LIFE, OUR SWEETNESS.
I.
MARY, OUR LIFE, OUR SWEETNESS.

Mary is our life, because she obtains for us the Pardon of our Sins.
To understand why the holy Church makes us call Mary our life, we must know, that as the soul gives life to the body, so does divine grace give life to the soul; for a soul without grace has the name of being alive but is in truth dead, as it was said of one in the Apocalypse, Thou hast the name of being alive, and thou art dead (“Nomen habes quod vivas, et mortuus es”—Apoc. iii. 1). Mary, then, in obtaining this grace for sinners by her intercession, thus restores them to life.
 
MARY AND ST. PAUL
Code: 
All Christians love Mary. The difference is in the veneration of Mary, concentration on Mary (as in the Rosary), focusing far more attention on Mary than we find in scripture.

 No one has yet addressed seriously a question which has always puzzled me. St. Paul wrote the bulk of the New Testament after the gospels, his many letters of instruction to early Christians. Some scholars suggest that these letters even came before the gospels - that is, they were written before the gospels were compiled. Whether or not that is ture, I find it amazing that he not once mentions Mary. If Mary is supposed to be so central in Christian worship, why would St. Paul, the great missionary, omit any and all reference to her?

 In the gospels, between the birth and crucifixion of Christ I find only two references to Mary, both of which seem to me to be somewhat dismissive, certainly not examples of adulation.

  There seems to be a need in many to have a major goddess figure, and Mary appears to meet that need. Fine. I have no problem if others engage in such adulation, but I don't find sufficient evidence either in scripture or in the earliest churches to make it compulsory. I find that this worship (yes, regardless of what may be said, it amounts to worship) is something that is disturbing, that I cannot embrace. Does that make me a heretic destined for the fires of hell? Or, do I have the freedom to focus my attention more on Christ and less on Mary than many fellow Christians? Various friends pick specific saints to pray to - allowable, I understand. Can we do the same when it comes to Mary and say the Our Father instead of the Hail Mary?
 
Jimmy_B said:
Hi Goth_Catholic, I really like this one, I don’t think I’ve seen this one before. Do know who painted it or when it was painted?

Thank you 👍
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It says the author was Sassoferrato, it’s titled “Virgin of Sorrows”
 
Roy5 said:
MARY AND ST. PAUL
Code: 
All Christians love Mary. The difference is in the veneration of Mary, concentration on Mary (as in the Rosary), focusing far more attention on Mary than we find in scripture.

 No one has yet addressed seriously a question which has always puzzled me. St. Paul wrote the bulk of the New Testament after the gospels, his many letters of instruction to early Christians. Some scholars suggest that these letters even came before the gospels - that is, they were written before the gospels were compiled. Whether or not that is ture, I find it amazing that he not once mentions Mary. If Mary is supposed to be so central in Christian worship, why would St. Paul, the great missionary, omit any and all reference to her?

 In the gospels, between the birth and crucifixion of Christ I find only two references to Mary, both of which seem to me to be somewhat dismissive, certainly not examples of adulation.

  There seems to be a need in many to have a major goddess figure, and Mary appears to meet that need. Fine. I have no problem if others engage in such adulation, but I don't find sufficient evidence either in scripture or in the earliest churches to make it compulsory. I find that this worship (yes, regardless of what may be said, it amounts to worship) is something that is disturbing, that I cannot embrace. Does that make me a heretic destined for the fires of hell? Or, do I have the freedom to focus my attention more on Christ and less on Mary than many fellow Christians? Various friends pick specific saints to pray to - allowable, I understand. Can we do the same when it comes to Mary and say the Our Father instead of the Hail Mary?
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**Roy - you get it wrong EVERY TIME!!
  1. Although it appears as though the Rosary focuses on Mary, it doesn’t. It focuses on Christ through the Divine Mysteries - Joyful, Sorrowful, Glorious, and Luminous. These are ALL sacred moments in the life of Christ, taken from Scriptures. THESE are what is meditated upon and prayed over.
  2. The letters came before the Gospels. And Mary is NOT part of Catholic worship of God. She is Mother of the Church and a saint in heaven belonging to the Communion of Saints who pray for us. She mentioned - MENTIONED - twice at Mass, that’s it.
  3. Mary is not a ‘goddess’ and no Catholic in his or her right mind would EVER consider that. She is a creature of God, albeit a highly favored human being, being chosen by God to be the mother of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. As such, she is also saved by Christ as we are.
  4. Although the Church encourages petitioning the Communion of the Saints, and encourages us to ask them to continuously pray for us to persevere in this life, the Church does not ‘demand’ that anyone does. The focus in the life of the Church is Christ, front, back and center. It’s fine with the Church for you, say, to focus on Christ, which is what one should be doing anyway.
We’ve covered all of this before. Why don’t you “get it” yet?**
 
Jimmy_B said:
My letter (prayer) to Mary

*Dear Mary,

You are the Mother of God and my mother too. You were the perfect Mother and the perfect disciple. Mary, you were the one chosen (handpicked) by God from all time and all woman to be the Mother of God.

You are the precious vessel and the way my Lord entered the world.

You have always done the “will of our heavenly Father” and are by Jesus’ definition, His “brother, and sister, and mother” (His loyal servant, follower and disciple).

Please pray for me that I may always be a loyal follower of your Son, as you are. You have shown me how to Love your Son.

You are the Mother of God and Jesus’ disciple. You are the only person who ever lived that was with Jesus from the beginning, until the end at the foot of His cross.

You held the baby Jesus in your arms, loving Him and protecting Him, never letting Him go, until he was taken from you at the Cross. You never denied him or left Him. You remained quite because you knew that you would have to suffer so that the rest of mankind might be saved.

You were there in the upper room during Pentecost!

As for your name in scripture, there exists not a single word against you. There is no finer example of a person who has completely surrendered himself to the will of God, as you Mary.

You were truly, madly in love with your Son Jesus and who from the beginning; you knew He was “God with us”. Your perfect expression of surrender, “May it be done to me according to your word” is the source of my strength.

Mary, you kept many things in your heart and reflected on them, you truly knew the Lord before any of the apostles and He knew you.

When you brought the baby Jesus to Simeon, His destiny was revealed to you; before any other disciples knew, you knew!

“A sword pierced your own heart, so that the thoughts of many hearts would be known”. I can only imagine how you suffered and the strength you must have needed to continue on to the very end, to the foot of the cross.

I love you Mary, thank you.

You encouraged Him at the wedding at Cana, the point in which your Son Jesus and our Lord began His ministry, you sad, “do as He says”, may these words always be a reminder to me to, “do as He says”

You loved Jesus with all of your heart, all of your soul, all of your mind and all of your strength. Has there been anyone as devoted to my Lord, as you? Blessed Mary, the Lord is with you, you are blessed among all women and all generation will consider you blessed. You have been reunited with your Lord, how sweet that must be. Mary, my mother, please pray for me that the Lord have mercy on me a sinner and that one day I can come home to the Lord.

Thank you Mary and pray for me that I may always think of your great example of love, sacrifice and surrender. One cannot think about you, Mary without thinking about your son Jesus. I am madly in love with you and I am madly in love with your son, my lord Jesus Christ. May my focus allows be on Christ, as you were always focused on Him.

Your son and Christ’s loyal follower,*
  • Jimmy*
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**WOW, WOW, WOW you have been inspired by the Holy Spirit to write what is in your heart that is the most beautiful love letter I have read, may GOD keep blessing you. **
 
AgnosTheist said:
An observation.

For Protestants Mary is merely as important as Moses & David. Noted in paper but nothing more.

For Catholics, they make it an effort to love Mary. I know why. 😃 Its because catholics think that Mary has some kind of omniscient power that she could hear their every prayers to her. And in return they believe that Mary could keep persuading God to give Catholics a special attention.
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you’re not a member of any group so why you keep saying for protestant?:confused:
 
AgnosTheist said:
Dont worry, they share your concerns. For protestants they are sad that you cant appreciate how they devote their full attention to Jesus, instead of dividing their time between God and the saints…like you do. 😃

to each his own.

to each his own.

har har har. 😃
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I don’t understand are you a protestant? and if so what denomination?
 
Jimmy_B said:
Why is it wrong to love Mary?

Below (post# 2) is a letter (prayer) I wrote for Mary. All of my comments in this letter are Biblical, if you are not a Catholic and you do not love Mary, please explain why you don’t (love Mary)? Where is it written, in the Bible that you cannot love Mary?

http://davenation.com/madonnas/found/La_Vierge_au_lys.jpg
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We are suppose to love everyone. Ok so i love Mary its just she is not the center of my worship. Jesus is…Mary said when she was alive and pregnant with Jesus many generations to come will call me blessed!!! So i love all the saints in the bible of course and Mary but I worship Jesus… There will be no other Gods or idols before Him…We have to be careful because it says he will only come to the Father through the Son. There is no other way to the Father…but through the Son. But i will say Mary is one of the most blessed humans that ever lived because she birthed are Savior into this world. She got to share an intimacy with Jesus when he was alive that is amazing. He was her physical son. She was his earthly mother , so yeah she is blessed she was pregnant with God!!!
 
lurdes said:
**WOW, WOW, WOW you have been inspired by the Holy Spirit to write what is in your heart that is the most beautiful love letter I have read, may GOD keep blessing you. **
Click to expand...
Thank You… God Bless You… Sorry about all the typo’s… :o
 
Roy5 said:
MARY AND ST. PAUL
Code: 
All Christians love Mary. The difference is in the veneration of Mary, concentration on Mary (as in the Rosary), focusing far more attention on Mary than we find in scripture.

 No one has yet addressed seriously a question which has always puzzled me. St. Paul wrote the bulk of the New Testament after the gospels, his many letters of instruction to early Christians. Some scholars suggest that these letters even came before the gospels - that is, they were written before the gospels were compiled. Whether or not that is ture, I find it amazing that he not once mentions Mary. If Mary is supposed to be so central in Christian worship, why would St. Paul, the great missionary, omit any and all reference to her?

 In the gospels, between the birth and crucifixion of Christ I find only two references to Mary, both of which seem to me to be somewhat dismissive, certainly not examples of adulation.

  There seems to be a need in many to have a major goddess figure, and Mary appears to meet that need. Fine. I have no problem if others engage in such adulation, but I don't find sufficient evidence either in scripture or in the earliest churches to make it compulsory. I find that this worship (yes, regardless of what may be said, it amounts to worship) is something that is disturbing, that I cannot embrace. Does that make me a heretic destined for the fires of hell? Or, do I have the freedom to focus my attention more on Christ and less on Mary than many fellow Christians? Various friends pick specific saints to pray to - allowable, I understand. Can we do the same when it comes to Mary and say the Our Father instead of the Hail Mary?
Click to expand...
Ok i agree with you. I am non-denomination, but im interested in the catholic denomination. However i know catholic people who do not pray or hail Mary. They love her of course but they worship the one true God. He is a jealous God. There will be no god or gods before Him. I am not saying i believe catholic is defined by worship of Mary. But i agree with you.
 
For those who hate Martin Luther i thought you might find this of interest:
From The Times
March 6, 2008
That Martin Luther? He wasn’t so bad, says Pope

Richard Owen in Rome
Pope Benedict XVI is to rehabilitate Martin Luther, arguing that he did not intend to split Christianity but only to purge the Church of corrupt practices.
Pope Benedict will issue his findings on Luther (1483-1546) in September after discussing him at his annual seminar of 40 fellow theologians — known as the Ratzinger Sch�lerkreis — at Castelgandolfo, the papal summer residence. According to Vatican insiders the Pope will argue that Luther, who was excommunicated and condemned for heresy, was not a heretic.
Cardinal Walter Kasper, the head of the pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity, said the move would help to promote ecumenical dialogue between Catholics and Protestants. It is also designed to counteract the impact of July’s papal statement describing the Protestant and Orthodox faiths as defective and “not proper Churches”.
The move to re-evaluate Luther is part of a drive to soften Pope Benedict’s image as an arch conservative hardliner as he approaches the third anniversary of his election next month. This week it emerged that the Vatican is planning to erect a statue of Galileo, who also faced a heresy trial, to mark the 400th anniversary next year of his discovery of the telescope.
The Pope has also reached out to the Muslim world to mend fences after his 2006 speech at Regensburg University in which he appeared to describe Islam as inherently violent and irrational. This week Muslim scholars and Vatican officials met at the pontifical Council for Inter-Religious Dialogue in Rome to begin laying the groundwork for a meeting between the Pope and leading Muslims, also expected to be held at Castelgandolfo.
Cardinal Kasper said: “We have much to learn from Luther, beginning with the importance he attached to the word of God.” It was time for a “more positive” view of Luther, whose reforms had aroused papal ire at the time but could now be seen as having “anticipated aspects of reform which the Church has adopted over time”.
The Castelgandolfo seminar will in part focus on the question of apostolic succession, through which the apostles passed on the authority they received from Jesus to the first bishops. After the Reformation Protestants took the view that “succession” referred only to God’s Word and not to church hierarchies but some German scholars have suggested Luther himself did not intend this.
Luther challenged the authority of the papacy by holding that the Bible is the sole source of religious authority and made it accessible to ordinary people by translating it into the vernacular. He became convinced that the Church had lost sight of the “central truths of Christianity”, and was appalled on a visit to Rome in 1510 by the power, wealth and corruption of the papacy.
In 1517 he protested publicly against the sale of papal indulgences for the remission of sins in his “95 Theses”, nailing a copy to the door of a Wittenberg church. Some theologians argue that Luther did not intend to confront the papacy “in a doctrinaire way” but only to raise legitimate questions - a view Pope Benedict apparently shares.
Luther was excommunicated by Pope Leo X, who dismissed him initially as “a drunken German who will change his mind when sober”.

The Times and The Sunday Times.
 
justasking4 said:
For those who hate Martin Luther i thought you might find this of interest:
From The Times
March 6, 2008
That Martin Luther? He wasn’t so bad, says Pope

Richard Owen in Rome
Pope Benedict XVI is to rehabilitate Martin Luther, arguing that he did not intend to split Christianity but only to purge the Church of corrupt practices.
Pope Benedict will issue his findings on Luther (1483-1546) in September after discussing him at his annual seminar of 40 fellow theologians — known as the Ratzinger Sch�lerkreis — at Castelgandolfo, the papal summer residence. According to Vatican insiders the Pope will argue that Luther, who was excommunicated and condemned for heresy, was not a heretic.
Cardinal Walter Kasper, the head of the pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity, said the move would help to promote ecumenical dialogue between Catholics and Protestants. It is also designed to counteract the impact of July’s papal statement describing the Protestant and Orthodox faiths as defective and “not proper Churches”.
The move to re-evaluate Luther is part of a drive to soften Pope Benedict’s image as an arch conservative hardliner as he approaches the third anniversary of his election next month. This week it emerged that the Vatican is planning to erect a statue of Galileo, who also faced a heresy trial, to mark the 400th anniversary next year of his discovery of the telescope.
The Pope has also reached out to the Muslim world to mend fences after his 2006 speech at Regensburg University in which he appeared to describe Islam as inherently violent and irrational. This week Muslim scholars and Vatican officials met at the pontifical Council for Inter-Religious Dialogue in Rome to begin laying the groundwork for a meeting between the Pope and leading Muslims, also expected to be held at Castelgandolfo.
Cardinal Kasper said: “We have much to learn from Luther, beginning with the importance he attached to the word of God.” It was time for a “more positive” view of Luther, whose reforms had aroused papal ire at the time but could now be seen as having “anticipated aspects of reform which the Church has adopted over time”.
The Castelgandolfo seminar will in part focus on the question of apostolic succession, through which the apostles passed on the authority they received from Jesus to the first bishops. After the Reformation Protestants took the view that “succession” referred only to God’s Word and not to church hierarchies but some German scholars have suggested Luther himself did not intend this.
Luther challenged the authority of the papacy by holding that the Bible is the sole source of religious authority and made it accessible to ordinary people by translating it into the vernacular. He became convinced that the Church had lost sight of the “central truths of Christianity”, and was appalled on a visit to Rome in 1510 by the power, wealth and corruption of the papacy.
In 1517 he protested publicly against the sale of papal indulgences for the remission of sins in his “95 Theses”, nailing a copy to the door of a Wittenberg church. Some theologians argue that Luther did not intend to confront the papacy “in a doctrinaire way” but only to raise legitimate questions - a view Pope Benedict apparently shares.
Luther was excommunicated by Pope Leo X, who dismissed him initially as “a drunken German who will change his mind when sober”.

The Times and The Sunday Times.
Click to expand...
This article is full of errors, and very off topic in this thread. Actually, ja4, Luther was devoted to Mary, and believed and practiced all the Marian doctrines, and prayed his rosary daily.
 
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