Why is Jesus necessary?

[sawman]

quote: uglygal

Quite true. I sometimes think that God gifts one
with a high level of intelligence, because one is going
to need that, being in the world, so ill.

What I can never seem to fathom, is the thought that one
occassionally encounters - that if only I were apprised
of all points of doctrine, and that on which these rest,
that I would be overwhelmed by the evidence, and
promptly sign for a cruise to Infallible Island.

Then there is the assertion that faith is a gift of grace -
which seems to evoke an antiphonal response, on occassion -
when true faith evinces not.
To wit: one is not praying hard enough for the gift.

In any other area of human endeavor, that type of risible reasoning
would be considered a double-message.
You didn’t ask hard enough. http://bestsmileys.com/nono/9.gif
Climaxing, in a hardy game of IAYF. “It’s All Your Fault.”

But then, cleaving to the concept of Original Sin -
it is! All My Fault.

reen12

Dear Reen,
You have brought up a very interesting point, rather, two very interesting points. I have often noticed and wondered what path does that person’s reasoning take? Sometimes when I hear what seems to me an airtight case made for belief,and the response is nothing I would have thought of,I am frustrated. I think “is this person just being obstinate?or contraryan? or what!”.
Sometimes, that is the case but othertimes, I can see a genuine disagreement. There are times when all I can do is listen cause I have no response. I also realize that the path reasoning takes is not always got anything to do with accepting or rejecting faith, or the arguements for or against.
You and UglyGal are not Christians. You’ve not been persuaded by any discussion here. Although this is frustrating to me, I can appreciate your positions. You both have serious, legitimate objections that reasoning and good will cannot overcome. I am sorrowed that I could not witness the two of you embrace what would ultimately restore and rebuild and embrace you.I see Jesus’ love for you and your inability to be able see or accept it as a tragedy. I am angered that christians have been responsible for so much of this state of affairs. There are other causes as well, but that’s not my point.
I just wanted to say that I do not think your unpersuaded state is bad or somehow condemns you. I don’t see things this way. I have seen in both of you a sincere love of God, an admirable and honest relationship with Our God. I can admire that and feel kinship with you in a shared love of our God. I must admit, also that your positions make it easier for me to love as He loves. I thank you for expressing yourselves here and for the way you’ve contributed to this conversation and my understanding of a few different things. I pray that Jesus send to you those who will bring His love and healing and example. I pray that you be given a new and different kind experience of Him.
Jesus said"Anyone who is not against us is for us.". I see in you and UglyGal, people who are not against us. In many ways we are kindred. I count myself fortunate to have had this discussion.
It would be a privelege to be able to continue to talk about why is Jesus necessary, although I’m not sure that UglyGal wants anymore talk.

As for " It’s all my fault". I think in the end, what it all boils down to is “It is all my fault”. I would no more have been able to reject the temptation than the man in the moon. I could have been Adam, in a way, I am Adam. I see that old man in me all the time.

Anyway, sorry for being so longwinded.
Love in God, Tom

 

[Deacon_Ed_B]

In response to post # 1. Jesus came to pay a debt he did not owe, because we owed a debt we could not pay. Thats why we needed him.
Prayers & blessings
Deacon ed B

 

[cheeto1]

why indeed? I have been thinking about this lately.
I will not come on CA anymore.
I will leave you with my love and go seek the God of my heart elsewhere.

I wish everyone love, peace and safety.

Oh. You came here to seek God? I guess you were a
little disappointed to find only fellow humans.

What if we asked Why is our body necessary? After all, we
have a soul, and that’s really who we are. Why is our body
necessary? I don’t know the answer, but this is like the
question you are asking about God.

 

[CatsAndDogs]

Oh. You came here to seek God? I guess you were a
little disappointed to find only fellow humans.

What if we asked Why is our body necessary? After all, we
have a soul, and that’s really who we are. Why is our body
necessary? I don’t know the answer, but this is like the
question you are asking about God.

OH, very good!

I must use this one in future. “Why is our body necessary?” Beautiful!

One of the great beauties, “advantages”, or whatever you want to call it, of being Catholic is that the body/soul NON-DICHOTOMY is so nicely dealt with.

There is no “war” between body and soul! The body is to be used appropriately for the BENEFIT of the soul, and the soul needs the body for it’s expression of it’s acquired goodness and evilness.

The “puritan”/dualistic/manichaean “war” is the same nonsense as the “war” between science and religion.

They want “bodiless souls”, which makes as much sense as “creationless creation”.

 

[fhansen]

I can answer this question better now-at least for myself. Sometimes I grow complacent and forget the reasons why I first loved the Christian message and recently I was given a stern wake-up call.

If you’ve been brave enough to love-and it’s never too late if you haven’t-then you know that love is real. You know what it means to love someone even if no loves’ received in return and you may know what it means to be willing to offer your life if it would mean saving theirs. But love’s a risk because one can be spurned or rejected, or even worse-we can lose the one we love- to death. And if you’ve ever faced the death of one you’ve loved and stared into the vast, mean, black, bottomless pit that holds them with an awful finality, a pit you can’t enter and are powerless against, which you’ll kick and scream at to no avail, and that can even make you wail until your heart is wrenched with a pain that never quite goes away, then a message of eternal life takes on a more immediate relevance. And in that moment all the shame and the pride and the fear that lead us and the world around by our noses is exposed for what it is- stupid and meaningless. The religions that promise “enlightenment” are worthless and the ones that aren’t sure one way or the other about an afterlife don’t help either. A belief in reincarnation may offer comfort but the story of a physical resurrection of a God/man, combined with the grace that makes belief in that resurrection possible-real grace given by our real and merciful God-takes the sting of that death away and begins to edge out the blackness with the brightness of eternal life and eternal love.

The resurrection is why I need Jesus.