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Reuben_J
Guest
Another good show that deserves another trophy. Now you have moved from drama into comedy. You make Eddie Murphy as a comedian looks pale in comparision.
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FaithofAbraham
Guest
You are just sour grapes because you know I’m right.Another good show that deserves another trophy. Now you have moved from drama into comedy. You make Eddie Murphy as a comedian looks pale in comparision.
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dolphinlove
Guest
FaithofAbraham,
After your response to Reuben J, you are soooo wrong!
You have your OWN beliefs, which do not fit within any religion context. You do not agree with either Islam or the Catholic religion, my suggestion to you, to make yourself happy is to make your own religion, cause you dont agree with either. Basically your arguments are with God, you continue to refute his true religion (the Catholic religion) and continue to agree with Islam (almost), basically your a lost soul that needs guidance and encouragement. God bless you in your task.
After your response to Reuben J, you are soooo wrong!
You have your OWN beliefs, which do not fit within any religion context. You do not agree with either Islam or the Catholic religion, my suggestion to you, to make yourself happy is to make your own religion, cause you dont agree with either. Basically your arguments are with God, you continue to refute his true religion (the Catholic religion) and continue to agree with Islam (almost), basically your a lost soul that needs guidance and encouragement. God bless you in your task.
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planten
Guest
Also:
Last thing first. Allah loves His servants. The theory of offering the other cheek by Jesus, though a perfect good advice, was not a proper natural true thing. But it was the need of the moment as Jesus was under a different law and he wanted to avoid touble at all costs. That is why he forbade preaching to the non Jews just in case they get upset and report him to the authorities.
His teaching was perfect for that time and for that mindset of the jews and for the betterment of the Jews. Jews were waiting for a powerful king type Messiah who would bring them back the throne of David. But Jesus had come as a very common type of man without any visible sign of power. They rejected him.
Had they accepted Jesus and acted on his advice, they would have got back the throne and got rid of the Roman rule too. But they were misled. Jesus wanted to improve their mind and habits first which they were not ready to accept. The higher Jewish clergy felt the teachings of Jesus were a blow to their supermacy.
So that cheek business was good only for that time, not a universal teaching. It is not practiced in any country, not even in any christian country now.
Now about the Daddy business. God used to be called the father in earlier scriptures. That was only metaphoric, symbolic. The word used was Abb = The father.
The christians made it into a real father / son relationship and tried to prove that Jesus was in fact the son of God, the real son of God, the begotten son of God, the only begotten son of God. By that time, things were getting out of hand. That was a wrong teaching. That was wrong to use the symbolic language as the real language. It was a misleading teaching.
In the Quran, the word Abb is not used. In its place the word Rabb = The great Lord is used, which is the Lord of all creation, alive or dead matter including all material and spirits and plants and stars and galaxies and souls and living bodies or dead bodies. Rabb is used for all the creation past or present. It is an all encompassing word full of love and helping, benefitting everything towards advancement, development.
That is why the word Abb is not used in the Quran. Abb is limited in meaning and application. Abb is the father, spiritual father of one man (Jesus) only. What about the benefit to the other creation, rest of the world, alive or dead matter?? So the Quran in the very first verse says : “All praise is due to Allah, the Lord (Rabb=Naourisher) of all the creation.”
Love is there all the time. The message of the Quran is Love for all. There is no hatred for any one.
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FaithofAbraham
Guest
Yeah probably. I get tired of defending Christianity and Islam, it might better if I didn’t identify as either. I think church etc. is ok for fellowship and support, and reminding you to pray and behave. I just don’t agree with all the teachings, or a lot of what religions do.
I wouldn’t say I’m lost but it would be nice to know others believe as I do, and I’ve never met any yet. I only feel lost when my faith gets weak, then I have to crawl my way back to praying and repenting.
I don’t think there is any one true religion except for the one Jesus brings and it will be a lot different than what we know now.
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Charlie_Zeaiter
Guest
I would have thought “turning the other cheek” was a story of love.
But you’re probably right that chrisitan countries don’t turn the other cheek; I mean, after September 11th, we should have just turned the other cheek.
Can you tell us of a specific Qur’anic story, or an incident entailing Muhammad, which is about love?
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Deusdonat
Guest
Well, if you mean pedophilial love, there’s of course the story of Mohammed having sex with his chld-bride, Aisha at age 9.
As for 9/11, I think going after Osama Bin Ladin was in fact the right thing to do for so many people on so many levels. The events following however, namely the invasion of Iraq, the shunning of many Christian European nations and Bush’s cozying up to hostile Muslim nations such as Saudi Arabia andPakistan were hardly the correct responses.
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ralphinal
Guest
Then why did Jesus say address God as “Our Father?” No, your explination does not hold up in this area.
I do not know the Koran, so I must rely on you guys for information. Does the Koran ever say NOT to forgive anyone?
Can you honestly say that the world would eb worse off if people actually followed the teachigns of Christ? IF we forgave all wrongs and prayed for everyone, even those who hate us, the world would be a lot better off.
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FaithofAbraham
Guest
Quran 3:30-31 On the Day when every soul will find itself confronted with all that it hath done of good and all that it hath done of evil (every soul) will long that there might be a mighty space of distance between it and that (evil). Allah biddeth you beware of Him. And Allah is Full of Pity for (His) bondmen. Say, (O Muhammad, to mankind): If ye love Allah, follow me; Allah will love you and forgive you your sins. Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.
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swariffin
Guest
Dear FoA,
Once you associated yourself with any religion, then you will find your faith is different to the teachings. Off course, nobody including me has the right to say whether you are correct or not. It will be between you and God.
From the discussions we have, especially between you and me, I begin to realize that you have a unique way of interpretation of the holybooks, in which I cannot judge. But, once you compare your unique interpretations to me and others, logically you should expect counterarguments. In this arguments, off course, we would like to know your way of thinking and your reasoning of how and why you come into your interpretations, is it too much to ask? Who knows that above of all what we believe, there are something that we have in common.
But, finally none of us the right to judge your interpretations, nor do I believe that you can judge others including us. Whatever things we say, off course based on our logic, our understanding of our belief, our culture, our education, and our faith, and who knows also based on different kind of food/cuisine we eat (in which differences should be expected). At the end, it will be the will of God which will matter.
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Reuben_J
Guest
Hi, this is just to say that I’m sorry that I was impatient with your posts. I did not understand them and was not very sure in which direction you were moving into. If you remember, one of my first response to you was to ask you to clarify what you said. Anyway, that had long gone past.
You sounded like you were mocking our belief, perhaps that was what aroused the little devil in me. You see, none of us are perfect.
Life can get lonely many times over. Sometimes the world seems to be very cruel for no apparent reason. For me religous belief has helped to make my life worthwhile living and to look at things that use to make me sad in a more positive way.
As a Catholic I have found contentment and frankly, have experienced the healing power of Jesus himself.
I do not agree with any other religions for obvious reason, but I believe people of good religous background would make good people and good friends. My first post to you was to ask you to be a good Muslim. I thought you were Muslim then. But no matter what, whatever your belief is, if you hang true to it, I think it will always be worthwhile to hang unto.
May peace be unto you always.
Reuben.
I am often very comforted by this verse:
Mt 11:28 -30
"Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light."
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FaithofAbraham
Guest
It’s ok, I have problems with all the religions including Islam so I’m not really trying to pick on any one religion in particular, but as a human I have biases I don’t always see. And maybe I get too far focusing on the negatives and not the positives.
So I’m glad you accept Jesus, that’s the most important thing regardless of details.
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planten
Guest
There was no harm if Jesus said “Our Father”. That was right as it was mentioned in the previous scripture too. Jesus did not change that attitude. When he said our Father, it meant that God was the father of many (or He was the Father of all). He was not the Father of jesus only. Can you understand that? If God is the father of all then every one is a son of God, not Jesus only is son of God.
Can you expalin to me how the God is the father of every one?? It is surely symbolic, not real. We can believe that easily. Same is the case with Jesus which is being made complicated for no reason.
The teachings of Jesus were good for that time and may (or may not) be useful today. They were not wrong teachings. In fact there could not be any better teaching than the one Jesus provided to that Jewish nation. But it was hard (bad) luck of the Jews that they did not accept Jesus as a man of God.
Even if the Jews believe in Jesus today, it would be lot better for them because it is never too late to learn and never too late to accept the truth.
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ralphinal
Guest
As Christians, we understand that God is our Father through our baptism. It is through baptism that we become adopted children of God and heirs to His Kingdom. We understand it to be a real Fatherhood, as if we had been adopted by an earthly Father.
The teachings of Jesus are just as good today as ever. It is a message of forgiveness and love, two things that the world needs more than ever.
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planten
Guest
Thanks. So your being a son of God is only metaphoric. That is some spiritual business. Alright. Be happy as a child of God.
We do not distinguish between any messenger of God. Jesus was a messenger of God and so was Muhammad.
This matter of who is superior cannot be decided until we know about Jesus. Whose seed is Jesus? Let us clearly know whose seed is Jesus please.
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Deusdonat
Guest
Planten, if you are really Muslim, then you know the answer to this since the Qur’an is very specific on this. It clearly states that Jesus’ mother was Mary, and that He was created simply because God/Allah said “be, and it is”. This of course means that God is Jesus’ Father, since He was the **ONLY ONE **responsible for Jesus’ creation (i.e. there was no sperm involved).
Muslims often go around and around on this and just can’t seem to find the courage to come out and say, “Yes, God is Jesus’ Father.” Instead they blather on and on about Jesus not having a Father, but that God created him (er…yeah…
). And 2 + 2 isn’t four, it’s just 6 minus 2!
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ralphinal
Guest
It is NOT metaphoric to be a Child of God. If a couple adopts a child, can that child call them Father and Mother? Is a father and mother ONLY the ones that gave birth or can it be that the parents are those who care for the child?
I was waiting for someone to get literal again. Jesus is eternally begotten of the Father. He is not “seed” of anyone. He was adopted by Joseph, making him in the house of David, although there is evidence that Mary was of David’s house as well. The Father did not have sex with Mary to make Jesus.
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planten
Guest
That is correct that Father did not have sex with Mary. We Muslims also believe the same. ButJesus has to be the seed of some one.
You speak about adopted business. So do you mean that Father adopted Jesus and Jesus was an adopted son of the father? we are discussing the father/son relation of Jesus and God. We are not yet discussing Joseph the Carpentar.
How is Jesus the son of God. Father may have adopted him. Because youhave taken shelter behind the word adopted in your post. Sex is impossible and not to thought about. You said:
If a couple adopts a child, can that child call them Father and Mother?
So we are to believe that Jesus is the adopted child of his Father i.e. God.?? Please explain this.
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ralphinal
Guest
I must not undestand what you mean by “seed.” To me, that means that he is someone’s descendant.
Jesus is NOT the adopted son of God. Jesus is the Son of God eternally begotten of the Father. He is one in substance with the Father. He is the Son and there is a Father. This is how Jesus explains it, so it is the way it is. God the Father and Jesus is God the Son.
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Deusdonat
Guest
More blather. But I guess it is expected, since Muslims simply do not have the courage to state the obvious. There was NO biological Father, since Jesus was BEGOTTEN of GOD. So, no “seed”. The only one responsible for Jesus’ birth is God. Period. Making God Jesus’ Father.As simple as this is to understand, I’m sure the Muslims will find some way to insert double-talk and more blathering until it becomes unintelligilble
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