Why is pre-marital sex a sin?

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gardenswithkids said:
Many people think that Catholic teachings focus on sex as “bad” or “sinful” . . .
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I think that, in recent decades, there has been some effort to get away from the notion that even marital sex is sinful, for sure. But I think this criticism has a great deal of truth to it. Inherently, when you have a celibate priesthood, you are going to have these attitudes.
 
L2P2 said:
I think that, in recent decades, there has been some effort to get away from the notion that even marital sex is sinful, for sure. But I think this criticism has a great deal of truth to it. Inherently, when you have a celibate priesthood, you are going to have these attitudes.
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That attitude is* not inherent* with the celibate priesthood unless they fail to understand the gift given to God through celibacy. Celibacy isn’t a gift because a person abstains from sin. It is a gift because they abstain for something good for the sake of something even better. See the Catechism CCC 1620

***1620 ***Both the sacrament of Matrimony and virginity for the Kingdom of God come from the Lord himself. It is he who gives them meaning and grants them the grace which is indispensable for living them out in conformity with his will. Esteem of virginity for the sake of the kingdom and the Christian understanding of marriage are inseparable, and they reinforce each other:

Whoever denigrates marriage also diminishes the glory of virginity. Whoever praises it makes virginity more admirable and resplendent. What appears good only in comparison with evil would not be truly good. The most excellent good is something even better than what is admitted to be good.
 
gardenswithkids said:
That attitude is* not inherent* with the celibate priesthood unless they fail to understand the gift given to God through celibacy. Celibacy isn’t a gift because a person abstains from sin. It is a gift because they abstain for something good for the sake of something even better. See the Catechism CCC 1620
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You are quoting the new cathechism. As I said, there has been some effort in recent years to address the problem of Catholic attitudes toward marital sex. That’s why that passage is there. Remember, the Baltimore catechism quoted St. Paul on why it is better to marry than to burn (the passage used often to justify celibacy as well as the supposed sinfulness of sex).

I am not arguing against a celibate priesthood. I’m just saying that it comes with certain liabilities that need to be taken into account, as the new catechism attempts to do.
 
=OSUbride0708;6110048]Okay, this question is not posed by me. I feel like I understand the church’s teaching on this issue and totally agree. One of my husband’s good friends since they were small children was here visiting the other night. He was raised Catholic, very strict parents, comes from a family of 10 kids and perhaps this is a little bit of him rebelling and having to come to conclusions on his own. He’s 26 right now, and he now has a girlfriend. He was saying the other night how his parents have been concerned and keep telling him he should wait til his wedding night and he sort of implied to them that he had already had sex and didn’t understand why it was wrong. He actually said “If someone could give me a reason why sex is a sin, I might consider not doing it anymore” He was saying things like he wasn’t hurting anyone, and that as long as he was in a committed relationship he didn’t see the big deal. I was having problems coming up with things on the spot but I did say that sex was meant to be open to life, and that is one of the reasons why it is sinful to use contraception and have sex outside of marriage. I feel like I failed a little bit in that I couldn’t come up with anything very convincing at the moment, but I was kind of on the spot. It was in front of the friend, his girlfriend, my husband, me and our other male friend.
Anyway, I would like to maybe send him an article because I actually think he would read it. I need something not too dry. Christopher West’s talks were very empowering for me, but I know he wouldn’t listen to 4 hours of talks. What would be great would be if someone could kind of sum up Christopher West’s main points to bring it to my memory. Anything you could offer would be helpful though. I’d like to get this to him ASAP, thanks in advance.
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***FACT: Every sexual act between a aman and a women does NOT result in a pregnancy. WHY IS THIS?

God is the author of life…

Gen.20: 18* “For the LORD had closed all the wombs of the house of Abim’elech because of Sarah, Abraham’s wife”.

Gen.29: 31 “When the LORD saw that Leah was hated, he opened her womb; but Rachel was barren”.

**Isa.44:2 "Thus says the LORD who made you,who formed you from the womb and will help you: 24 **Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer,who formed you from the womb: "I am the LORD, who made all things,who stretched out the heavens alone,
who spread out the earth – Who was with me? –
**

Love and prayers,

Pat
Gen. 1: Gen.1:22 **And God blessed them, saying, “Be fruitful and multiply and fill the waters in the seas, and let birds multiply on the earth.” AND AGAIN …28 And God blessed them, and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth and subdue it; and have dominion over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the air and over every living thing that moves upon the earth.”

Sex is NOT a TOY, it’s a gift “with strings attached.” And God controls the strings.

Sexual acts acts are reservered to married men and women precisely and specifically because they MUST BE open to at least the possibility of pregnancy. God demands His RIGHT to decide ALL LIFE AND DEATH ISSUES.👍**
 
He’s unfortunately not interested in the “because God says so” reasoning, and complained about how his dad sent him an email with a bunch of quotes from the Bible but he is still struggling to understand. I think it is also because if he does fully understand, then he will have to stop what he is doing. I sent him a long email and did send the Christopher West link. Christopher West’s talks on cd saved my soul, my husbands, and our relationship overall by explaining things that we learned were wrong but never understood why.
 
OSUbride0708 said:
He’s unfortunately not interested in the “because God says so” reasoning, and complained about how his dad sent him an email with a bunch of quotes from the Bible but he is still struggling to understand. I think it is also because if he does fully understand, then he will have to stop what he is doing. I sent him a long email and did send the Christopher West link. Christopher West’s talks on cd saved my soul, my husbands, and our relationship overall by explaining things that we learned were wrong but never understood why.
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God bless you for having the courage to speak the truth to him. I know it’s not easy. May the Holy Spirit be with him as he reads your e-mail.
 
L2P2 said:
You are quoting the new cathechism. As I said, there has been some effort in recent years to address the problem of Catholic attitudes toward marital sex. …
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The Catechism 1620 quoted from St. John Chrsostrom, a doctor of the Church who lived in the 4th century. It is not new.

It’s also not new for peple to misunderstand Church teachings. I agree that in recent years, especially with Pope John Paul II, some of the Church teachings on marital sex have been better explained. Some people may have misunderstood them in the past and quoted St. Paul out of context. See I Corinthians Chapter Seven to put “better to marry than to burn” in context. St. Paul writes of virginity being superior, but he never calls or even implies that Christian marriage or marital relations are sinful.

Relating this back to the topic, God and the Church value both marital sex and virginity. Obviously, couples who engage in pre-marital sex do not value marital sex and virginity in the same way as those who saves their virginity to give to each other on their wedding night.
 
2353 Fornication is carnal union between an unmarried man and an unmarried woman. It is gravely contrary to the dignity of persons and of human sexuality which is naturally ordered to the good of spouses and the generation and education of children. Moreover, it is a grave scandal when there is corruption of the young.

scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a6.htm#2353
 
that_name said:
2353 Fornication is carnal union between an unmarried man and an unmarried woman . . .
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Perfectly correct. But allow me to suggest that quoting the catechism or the Bible to a skeptical 26 year old male is probably not the best way to get him to desist from whatever he is doing. You’re more likely to encourage him in his present course of action.

Try psychological arguments: He is disrespecting the woman he most cares about; his behavior will likely have negative effects on a long term relationship; it’s a short step from sex outside marriage to infidelity, etc.
 
I think there is also a mistake in his premise. He is NOT committed…
 
OSUbride0708 said:
He’s unfortunately not interested in the “because God says so” reasoning, and complained about how his dad sent him an email with a bunch of quotes from the Bible but he is still struggling to understand. I think it is also because if he does fully understand, then he will have to stop what he is doing. I sent him a long email and did send the Christopher West link. Christopher West’s talks on cd saved my soul, my husbands, and our relationship overall by explaining things that we learned were wrong but never understood why.
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I completely second the thoughts on Christopher West. His summation of Theology of the Body are what makes my marriage what it is today. I now understand how to be “naked without shame” with my wife and how to respect her and not objectify her. She is a gift and our sexuality is a gift, one to be treasured and shared with each other… WOW, what an amazing gift.
 
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