C
Cardinalsin
Guest
if satan was punished immediately and sent to hell why can he tempt us whereas a man that goes to hell doesn’t tempt us.
- Status
D
DaveBj
Guest
Where did you get the idea that he was sent to hell. He wasn’t; he was cast out of heaven “down to earth”, which I interpret as meaning that he was exiled to this physical universe.
E
egretps
Guest
He may be able to ‘Tempt’ us, but if we resist him he will flee. James 4:7 
V
vincexjt
Guest
I don’t know why God allows him to tempt us, but we have three enemys, the world, the flesh and the devil. Note that he is last.
While we should fear him, we have more to fear from the world and the flesh.
He tempts us because he is miserable, those who are in misery don’t want to feel better, they want everyone to be miserable.
While we should fear him, we have more to fear from the world and the flesh.
He tempts us because he is miserable, those who are in misery don’t want to feel better, they want everyone to be miserable.
D
dshix
Guest
God allows demons to tempt us, and he doesn’t allow humans to. It’s as simple as that.
On the other hand, I have heard rather speculative stories of very evil men who have passed possessing objects on earth similar to the way a demon would… take it with a grain of salt, however, since there are few cases where such a thing has been documented.
T
TK421
Guest
Angels are pure spirit and do not exist geographically or occupy space. They roam only in the sense of their consciousness, which is unlike our own consciousness that is more limited. The essence of the demons is always fettered to hell and its torments but they simultaneously roam the mortal world. In the book of Job, we even see Satan in the presence of God and the angels. At the Final Judgment, this will also be taken away from them, and their existence will be limited purely to hell.
God permits the demons to tempt us for the glory of God: for us to turn to him as our refuge and to be able to participate in His victory over evil. Demons are a more appropriate source to glorify God than the damned, because they were created far more powerful than mankind, which accentuates the grace of being able to overcome them.
M
mikekle
Guest
I think the Op is asking why satan/demons are given this ‘ability’ ) given that they were thrown out of heaven for literally trying to overthrow God), in a sense that is worse than ANY sin a human is even capable of, in that its just not physically or logistically possible for a human to attempt to overthrow Heaven or Gods throne.
Ive also wondered about this same topic, it does seem like satan/ demons got some special treatment.
Heck there is even that verse that mentions satan MUST be released upon the world again for a short time, (this is after he is chained in the pit for some period of time btw)…That makes no sense.
T
TK421
Guest
It isn’t physically or logistically possible for an angel to do it either. But we can still act as though it were. i.e. we can push against an Immovable Object. The only Person that can move God is God, and God does not change his mind.
An angel or human usurps God’s throne whenever they establish themselves as their own authority. It is a sin that each of us can (and sometimes do) commit.
F
friardchips
Guest
Satan can visit earth when he wants because his nature allows it yet he is rooted in Hell. It is not easy to imagine spiritual dimensions in an existence that is perceived as temporally linear (time). He can ‘travel’, if we can put it like that, or ‘be’, wherever he chooses to be, according to his powers originally given to him, when made as an angel. His demons can also do this but possibly only by express permission from him. They are essentially like an army. Imagine ‘LOTR’.
The Devil is The Tempter whereas man is not. The angels, even the fallen angels, are potentially more powerful than us, in the sense that on earth, they have power only if we give that power to them, by not focusing on God - why Adam and Eve fell - but in Hell, we would be at their ‘mercy’ - they have no sense of mercy - because in the supernatural realm, in Hell, they are more powerful than we are. And Satan and the demons hate us and would take immense pleasure in torturing the damned. There would be no saving graces to help the lost souls keep their souls away from danger.
I think it is has been known, for some people to have been ridiculed by the lost souls, in real life, but this would only be in rare circumstances, I’d have thought. But this would not so much be in the form of temptation, and more in the form of mocking. I read about such things in a Catholic magazine. But this would not negate their suffering. They are not free to move as Satan and his demons are, whose movement is as free as their rank permits, as there is still a hierarchy, even in Hell.
So essentially, condensed in succinct form: once in Hell, then no power, no freedom, and no protection.
M
mikekle
Guest
well, then like the OP asked, why are humans guilty of this same sin, not given the same treatment as satan/ demons?
satan/demons still able to influence and intermingle with the living on earth, even though they were kicked out of heaven 1000s of years ago???.
Furthermore, when a human guilty of these sins, dies, they go immediately to hell, and can have no interaction with the living at all, this is not the case for satan/demons…plus, bible says satan MUST be released upon the world again for a short time…what makes him so special, if he MUST be released again after being chained in the pit, why not human souls too?
***I almost forgot this, when the fall happened and they were kicked out of heaven, God created a place SPECIFICALLY FOR satan/ demons, (hell), so why did God not create a SPECIFIC place for human souls which are not heaven bound?
T
TK421
Guest
The only time I recall hell being coined “specifically” for demons is from a protestant interpretation of the passage where Jesus said “And he will say to those on his left, depart from me, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels”, meaning that just because it was prepared for the devil and his angels, it must have been prepared only for them, which as far as I am aware, is not an idea I have heard on the Catholic end. The angels also preceded mankind, so in the moment of their fall it might have seem only for them, but anybody that rejects grace cannot be within the grace of Heaven: that would mean their allotted place is in hell. There isn’t such a thing as a halfway point.
F
friardchips
Guest
Demons are a different creature in a different dimension, and so have a different relational composition within God’s ordered universe, and so in turn suffer the penalty, relative to their existence.
What they knew, was far beyond what we have experienced, and therefore, their Rebellion and fall from grace, consisted of a wacking great load of selfishness in one momentus shift, which consequentially propelled them straight out of Heaven and into facing in a direction, away from light.
Time doesn’t work in that way on the supernatural level.
Because Angels are not humans. They are more powerful on the supernatural level. They are still able to exact many powers relative to their angelic capability compared to the lost souls who, when living only on the supernatural level, are not Angels with such power. Humans, in Hell, are superiorly inferior beings.
His chain is that he is not facing the light. And hates us so much that he doesn’t desire to be in the light. He can be where He wants to be but according to his power as rooted in Hell, which is not as strong, as he would like, if he were properly let free. I think that if he were, he would drag many souls back to Hell with him. The ability to see and speak to demons and satan is for those more sensitive to the supernatural realm. Demons made their one choice. Apparently, demons have no senses to go by. They communicate on one level of our soul and draw us through that means. You could ask why do demons have to be released and then a last judgment. The only answer is because things have run their course and so all must find its final end. Whether death or eternal life. Demons won’t have that choice. But because demons had one choice, then their Rebellion is still running, so to speak, and therefore their last battle is a part of that. Whereas, human souls that have died and gone to Hell, are not still in rebellion, but rather have already rebelled, and their time has come and gone.
They go to Hell. Hell is a place in which the soul lives in a kind of eternal nightmare. They face from the light. And because they have chosen the same fate as demons, and demons have had access to humans, due to originally being angels of light, made to eventually be able to communicate thought and what-have -you, to humankind, then it is correct that they should continue to have this relationship (pretty bad one) with humans, accept it gets progressively worse, because like demons, the human psyche is not receiving light, and so becomes more and more enchained within the territory of the demons. The malevolent landscapes turn to a cage in the company of Satan.
Most likely, anyway.
T
tomarin
Guest
In Milton’s ‘Paradise Lost’, he certainly seems to be in Hell.
F
friardchips
Guest
Yes, although that is a work of poetry.
catholiceducation.org/en/culture/catholic-contributions/the-devil-the-fallen-angel.html
Particularly relevant is this taken from the article:
‘We believe that in the beginning, God created Satan as a good angel: The Lateran Council IV (1215) stated, “The devil and the other demons were indeed created naturally good by God, but they became evil by their own doing.” These angels irrevocably chose through their free will to rebel against God and not to serve Him. For this rebellion, they were cast into hell. Sacred Scripture attests to this belief: Our Lord, speaking of the final judgment, said, “Then [the Son of Man] will say to those on His left: ‘out of my sight, you condemned, into that everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels’”
Mt 25:41). St. Peter wrote, “Did God spare even the angels who sinned? He did not! He held them captive in Tartarus [the term in Greek mythology to indicate the place of punishment in the underworld]⦔ (2 Pt 2:4). St. John added, “The man who sins belongs to the devil, because the devil is a sinner from the beginning” (1 Jn 3:8). In sum, God created the devil as good, God punished him for his sin, and God allows his present activity. The Catechism admits, “It is a great mystery that providence should permit diabolical activity, but ‘we know that in everything God works for good with those who love him’” (No. 395).’Regarding another poster’s question, to answer from the CCC:
vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p1s2c1p7.htm
'II. THE FALL OF THE ANGELS
‘393 It is the irrevocable character of their choice, and not a defect in the infinite divine mercy, that makes the angels’ sin unforgivable. "There is no repentance for the angels after their fall, just as there is no repentance for men after death."272’
I previously said this, concerning the journey of the soul in Hell, but with reflection, think might be incorrect: “…accept it gets progressively worse, because like demons, the human psyche is not receiving light, and so becomes more and more enchained within the territory of the demons. The malevolent landscapes turn to a cage in the company of Satan.”
There is no way of knowing that souls get progressively worse in Hell. It might be that once in Hell, they are in the state they are to be, for eternity. Regarding Purgatory, the descent and ascent of a soul, through layers, is quite possible, logically.
D
DaveBj
Guest
On the other hand . . .
That would be hard to do, if he were confined to hell. Oh, and the epistles of St. Peter are Sacred Scripture, and that trumps Milton by a long shot.
M
M-Dent
Guest
Pope John Paul II offered a catechesis (August 13,1986) that included Satan and the fallen angels - which is relevant to the topic. Here are some excerpts;
T
tomarin
Guest
I’m not saying he is stuck in Hell - after all he tempts Jesus in the desert doesn’t he? But according to traditional notions he seems to rule Hell as his domain after having been cast into it.
F
friardchips
Guest
Milton doesn’t have anything to do with Scripture. It is one person’s opinion.
catholiceducation.org/en/culture/catholic-contributions/the-devil-the-fallen-angel.html
‘The devil seeks to kill the grace of God in our soul, and then take our soul to hell.’
It would be difficult for Satan to drag souls back to Hell if he couldn’t go there. No one says he doesn’t roam the earth, but it doesn’t stop him visiting Hell. I am trying to find something more conclusive but this is quite conclusive that he can also be in Hell, as Hell is a state of being, kind of place, and so for us to say he can’t go there too, is looking at things very much from the natural world of sensory perception: ‘St. Peter wrote,’“Did God spare even the angels who sinned? He did not! He held them captive in Tartarus [the term in Greek mythology to indicate the place of punishment in the underworld]⦔ (2 Pt 2:4).’
Along with all the citings to prove that Satan also roams the earth, he must surely be in Hell at some points too.
Can Satan roam the earth but also visit Hell. I contest that it is possible he can, but is not yet bound there, which happens at the end.
- Status