why is sunday instead of saturday the sabboth?

[Patrick_Murebil]

The Sabbath isn’t circumcision and vice-versa.​

I never said that; I said that your use of Sola Scriptura is unbiblical. By your use we can’t prove such Christian doctrines/teachings like the Trinity, that marriage is between a man and and a woman, or monogamy.

And yet SDAs keep claiming that eternal bonds of saturday are proven from the Bible alone.

And based on what you said above, then worshipping God on Sunday should not be a problem for you or any other SDA…and yet SDAs say over and over that there is no Biblical basis for worshipping on Sunday, and that it is against the commandments of God.

If there are answers to my 6 Questions in the Bible, it should not take you or anyone else this long to answer them.

And based on what I said in Post # 995 just above, this is your opportunity to save someone from the “jaws of the dragon”.

God bless all!!!

 

[djconklin]

If there are answers to my 6 Questions in the Bible, it should not take you or anyone else this long to answer them.

To repeat yet again: “By your use [of Sola Scriptura] we can’t prove such Christian doctrines/teachings like the Trinity, that marriage is between a man and and a woman, or monogamy.” By your standards you can make up your own religion.

One can only save those who want to be saved.

 

[Fisher]

“For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.** For we which have believed do enter into rest**, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.”

This passage of Scripture clearly evidences the fact that the Sabbath Day was only symbolic of a person’s faith (i.e., solely resting) in Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins. Mankind attempted to work his way to Heaven through self-righteousness, but he utterly failed (Romans 3:19; James 2:10). This is represented by man working 6-days prior to the Sabbath Day. Today, Jesus is our Sabbath, i.e., He is the fulfillment of what the Sabbath Day symbolized. In Christ we rest for salvation. Colossians 2:16,17 state, “…or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come…” A shadow is only cast when the sun is afar off in the distance. Once the sun rises overhead, the shadow vanishes away. Hence, when Jesus Christ fulfilled His earthly mission, He took the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross (Colossians 2:14). There is NO Sabbath Day today. It was nailed to the cross. Jesus has become our Sabbath, and in Him alone we rest for our salvation.

 

[Fisher]

Colossians 2:14,16-17

“For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it. For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.”

 

[djconklin]

This passage of Scripture clearly evidences the fact that the Sabbath Day was only symbolic of a person’s faith (i.e., solely resting) in Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins.

This passage of Scripture clearly evidences the fact that the Sabbath Day is also symbolic of a person’s faith (i.e., solely resting) in Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins. As Scripture says:

Exodus 31:13 Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you.

The physcial rest is a sign that you have accepted His work to sanctify you.

 

[djconklin]

Colossians 2:14,16-17

“For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it. For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.”

The text quoted is Heb. 4:2-4. We have already dealt with Col. 2:16-7; see the study done at 666man.net//Colossians_2_16-17_By_David_Conklin/colintro.html

BTW, thanks for the polite tone of your posts!

 

[Patrick_Murebil]

To repeat yet again: “By your use [of Sola Scriptura] we can’t prove such Christian doctrines/teachings like the Trinity, that marriage is between a man and and a woman, or monogamy.” By your standards you can make up your own religion.

One can only save those who want to be saved.

And I never asked for scriptural proof or support for the Trinity, nor for monogamy, which can be shown from the scriptures, but that is not the subject of this thread.

I only ever asked in this thread to provide scriptures to support your “Biblical” belief that saturday is binding on all Christians and is supported by scripture and most importantly by Jesus’ teachings.

Solo Scriptura is not my standard. I have no intention of making up my own religion. God has already done a much better job of that than I, or any other person or group of people, could ever accomplish even in a hundred, or so, years.

God bless all!!!

 

[happilycatholic]

Any soul can be stilled by the knowledge that Christ’s Church was founded by Him and laid in the hands of Peter with the promise to return and reclaim it. How can you come back for something you never left? No other church was around in those days. All the rest are “invented” out of disagreement of His Holy Church.

No church founded by mortal persons under doctrine created by those persons can be His church. SDAs would be better off if they would just lay down the Investigative Judgement thing and the EGW interpretations of Scripture and her visions and move on. Even if they continue to worship on Saturday, they should not continue to follow these false prophesies and doctrines totally made up. ANYTHING can be proven with Scripture. EVEN ATHEISTS (I’ve said this a million times) use Scripture to “prove” God is a merciless God.

Satan BELIEVES in God. Satan BELIEVES what’s in the Bible. Satan BELIEVES Christ died for us. But satan also BELIEVES he can use people to make us believe whatever he wants. He has used William Miller, Hiram Edson, Joseph Bates, Thomas Preble, and EGW to do just that. Satan has used these ordinary people to derail SDAs from The Truth, The Way, and The Life. They are false prophets, all of them. They stole and are still today, stealing good Christians away from God’s embrace. All because of a word “Sabbath”. You are following a “word”, not a commandment. Christ gave us a clue to this when he said His commandments would be written on our hearts and here:

“The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath; so the Son of man is Lord even of the Sabbath.” [Mark 2:27-28; RSV].

He gave his church the authority to change even the day to worship the Lord our God. Do you think He would have given that authority to a church that would fall out of existance?

Seventh-Day Adventists act like the word “Sabbath” will save them when Christ is the Word!

 

[Patrick_Murebil]

This passage of Scripture clearly evidences the fact that the Sabbath Day is also symbolic of a person’s faith (i.e., solely resting) in Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins. As Scripture says:

Exodus 31:13 Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you.

The physcial rest is a sign that you have accepted His work to sanctify you.

That makes sense…in Exodus and the OT. Where in the Gospels does Jesus teach this, even when He is teaching in detail about the law in Matthew chapters 5-7?

God bless all!!!

 

[happilycatholic]

To repeat yet again: “By your use [of Sola Scriptura] we can’t prove such Christian doctrines/teachings like the Trinity, that marriage is between a man and and a woman, or monogamy.” By your standards you can make up your own religion.

One can only save those who want to be saved.

We are asking you to prove your church’s doctrine by YOUR CHURCH’S standard, not our Church’s standard. So why can’t you do that?

 

[djconklin]

And I never asked for scriptural proof or support for the Trinity, nor for monogamy, which can be shown from the scriptures

I never said that you asked for Scriptural proof or support for the Trinity, nor for monogamy–so that’s a red-herring argument.

It is not true that proof or support for the Trinity, nor for monogamy, or that marriage is between a man and a woman can be found using your criteria of Sola Scriptura.​

We are asking you to prove your church’s doctrine by YOUR CHURCH’S standard, not our Church’s standard. So why can’t you do that?

I can. But, what is being called Sola Scriptura isn’t Sola Scriptura.​

That makes sense…in Exodus and the OT.

The Bible is one seamless whole. All mankind is saved by faith, no one is saved differently in what is called the NT as compared with what is called the OT. All mankind needs to be saved because they have sinned. Sin is transgression of God’s law. That law is the 10C’s.

 

[happilycatholic]

I never said that you asked for Scriptural proof or support for the Trinity, nor for monogamy–so that’s a red-herring argument.

It is not true that proof or support for the Trinity, nor for monogamy, or that marriage is between a man and a woman can be found using your criteria of Sola Scriptura.​

I can. But, what is being called Sola Scriptura isn’t Sola Scriptura.

Tell me, what is Sola Scriptura?

 

[inJESUS]

The Sabbath isn’t circumcision and vice-versa…

i did not say they are the same. You said you do not practice circumcision because it is not a Law but a practice, yet it is a practice of the Mosaic Law, otherwise Jews can choose not to practice it yet that isn’t an option to Jews because there is no picking and choosing.

As to the Sabbath, you said it is a Law, yet still the Sabbath has practices for it to be observed and is called a ritual. Do you abstain from:

Sowing
Plowing
Reaping
Selecting
Grinding
Sifting
Kneading
Baking
Shearing wool
Washing wool
Weaving
Sewing two stitches
Salting meat
Writing two letters
Erasing two letters
Building
Extinguishing a fire
Kindling a fire
Hitting with a hammer
Taking an object from the private domain to the public, or transporting an object in the public domain.

If you don’t, then what are are you observing if not how God tells the Jews to observe it?

Another question if you don’t mind:

“remember that you were a slave in the land of Egypt, and the L-rd, your G-d brought you forth from there with a mighty hand and with an outstretched arm; **therefore **the L-rd your G-d commanded you to observe the Sabbath day.”

do you consider yourself brought forth from slavery in Egypt and therefore you are commanded to observe the sabbath?

 

[Patrick_Murebil]

It is not true that proof or support for the Trinity, nor for monogamy, or that marriage is between a man and a woman can be found using your criteria of Sola Scriptura.​

Well…I beg to differ with your assertion above.

As for monogamy and marriage being between a man and a woman, please read the following scriptures from the Bible and the Bible alone.

Matthew 5:27-32

Matthew 14:1-4

Matthew 19:1-9

Mark 6:17-18

Mark 10:1-12

Luke 16:18

1 Corinthians chapter 7

Ephesians chapter 5

1 Timothy 3:1-3

Titus 1:5-7

God bless all!!!

 

[Marsha_Adams]

The Bible is one seamless whole. All mankind is saved by faith, no one is saved differently in what is called the NT as compared with what is called the OT. All mankind needs to be saved because they have sinned. Sin is transgression of God’s law. That law is the 10C’s.

If no one is saved differently in the NT than in the OT, why did God give a New Covenant in replacement of the Old Covenant? Why is the Old Covenant referred to as graven in stone (see 2 Cor. 3) If we are saved the same way as the OT folks, why aren’t we sacrificing lambs in the back yard? Why did Jesus have to come?

Easy answer: because we aren’t saved in the same way. They were saved by means of the Old Covenant. We are saved under the New Covenant.

 

[djconklin]

You said you do not practice circumcision because it is not a Law but a practice, yet it is a practice of the Mosaic Law,

No, it is not.

Do you abstain from: …

Yes. Those activities would be considered work.

do you consider yourself brought forth from slavery in Egypt and therefore you are commanded to observe the sabbath?

Literally, of course not. As a metaphor for sin (Egypt), Christ certainly delivered me.

Romans 11:17*And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;

Have you been grafted in? If so, then you are to receive Life from Christ and walk in His footsteps just as He walked.

 

[djconklin]

As for monogamy and marriage being between a man and a woman, please read the following scriptures from the Bible and the Bible alone.

Using your prinicple of “Sola Scriptura” where the exact words have to be used:

Matthew 5:27-32 – nothing about monogamy

Matthew 14:1-4 – nothing about monogamy; the problem was that Herodias was his brother’s wife (Leviticus 18:14).

Matthew 19:1-9 – again, nothing about monogamy.

Mark 6:17-18 – same case as in Matthew 14:1-4; this is called multiplying examples when they are one and the same.

Mark 10:1-12 – sanme case as in Matthew 19:1-9; this is called multiplying examples when they are one and the same.

Luke 16:18 – again no mention of monogamy. The text says that one cannot put away one wife and then take another. It says nothing about taking another while still married to the first.

1 Corinthians chapter 7 – no mention of monogamy.

Ephesians chapter 5 – verses 1-21 say nothing about the marriage relationship. Notice the plural “wives” in vs 22, 24; this could nbe taken as wives of one man.

1 Timothy 3:1-3 – verses 1 and 3 say nothing about monogamy. A portion of verse 2 could be read as one husband, one wife. However, that is an interpretation.

Titus 1:5-7 – again verses 5 and 7 say nothing about monogamy. The Greek literally says “one woman man.” If you wish to interpret that as monogamy that isn’t what the Greek says.

 

[djconklin]

If no one is saved differently in the NT than in the OT, why did God give a New Covenant in replacement of the Old Covenant?

The New covenant isn’t literally a “replacement” of the Old. In the new covenant, the old is written on the hearts:

Jeremiah 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

Even in the “old” the law was to be in the heart:

Isaiah 51:7 Hearken unto me, ye that know righteousness, the people in whose heart is my law; fear ye not the reproach of men, neither be ye afraid of their revilings.

If we are saved the same way as the OT folks, why aren’t we sacrificing lambs in the back yard? Why did Jesus have to come?

The lambs were symbolic of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world:

Revelation 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

So, when He came and died ofr our sins the laws that pertained to His sacrifice passed away (were nailed to the Cross):

Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Easy answer: because we aren’t saved in the same way.

It is an old adage that for every complex problem there is an easy and wrong answer. Man has always been saved by faith.

Romans 4:9*¶ Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness.

Hebrews 11:7 By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.

 

[happilycatholic]

EGW again leads the flock astray on the matter of eternal hell. Christ tells us one thing, EGW has her own belief. She believes hell to be repugnant. Well, howdy doody.

“How repugnant to every emotion of love and mercy, and even to our sense of justice, is the doctrine that the wicked dead are tormented with fire and brimstone in an eternally burning hell. . . . And how utterly revolting is the belief that as soon as the breath leaves the body the soul of the impenitent is consigned to the flames of hell! … the doctrine of natural immortality first borrowed from pagan philosophy, and in the darkness of the great apostasy incorporated into the Christian faith, has supplanted the truth. . . . The theory of eternal torment is one of the false doctrines that constitute the wine of the abomination of Babylon. . . . But those who have not, through repentance and faith, secured pardon, must receive the penalty of transgression … covered with infamy, they sink into hopeless, eternal oblivion. . . . There will then be no lost souls to blaspheme God as they writhe in never-ending torment; no wretched beings in hell will mingle their shrieks with the songs of the saved” (Ellen White, The Great Controversy, pp. 469, 470, 477, 478, 483).”

 

[inJESUS]

No, it is not.

i don’t understand. If circumcision is a practice, isn’t it a practice within the Mosaic law?

Yes. Those activities would be considered work.