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SingleMomMonica
Guest
Hi Jane,
For years I had no clue either. Always fun to learn someting new
I now have a copy of each Bible: Protestant, Catholic and Orthodox.
Merry Christmas to you too!
Monica
Why is the birth of Mother Mary not mentioned in the Holy Bible (66 books?)
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For years I had no clue either. Always fun to learn someting new
I now have a copy of each Bible: Protestant, Catholic and Orthodox.
Merry Christmas to you too!
Monica
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dvdjs
Guest
SMM you are misinformed about Orthodox teaching. Perhaps you are stretching things to differentiate it from Catholic teaching. You are flirting with heresy.
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PJM
Guest
***Dear friend, a point of correction and a point of clairification.
The [real and ORGINAL] Bible [the ONE God signed off on] has 73 Books, not 66.
And we find refernce to Mary in Gen. 3:15] will put enmity between you and the woman,
and between your seed and her seed; he shall bruise your head,and you shall bruise his heel."
Tradition holds that Mary too was born of very aged parents, which is why she was offered to God as a "Temple Virgin"by her parents at a young age, which explains her high degree of educationa and knowledge of Scirpture.
May’s Birth itself is not specified because in the Wisdom of God, her birth was not to overshadow the Birth of her Son Jesus.
Love and prayers,***
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Pons
Guest
Because the Gnostic traditions are wrong.
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choy
Guest
Mary’s birth is found in the Protoevangelium of James
newadvent.org/fathers/0847.htm
i think it wasn’t included in the bible because the origin of the book could not be verified, although it is one of the older texts not to be included in the Bible. you’ll find that the stories are consistent with a lot of tradition surrounding Mary’s birth. it also fills up a lot of the other details especially concerning about the brothers of Jesus.
newadvent.org/fathers/0847.htm
i think it wasn’t included in the bible because the origin of the book could not be verified, although it is one of the older texts not to be included in the Bible. you’ll find that the stories are consistent with a lot of tradition surrounding Mary’s birth. it also fills up a lot of the other details especially concerning about the brothers of Jesus.
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planten
Guest
Mary, the respected mother is mentioned in the last verse (verse 12) of chapter 66 of Quran as follows:
**[66:12] وَمَرْيَمَ ابْنَتَ عِمْرٰنَ الَّتِىْۤ اَحْصَنَتْ فَرْجَهَا فَنَفَخْنَا فِيْهِ مِنْ رُّوْحِنَا وَصَدَّقَتْ بِكَلِمٰتِ رَبِّهَا وَكُتُبِهٖ وَكَانَتْ مِنَ الْقٰنِتِيْنَ **
[66:12] And the example of Mary, the daughter of ‘Imran, who guarded her private parts — so We breathed into him of Our Spirit — and she fulfilled in her person the words of her Lord and His Books and was one of the obedient.
Also, the prophet Muhammad said : “There is no new born that the Satan does not smite and he/she (new born) cries out except Mary and her son (Jesus).”
It means that Satan does not disturb or tempt Mary and her son and the people like them. Those who are endowed with a soul like Mary and her son are not disturbed (smitten) by the cursed devil. The above Hadith is a difficult one to understand. It is not to be taken literally. Even most Muslims do not understand its meaning (Implication).
In the above verse, some of the believeing men and women are likened to Mary. In verse 11 they are likened to the wife of King Pharoah i.e. Aasia.
**[66:12] وَمَرْيَمَ ابْنَتَ عِمْرٰنَ الَّتِىْۤ اَحْصَنَتْ فَرْجَهَا فَنَفَخْنَا فِيْهِ مِنْ رُّوْحِنَا وَصَدَّقَتْ بِكَلِمٰتِ رَبِّهَا وَكُتُبِهٖ وَكَانَتْ مِنَ الْقٰنِتِيْنَ **
[66:12] And the example of Mary, the daughter of ‘Imran, who guarded her private parts — so We breathed into him of Our Spirit — and she fulfilled in her person the words of her Lord and His Books and was one of the obedient.
Also, the prophet Muhammad said : “There is no new born that the Satan does not smite and he/she (new born) cries out except Mary and her son (Jesus).”
It means that Satan does not disturb or tempt Mary and her son and the people like them. Those who are endowed with a soul like Mary and her son are not disturbed (smitten) by the cursed devil. The above Hadith is a difficult one to understand. It is not to be taken literally. Even most Muslims do not understand its meaning (Implication).
In the above verse, some of the believeing men and women are likened to Mary. In verse 11 they are likened to the wife of King Pharoah i.e. Aasia.
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ronin67
Guest
Code:
The way Catholics say it seem to confuse Protestants (it use to confuse me and cause a little anger in me). When Catholics say the Mother of God, Protestant minds think directly of God the Father and will say "How can she be the Mother of God the Father". I think it should always be addressed as "Mother of God, the Son". Wouldn't this be the accurate way to say it? Please correct me if I'm wrong.Ed
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Gabriel_of_12
Guest
The first Protoevangelium Genesis 3:14
Then the LORD God said to the serpent: “Because you have done this, you shall be banned from all the animals and from all the wild creatures; On your belly shall you crawl, and dirt shall you eat all the days of your life.
15
3** I will put enmity between you and the woman,** and between your offspring and hers; He will strike at your head, while you strike at his heel.”
16
To the woman he said: "I will intensify the pangs of your childbearing; in pain shall you bring forth children. Yet your urge shall be for your husband, and he shall be your master."
The blessed Virgin Mary’s birth is hidden in the Word of God from the serpent, because God placed enmity between the Woman (Mary) and the serpent. The Prophet Isaiah also mentions in his prophecy that the Blessed Virgin Mary is without orginal sin, because she safely delivers a male child before the birth pangs from orginal sin that cursed woman in child bearing.
Isaiah 66:7
2 Before she comes to labor, she gives birth; Before the pains come upon her, she safely delivers a male child.
8
Who ever heard of such a thing, or saw the like?
There are many scriptures that foretell of the blessed Virgin Mary’s birth, but hidden from the serpent, who has been waiting for her arrival since the fall of man. The ancient biblical study of typology reveals all these mysteries from the Septuagint scriptures (Hebrew to Greek translation of the Old Testament)
“We walk by faith not by sight”.
Then the LORD God said to the serpent: “Because you have done this, you shall be banned from all the animals and from all the wild creatures; On your belly shall you crawl, and dirt shall you eat all the days of your life.
15
3** I will put enmity between you and the woman,** and between your offspring and hers; He will strike at your head, while you strike at his heel.”
16
To the woman he said: "I will intensify the pangs of your childbearing; in pain shall you bring forth children. Yet your urge shall be for your husband, and he shall be your master."
The blessed Virgin Mary’s birth is hidden in the Word of God from the serpent, because God placed enmity between the Woman (Mary) and the serpent. The Prophet Isaiah also mentions in his prophecy that the Blessed Virgin Mary is without orginal sin, because she safely delivers a male child before the birth pangs from orginal sin that cursed woman in child bearing.
Isaiah 66:7
2 Before she comes to labor, she gives birth; Before the pains come upon her, she safely delivers a male child.
8
Who ever heard of such a thing, or saw the like?
There are many scriptures that foretell of the blessed Virgin Mary’s birth, but hidden from the serpent, who has been waiting for her arrival since the fall of man. The ancient biblical study of typology reveals all these mysteries from the Septuagint scriptures (Hebrew to Greek translation of the Old Testament)
“We walk by faith not by sight”.
S
SingleMomMonica
Guest
Hi Ed,
I hear what you’re saying, but it was the Holy Spirit through the Council of Ephesus in 431 confirmed that Mary is the Theotokos, that is the Mother of God and condemning the heretic, the first person to deny it, Nestorius who’d begun teaching that Mary was the Kristotokos, that means the Mother of Christ. By calling Mary the Mother of Christ or Jesus is to deny the Divinity of Christ Jesus. If Jesus Christ is not God, not part of the Holy Trinity, then what is He to us? Our Christian Faith is meaningless if Mary is not the Mother of God. To truly be Christians, we Must confess with our whole heart that Mary IS the Mother of God!
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ronin67
Guest
Code:
Thanks for the explaination. Mother Mary is the Mother of God (who came in the form of Christ/thus Mother of God in the sense of Christ Jesus/God in the flesh)/ One part of the Holy Trinity. I don't understand, how she could be the Mother of God the Father/Creator who exsisted before everyone and anything was created. Please explain? I'm not denying the fact she is the Mother of God, when he came in the flesh as Christ Jesus our savior, one part of the Holy Trinity. (name removed by moderator)ut please.Ed
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ronin67
Guest
Great Answer!!! I concur immensely!!! If we all had the great will that our Holy Mother Mary had and always refrained from sin, this world would be great!!!
Take care and May God Bless!
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SingleMomMonica
Guest
There is only One God. When Mary took the Word into her womb, she took this One God into her womb and gave birth to Him Who is King of all.
We human women are not the source of the immortal soul of our children, Mary was not the source of God.
We human women are mothers to our children - body and immortal soul, Mary is the Mother of Jesus - Humanity and Divinity. To say she is the Mother of only His Humanity is to say that He is only Human and not Divine.
I am truly the mother of my children and Mary truly is the Mother of God.
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ronin67
Guest
Now you are starting to confuse the Protestant in me. Holy Trinity (Father, Son, Holy Spirit) all of God, but yet three distinct in nature. Yes, she is the Mother of God, the Son. Jesus is God in the flesh (word turned flesh), yet isn’t she the Mother of the manifestation of God the son (part of the Holy Trinity), not the entire Trinity? Can some others please provide (name removed by moderator)ut here? I understand your point ma’am (my answer isn’t to make you mad), but is it really correct to say that Mother Mary is the Mother of the entire Godhead? If this is the case, then wouldn’t she then rank higher than the Holy Trinity (which we know she doesn’t, because Catholics say they don’t worship Mary or need her for salvation). Clarification is needed. The complexity of the Holy Trinity is at stake here.
Take Care and God Bless!
Ed
Take Care and May God Bless!
Ed
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Jerok
Guest
No, the Trinity is 3 person of 1 nature, not 3 persons of 3 natures (polytheism) or 1 person of 3 natures (???) etc. 3 Person (Father, Son, Holy Spirit) of one divine nature (God). All encompass infinity in everything; there is nothing one can do that the other can’t, except in terms of their relationships to each other (Father begetting Son, Father + Son begetting The Holy Spirit.)
She was the Mother of Christ, 1 person of the Holy Trinity, who is FULLY God, so she is the mother of God. Not just the person of Christ, but the Divine nature of Christ too… and since there’s only 1 nature, she’s the mother of God.
This is a mystery to understand in human terms, and I’m not even sure how it all works, but I have hope that I’ll understand completely in heaven
J
Jerok
Guest
Also, this doesn’t make her higher than God. All her power comes through God. This makes her the mother of God (who is timeless, so there is no time issues, none that we can understand anyway)
Also, note the Fifth Commandment, ‘Honor thy Father and Mother’. Jesus keeps these commandments perfectly! And how great an honor does he show to Mary, the greatest of all us humans, to make her Queen of Heaven! She has the highest seat in heaven aside from the Trinity, but she is not part of the Trinity.
To put it in this way; If I have a son who becomes King, I am not of equal power to him, he may even shun me. However, if he’s a good son, he will show me the highest respect and offer me a place of honor in his kingdom. Just as the Trinity did for Mary.
Also, note the Fifth Commandment, ‘Honor thy Father and Mother’. Jesus keeps these commandments perfectly! And how great an honor does he show to Mary, the greatest of all us humans, to make her Queen of Heaven! She has the highest seat in heaven aside from the Trinity, but she is not part of the Trinity.
To put it in this way; If I have a son who becomes King, I am not of equal power to him, he may even shun me. However, if he’s a good son, he will show me the highest respect and offer me a place of honor in his kingdom. Just as the Trinity did for Mary.
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SingleMomMonica
Guest
God only has One Nature and that is God. God is Father, God is Son and God is the Holy Spirit. 3 Persons (free, unique and relational) 1 God.
The only correct way to say it is how the Holy Spirit through the Council said is: Mary is the Mother of God. Period.
Not Mother of God the Son, Not Mother of Godhead, but Mary the Mother of God. Jesus was God from all eternity before God chose Mary to be His Mother. Mary is not the source of His Divinity, nor His immortal soul, she is the source of His physical body, but Mother of the entire Person of Jesus and He is fully Divine and fully Human. She not the Mother of only part of her Son, but Mother of her entire Son. She is the Mother of God.
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SingleMomMonica
Guest
Two corrections, otherwise your post is good.No, the Trinity is 3 person of 1 nature, not 3 persons of 3 natures (polytheism) or 1 person of 3 natures (???) etc. 3 Person (Father, Son, Holy Spirit) of one divine nature (God). All encompass infinity in everything; there is nothing one can do that the other can’t, except in terms of their relationships to each other (Father begetting Son, Father + Son begetting The Holy Spirit.)
She was the Mother of Christ, 1 person of the Holy Trinity, who is FULLY God, so she is the mother of God. Not just the person of Christ, but the Divine nature of Christ too… and since there’s only 1 nature, she’s the mother of God.
This is a mystery to understand in human terms, and I’m not even sure how it all works, but I have hope that I’ll understand completely in heaven
First the Holy Spirit is not “begotten” from the Father and the Son, He “proceeds” from the Father. This is the Faith of the Church given to us by the Holy Spirit in the 1st & 2nd Ecumenical Councils.
Proceeding and being Begotten are two different things all together. The Holy Spirit proceeds and the Son is begotten. The eternal source of both is God the Father Almighty.
Second it is the Nestorian Heresy to say that Mary is the Mother of Christ. It’s that title which the Council was called together over and the Holy Spirit through the 3rd Council comdemned Nestorious for teaching that Mary is the Mother of Christ. The Council ruled it to be a Heresy.
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SingleMomMonica
Guest
Great post!
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Charlie_Zeaiter
Guest
With respect, Catholics don’t have to word their doctrines to appease the Protestants.
You know, I wouldn’t be surprised if Catholics worded their doctrines to spite the Protestants.
But to put things in context, Thomas didn’t say “My Lord and my God the Son”… he said “My Lord and my God” (John 20:28).
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Lapey
Guest
I have not read the entire thread so I may be repeating something already stated. If so I apologize.
With that said, all of these births, although possible inspired by Godly supernaturalism, have something in common that the conception and birth of Jesus does not, and that is natural sexual intercourse.
No church teaching, bible teaching or doctrine states that these listed conceptions took place any different than yours or mine, only for a different purpose. The Church teaching on Mary’s conception does not state that she was conceived without sex, only without original sin, and I personally believe that my God can accomplish that feat, because He is God. That’s enough for me.
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