Why is the Catholic Church Anti-gun?

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Black_Jaque

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I see that the USCCB and even my homestate’s Catholic lobby is anti-gun.

I’ve read through some of the material, and so far I can’t see them citing any particular teaching that this stems from. It appears that the Church is just approaching this as a matter of prudential judgement.

Is it OK to disagree?

I’m kind of annoyed that my tithe is going toward this type of lobbying.
 
Black Jaque:
I see that the USCCB and even my homestate’s Catholic lobby is anti-gun.

I’ve read through some of the material, and so far I can’t see them citing any particular teaching that this stems from. It appears that the Church is just approaching this as a matter of prudential judgement.

Is it OK to disagree?

I’m kind of annoyed that my tithe is going toward this type of lobbying.
I’m British but it seems an odd question you ask.
Everybody in every country should be anti-gun. There is nothing positive about having a gun. Pretending they are needed for self protection is not a valid argument.
In the UK nobody is allowed guns yet gun related murders and crimes are less in our entire country than a major city in the USA.
 
Guns are a part of American culture - we romanticize guns. If you want to view a bit of anti-gun propaganda (with a lot of humor) Micheal Moore’s Bowling for Columbine explores this territory.

The USCCB also takes a stand against the dealth penalty, which is another romanticized facet of American culture. But a firm stand against the death penalty is not required by Catholic teaching. I am guessing the same is true of gun laws.

Black Jaque, do you have some links to the websites you looked at?
 
Kind of ironic for a person from the UK to be telling a person from the US that there’s nothing good about having a gun. Yes I suppose that is true for Britain, there was nothing good about colonists having guns (except for the fact that we brought our guns to your aid twice in the 20th century).

But you express a personal point of view, and it doesn’t appear to be backed by Catholic teaching. I’m more interested in what the Church teaches and why the USCCB seems to be taking a stance on this issue rather than simply informing us of church teaching and letting the laity to the laity’s job.
 
Black Jaque:
Kind of ironic for a person from the UK to be telling a person from the US that there’s nothing good about having a gun. Yes I suppose that is true for Britain, there was nothing good about colonists having guns (except for the fact that we brought our guns to your aid twice in the 20th century).

But you express a personal point of view, and it doesn’t appear to be backed by Catholic teaching. I’m more interested in what the Church teaches and why the USCCB seems to be taking a stance on this issue rather than simply informing us of church teaching and letting the laity to the laity’s job.
You shouldn’t mention the two wars. Yes Europe is grateful but if you had come sooner there would have been less dead. As it was in WWII the UK had to stand alone waiting for your help after Europe had been taken over by the nazis.

Then you go back nearly 300 years when you were our colony. What relevance has that to present day.

Nether of the above has anything to do with the topic which is about personal guns, and not guns carried by soldiers.
Yes its my personal view as I don’t know if there is an official Church teaching but do you honestly think the Catholic Church could be in favour of people other than police or military having guns.
 
I must confess that I generally find it difficult to take seriously anything promoted by the USCCB. The Catholic Church is neither against guns nor for them. Guns are simply tools. The same is true with any other weapon. Guns may be used legitimately or they may be used illegitimately.
 
The bible says we have the right to defend ourselves. Citizens have the right to carry arms. This is something the laity should be addressing not the bishops. Another example of bishops acting like laity instead of shepards.
 
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thistle:
You shouldn’t mention the two wars. Yes Europe is grateful but if you had come sooner there would have been less dead. As it was in WWII the UK had to stand alone waiting for your help after Europe had been taken over by the nazis.

Then you go back nearly 300 years when you were our colony. What relevance has that to present day.

Nether of the above has anything to do with the topic which is about personal guns, and not guns carried by soldiers.
Yes its my personal view as I don’t know if there is an official Church teaching but do you honestly think the Catholic Church could be in favour of people other than police or military having guns.
What’s wrong with people owning guns in order to hunt? There are many legitimate reasons for owning a gun.
 
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DreadVandal:
What’s wrong with people owning guns in order to hunt? There are many legitimate reasons for owning a gun.
Why would anyone want to kill innocent animals?
Its barbaric!!
 
I forgot to add:

Respect for the integrity of creation

CCC 2415 The seventh commandment enjoins respect for the integrity of creation. Animals, like plants and inanimate beings, are by nature destined for the common good of past, present, and future humanity.195 Use of the mineral, vegetable, and animal resources of the universe cannot be divorced from respect for moral imperatives. Man’s dominion over inanimate and other living beings granted by the Creator is not absolute; it is limited by concern for the quality of life of his neighbor, including generations to come; it requires a religious respect for the integrity of creation.196

CCC 2416 Animals are God’s creatures. He surrounds them with his providential care. By their mere existence they bless him and give him glory.197 Thus men owe them kindness. We should recall the gentleness with which saints like St. Francis of Assisi or St. Philip Neri treated animals.
 
I think this is one of those issues that is unecessarily politicized. There are valid points to be made on both sides of the argument.

Here’s my solution for handguns.
  1. You gotta have a FOID card to own a gun or buy ammo.
  2. Only licensed dealers in fixed locations can sell guns.
  3. Every gun made must have its ballistic signature recorded and filed by serial number and dealer it was sold to.
  4. Dealers must keep records of who buys what gun by serial number.
  5. Individuals CAN’T sell guns, except back to licensed dealers.
  6. Dealers must track used gun sales just like new ones.
  7. Handguns are limited to two per person. Gotta trade an old one to get a new one.
  8. Background checks and 48 hour waiting period for all handgun sales. No felons eligible to own one.
  9. All handguns must include a built-in locking mechanism on the hammer that requires a key to unlock.
There. Any law abiding citizen can own a gun. Dealers, not the government have the names of who owns them. Probably not cheap since I just eliminated all gun shows and private sales and required an expensive lock mechanism, but tough. Plus cops have at least a decent shot at finding the owner of a gun by tracking the signature of the bullet in a victim.
 
Yes there is a lot to do with personal guns in all of the above wars.

For one, perhaps on the side of the British regulars it is only about soldiers carrying guns. But from the perspective of the colonists, it was the regular citizens having guns that stood up to the British regulars (although not very well in every instance).

For two, many of the young lads that went over to Europe were carrying Government Issue weapons. But they weren’t a whole lot different than the weapons the young men grew up with. They still had sights, fired bullets, recoiled, and were deadly.

It takes time to train a soldier. And it takes money. In order to defend itself a country must either maintain a standing army, or have a way of quickly calling up an army. Maintaining a standing army is a horribly expensive burden on a nation (might have something to do with the economic decay in American cities and the consequential gun violence). And having an army on reserve is cheaper, but getting the men trained quickly is a challenge.

That challenge of training men is all the more simplified when the drill sargeant doesn’t have to explain to the young boys which end of the gun is the dangerous end.

Yes I honestly think the Catholic Church could be in favor of people other than police and military having firearms. There are a number of teachings she has in the catechism that support it. For one, those who have the grave duty to defend others have the right to use arms. As long as I’m responsible for the safety of my family, I have a right to use arms. Just because there is a police force out there to help me with my duty doesn’t mean I’m relieved of my duty.
 
Why is the Catholic Church Anti-gun?
Beacuse guns are horrible items, that can perform only one task DEATH. The question is actually why is the church not Anti - gun?
I’m British but it seems an odd question you ask.
Everybody in every country should be anti-gun. There is nothing positive about having a gun. Pretending they are needed for self protection is not a valid argument.
In the UK nobody is allowed guns yet gun related murders and crimes are less in our entire country than a major city in the USA.
YAY!! 🙂
 
Black Jaque:
Yes there is a lot to do with personal guns in all of the above wars.

For one, perhaps on the side of the British regulars it is only about soldiers carrying guns. But from the perspective of the colonists, it was the regular citizens having guns that stood up to the British regulars (although not very well in every instance).

For two, many of the young lads that went over to Europe were carrying Government Issue weapons. But they weren’t a whole lot different than the weapons the young men grew up with. They still had sights, fired bullets, recoiled, and were deadly.

It takes time to train a soldier. And it takes money. In order to defend itself a country must either maintain a standing army, or have a way of quickly calling up an army. Maintaining a standing army is a horribly expensive burden on a nation (might have something to do with the economic decay in American cities and the consequential gun violence). And having an army on reserve is cheaper, but getting the men trained quickly is a challenge.

That challenge of training men is all the more simplified when the drill sargeant doesn’t have to explain to the young boys which end of the gun is the dangerous end.

Yes I honestly think the Catholic Church could be in favor of people other than police and military having firearms. There are a number of teachings she has in the catechism that support it. For one, those who have the grave duty to defend others have the right to use arms. As long as I’m responsible for the safety of my family, I have a right to use arms. Just because there is a police force out there to help me with my duty doesn’t mean I’m relieved of my duty.
That might well be legally allowed but it doesn’t make it morally right. The more guns around the more the shootings will happen.
I had a look in the CCC but could not see anything. Can you please refer me to the section on the teachings you have seen in the Catechism?
 
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thistle:
Why would anyone want to kill innocent animals?
Its barbaric!!
For food, to defend domesticated livestock, to cull overpopulated herds and prevent wild animal starvation-- lots and lots of reasons.
 
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DreadVandal:
What’s wrong with people owning guns in order to hunt? There are many legitimate reasons for owning a gun.
Does anyone have a quote of the wording of the USCCB statement?

Most discussions of weapon ownership make a distinction between hunting rifles or guns for collectors or target shooting, and side arms.

Thistle, as an anglophile, I apologize for my countryman’s whipping out the old standard Ugly American 1776, 1917, and 1941 statement but and correct me if I wrong, but didn’t hand gun assaults recently go up in the UK despite recent crackdowns?

I realize that gun ownership is a protected right and that crime is a complex thing with a cyclical nature that often defies correlation with anti-crime measures
However, Crimes with hand guns are a fact, accidents with hand guns are a fact…for those of you who said that the bishops shouldn’t be concerned, couldn’t the case be made that eliminating the weapons is a way of avoiding the temptation to use them and isn’t the physical safety of people part of respecting the dignity of life?
 
There. Any law abiding citizen can own a gun.
OK that’s fine and dandy. Then all we need to do is redefine “Law-abiding citizen”. So when it becomes illegal to speak out against homosexuality, or as a pharmacist you refuse to pass out birth control, or as a nurse you refuse to participate in abortions, or as a parent you discipline your child, THEN you will no longer be a law-abiding citizen. And of course, you would be way too dangerous to own a gun. So when you want to buy one, you will be denied.
 
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thistle:
I forgot to add:

Respect for the integrity of creation

CCC 2415 The seventh commandment enjoins respect for the integrity of creation. Animals, like plants and inanimate beings, are by nature destined for the common good of past, present, and future humanity.195 Use of the mineral, vegetable, and animal resources of the universe cannot be divorced from respect for moral imperatives. Man’s dominion over inanimate and other living beings granted by the Creator is not absolute; it is limited by concern for the quality of life of his neighbor, including generations to come; it requires a religious respect for the integrity of creation.196

CCC 2416 Animals are God’s creatures. He surrounds them with his providential care. By their mere existence they bless him and give him glory.197 Thus men owe them kindness. We should recall the gentleness with which saints like St. Francis of Assisi or St. Philip Neri treated animals.
So I take it you are a vegetarian and you hold vegetarianism to be morally obligatory?
 
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