Why is the Eastern Orthodox Church false?

[Ignatios]

Quote:
Halleluyah

The above is in response to my comment that the RCC very much believes that there is only a heaven and a hell, within which there are many abodes. Yes. We are in total agreement. That you are surprised at this is troubling. It isn’t just my view. It is the theological construct under which the RCC operates. There is no disagreement between our churches here.
Quote:
Catholics believe that the righteous immediately go to heaven…you said…The Orthodox say that …But both the souls of the holy and the righteous go indisputably to paradise, but NOT YET, and that because …“go to my Post#754…” they depart immediately either to joy, or to sorrow and lamentation though confessedly neither their enjoyment, nor condemnation are complete. "…and then …read John 5:28-29 … 28Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
Then where do the righteous immediately go if not paradise? There are only two states according to you - heaven and hades. Which one of these states do the righteous currently find themselves in? I asked you this question before, and here is what you said then:
Quote:
But both the souls of the holy and the righteous go indisputably to paradise and those of the sinners go to hades, of whom the profane and those who have sinned unforgivably are punished forever and those who have offended forgivably and moderately hope to gain freedom through the unspeakable mercy of God.
forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost…&postcount=778

It is a simple question: what state are the souls of righteous in now. Is it heaven or hades? There are only two states. Where are the souls of the just right now?

I gave you the answer multiple times and you still ask it …sigh …go back and read what I have been saying and quoting for you in the past “Humpteen” posts.

I admire the fact that you can write in three languages, but your statement was a little bit difficult to understand from a purely linguistic standpoint. Let’s not dwell upon it any longer.

ok ok, I am glad that you decided to do this after I have almost begged you before to stop.

Correct, **"I didn’t say others "**had pointed it out to you. I just said it has been pointed out to you. Why you would think I was referring to myself is puzzling since I just started debating you on the subject. Here it is for you:

…And then you posted this:

Quote:
Using dictionary.com to define theological terms is probably a bad idea, as has been pointed out to you multiple times.
forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost…&postcount=766

…And here is my evidence, the “strawman” is still well and kicking.
HERE READ YOUR WORDS :

I take it then that you don’t disagree with the council of Jerusalem…

…I said that {(“others”)} have pointed it out to you. Do I really need to go back and show you the many times that’s been pointed out to you? Seriously. Wouldn’t that be a waste of time since you know it has been?..

Now. Do I really need to go find the other instances I know exist in the nearly 800 posts in this thread?

O LORD HELP ME †††…REEEEEEEEAAAAAAD and COMPREHEND for Pete’s sake’s …
Here is where the argument is>>>>”…Using dictionary.com to define theological terms is probably a bad idea, as has been pointed out to you multiple times…”
I asked you to show me where it was pinted out for me multiple times, THAT Using dictionary.com to define theological terms is probably a bad idea,…
You, Answered this>>>>”… Originally Posted by Chaldean Rite
Regarding Purgatory, whatever you quoted above was just words form a dictionary, here is what the Church has to say about it in the Catechism, which can be found here:
stwalburgas.blogspot.com/2008…purgatory.html…”
Where it says the “Key words” bad idea, Theological terms … and then he posts a Brain washing site to get the Eastern Catholics to accept the Purgatory Innovation…
And then I showed the truth about Purgatory from your own church from a RC sites such as the new advent…OH BOY I got a headache…lol.

I can see that this discussion has hit a new low. Now you want to use common dictionary terms, which you don’t even link to, and then place “etc.” in the middle of them. Not only that, but the unattributed definitions you just gave don’t come near to explaining what the EO mean by hell. They do not believe in “equal torment.” They teach of different abodes in hell by your own admission. Unbelievable.

LOOOOOOOOOL it became so sad to a point, now I laugh instead of cry.
Tdgesq, I WAS RESPONDING TO YOUR COMMENT, in your previous post, when you reffered to the terms of hell and Heaven are not valid from the dictionary, so what I did I showed you that it is…Since we are NOT trying to understand the Theology of the words but the meaning, such as if I came from different country and I wanted to say the word “hell” I would go to a dictionary, NOT Theology
As for the rest, it is becoming evident what level of knowledge I am conversing with, and for sure this is not a debate.

Then let’s use dictionary.com to define the trinity, God, incarnation, scripture, tradition. There is a reason why there are theological dictionaries and encyclopedias. There is a reason why there are medical and legal dictionaries. The reason is that words of common usage do not mean the same thing in specialized fields – like RC theology. Until you acknowledge this, there can be no further discussion between us. I am too busy to rebut juvenile assertions that the common dictionary is sufficient to define specialized theological terms. Let me know when you are prepared to be rational on this point so that we can continue.

The Holy Trinity is not an Innovation nor is GOD neither is the Scriptures.
Purgatory is human made word and it is not Theology , but Ideology
Yes and we are talking about the “meaning of the word” what the word means, so in another words, if you don’t mean what you say and you say what you don’t mean, then what would that makes you???
And thanks GOD that you decided to stop, since I myself got reaaaaaaaaly tired of this pulling hair and teeth sort of thing.
Every time I say the word Elephant I got to run to the zoo and get you an Elephant so you will know what I am talking about, and still yet you cant comprehend it.
Maybe we will get together another time when you have had your “study and Search” done right. GOD bless.

ZEEEEE END .

 

[anthony022071]

[Ignatios]

Purgatory is human made word and it is not Theology , but Ideology

Human made word? What words do we speak that were not made by humans? Purgatory is a matter of theology,because it means God will purify us with fire after we die,so that we may enter heaven. Where is the ideology in that?

See posts 788,789,793.

 

[Chaldean_Rite]

Do the various Orthodox churches tell their penitents do some some sort of penance after they are done confessing their sins? (ie: feed the poor, various prayers, fast, etc)

If so, what is the POINT of this? Honestly. Is it not temporal punishment due to sin? See, the problem with Orthodox lacking a place that is not earth for temporal punishment is what if you do NOT complete your penance on earth while you are still alive? Or what if your penance was not satisfactory to God’s standards? What happens then? God is just and He will require perfect satisfaction, and this is what Purgatory is for.

 

[Chaldean_Rite]

OH BOY I got a headache…lol.

Ignorancio, I would too if I were you, you seem so very confused.

 

[Ignatios]

anthony:

Human made word? What words do we speak that were not made by humans?..

Well, we can go in a very big discussion concerning the Origin of the words wether it is from human in origin or not according to the Bible in relation to your comment above, But I know what you mean.

Ok, my mistake on this one, but what I meant to say is the concept of Purgatory starting from the name itself to include most of its contents is of human thoughts by origin therefore it is Ideology and not Theology.
For when you speak of the knowledge of GOD ( Theology), you only can speak of what had been revealed to you not assuming things of your mind.

Purgatory is a matter of theology,because it means God will purify us with fire after we die,so that we may enter heaven. Where is the ideology in that?

All of the aboveis !!! then my question is …where is the theology in that?

How and why is it Theology ?

Your teaching is not only through (purgatorial) fire, but also through torment, tortures and suffering in a Purging Place ( Purgatorium) and then through Indulgences wich it contains prayer for the dead (No problem with prayer for the dead) and it is topped by a peice of Paper from the Pope that would permit those who are suffering beyond this life to be released from their tortures or shortened their time in their.

.
I told you that Purgatory contains more then what you have mentioned above, and Again what you have posted is a part of only one element of the complete contents of Purgatory and it can be interpreted to many things if you only stick to what you have posted in the above that is, BUT it is not only this, things would become obvious when you include ALL the contents of Purgatory.

anthony we just went around the block a couple of times already concerning this, So please pick something new to talk about.
chaldeanRite:

If so, what is the POINT of this**?** Honestly.** Is it not temporal punishment due to sin?** See, the problem with Orthodox lacking a place that is not earth for temporal punishment is what if you do NOT complete your penance on earth while you are still alive? Or **what if your penance was not satisfactory to God’s standards? **What happens then? God is just and He will require perfect satisfaction, and this is what Purgatory is for.

Notice all the “IFs” and the “WHATs” and then"WHAT IFs" etc…
THATS EXACTLY what your Purgatory is built upon and that is exactly why your purgatory is an Ideology and Not theology this is precisely what I am trying to explain to you all
ChaldeanRite:

Ignorancio, I would too if I were you, you seem so very confused.

Your words spoke much of you. it is obvious that you gained more “intelligence” from the time of your last Post

So now shall we go to another subject, or you guys wanna dwell on this one?

 

[tdgesq]

Ignorancio, I would too if I were you, you seem so very confused.

Indeed. As is the entire Orthodox communion on this issue. They don’t agree with one another, yet when the RCC doesn’t agree with their particular version then it must be wrong. Here’s a nice analysis of Ignatios’ “unique” version of the afterlife.

At a synod held in Constantinople this year, the Orthodox made the following pronouncement regarding the state of the dead and the existence of purgatory:

“[W]e the godly, following the truth and turning away from such innovations, confess and accept two places for the souls of the dead, paradise and hell, for the righteous and sinners, as the holy Scripture teaches us. We do not accept a third place, a purgatory, by any means, since neither Scripture nor the holy Fathers have taught us any such thing.

So there are only two places for the soul - heaven and hell. Notice how Ignatious objects to the use of the term “place” when Catholics use it, but not when a local council of Constantinople uses it. Nevertheless, only two states - heaven and hell.

UH, you must read again, and understand, according to each side’s Teaching, understanding, interpreting the Scriptures etc…to mention one for you, …Catholics believe that the righteous immediately go to heaven…you said…The Orthodox say that …But both the souls of the holy and the righteous go indisputably to paradise, but NOT YET . . . .

The souls of the just are not in heaven according to Ignatios. But that means since there are only two states, they must be in hell. Let me say it again, according to Ignatios the souls of the just are in hell. Another interesting observation: Catholics who believe that the souls of the just go immediately to heaven believe in heresy. They must, like Ignatios, believe that the souls of the just are in hell. Only two states, heaven and hell. The Catholics are wrong to say that the righteous go immediately to heaven.

according to the dictionary “hell” is equal torment, place for the condemned, misery etc…

Heaven is equal existence of the blessed after the mortal life, supreme happiness, the abode of God, the angels, and the spirits of the righteous after death; etc…
So no problem there, all the above from the dictionary and they seems to be very orthodox.

Now we are told that from dictionary.com the definition given of hell “seems to be very orthodox” to Ignatios. Of course that definition states that “hell is equal torment, place for the condemned, misery.” There are only two states, heaven and hell. The souls of the just do not immediately go to heaven, therefore they must be in hell. But wait, hell according to the dictionary is a place of equal torment for the condemned where they experience misery. Therefore, the souls of the just who are in hell are condemned and experience equal torment and misery.

This is what becomes of Orthodox who so badly want to show the supposed errors of the Catholic Church.

 

[Nicholas82]

Do the various Orthodox churches tell their penitents do some some sort of penance after they are done confessing their sins? (ie: feed the poor, various prayers, fast, etc)

If so, what is the POINT of this? Honestly. Is it not temporal punishment due to sin? See, the problem with Orthodox lacking a place that is not earth for temporal punishment is what if you do NOT complete your penance on earth while you are still alive? Or what if your penance was not satisfactory to God’s standards? What happens then? God is just and He will require perfect satisfaction, and this is what Purgatory is for.

The POINT is the same reason we fast or do any other sort of penance- we’re running a marathon and we need training, so to speak! Asceticism and prayer are great spiritual medecines, not *punishments. *

 

[Nicholas82]

Indeed. As is the entire Orthodox communion on this issue. They don’t agree with one another, yet when the RCC doesn’t agree with their particular version then it must be wrong. Here’s a nice analysis of Ignatios’ “unique” version of the afterlife.

So there are only two places for the soul - heaven and hell. Notice how Ignatious objects to the use of the term “place” when Catholics use it, but not when a local council of Constantinople uses it. Nevertheless, only two states - heaven and hell.

The souls of the just are not in heaven according to Ignatios. But that means since there are only two states, they must be in hell. Let me say it again, according to Ignatios the souls of the just are in hell. Another interesting observation: Catholics who believe that the souls of the just go immediately to heaven believe in heresy. They must, like Ignatios, believe that the souls of the just are in hell. Only two states, heaven and hell. The Catholics are wrong to say that the righteous go immediately to heaven.

Now we are told that from dictionary.com the definition given of hell “seems to be very orthodox” to Ignatios. Of course that definition states that “hell is equal torment, place for the condemned, misery.” There are only two states, heaven and hell. The souls of the just do not immediately go to heaven, therefore they must be in hell. But wait, hell according to the dictionary is a place of equal torment for the condemned where they experience misery. Therefore, the souls of the just who are in hell are condemned and experience equal torment and misery.

This is what becomes of Orthodox who so badly want to show the supposed errors of the Catholic Church.

What is “…what becomes of Orthodox who so badly want to show the supposed errors of the Catholic Church.”? Do you mean that academic masterpiece you just bludgened Ignatios with? Here’s a definition for ya…

hu·bris /ˈhyubrɪs, ˈhu-/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[hyoo-bris, hoo-] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun excessive pride or self-confidence; arrogance.

 

[Chaldean_Rite]

The POINT is the same reason we fast or do any other sort of penance- we’re running a marathon and we need training, so to speak! Asceticism and prayer are great spiritual medecines, not *punishments. *

Agreed, but there is such a thing as medicinal punishment which God has always used throughout history (ie: letting Israel wander around for 400 years, or a pain in your hand, etc).

Since God calls everyone to be repentant and be saved, if you die in sin, these punishments no longer serves as medicinal, but rather eternal judgment.

More general question:

• How does God punish the Christian for sins committed?
• What arena does God have for temporal punishments (PURGATORY)?

Matthew 12:32
And whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven; but whoever speaks against the holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come

.

 

[Nicholas82]

Agreed, but there is such a thing as medicinal punishment which God has always used throughout history (ie: letting Israel wander around for 400 years, or a pain in your hand, etc).

Since God calls everyone to be repentant and be saved, if you die in sin, these punishments no longer serves as medicinal, but rather eternal judgment.

More general question:

• How does God punish the Christian for sins committed?
• What arena does God have for temporal punishments (PURGATORY)?
  .

…whereas I respectfully disagree. I understand the point that you are making and how that may possibly apply to this life- but disagree that a cross one might bear, given by God, for their own spiritual good and to help them in this life attain paradise in the next necessarily or logically must carry over to the next life if not ‘carried to God’s satisfaction’ or ‘completed’ if that’s what you’re saying.

Whereas you just referred to a “medicinal punishment” I would simply refer to “medecine”. It seems that you still would consider the medicine as punishment.

When I was a child and had a cough I would do everything and anything I could possibly think of to avoid taking robitussin, my medicine, because it tasted bad. After a few times I started to realize that although the medecine tasted bad at first that feeling only lasted a few seconds and te benefits far outweighed the initial response. As an adult I simply know that when I am sick the best thing to do is to take my medecine, and the bitter taste has practically lost its bitterness; I don’t even consider it nor do I even really notice it, I just know that it is the best thing for me. To me, this is the same as when we mortify our own flesh, in pennance and, not opposed to, when we do so regularly through the fasts, along with almsgiving and prayer.

No amount of beating myself or pain that I endure is going to attone for my sins, as if pain is an end in and of itself. The mortification of the flesh should serve to strengthen us, to enable us to withstand more, that we may progress and withstand temptation. The idea that this is a punishment, that the more pain and discomfort I endure the more I will be able to ‘make up’ for my sins I would say is a distorted understanding of what asceticism is about.

So viewed as a punishment inflicted upon a sinner to be carried out, I can begin to understand why one would expect to have to “finish” one’s punishment in the next life, but viewed as medecinal, for the strengthening of our flesh and souls, there simply is no need for it to be carried out into eternity as a sentence.

 

[Nicholas82]

Matthew 12:32
And whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven; but whoever speaks against the holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come

As for this quote, you use it to point to the fact that there are sins which may be forgiven in the next life. How is that accomplished? We know that our prayers benefit the dead, and especially in the offering of the unbloody sacrifice for the departed soul. If a puishment to be inflicted between now and the Resurrection serves this purpose as well(Purgatory), then it would seem as if just about any sin might be forgiven by way of suffering between now and then. Even those who commit murder here on earth are not always imprisoned for life- is it that we are just more merciful than Almighty God?

 

[Chaldean_Rite]

but disagree that a cross one might bear, given by God, for their own spiritual good and to help them in this life attain paradise in the next

I never said that **crosses **which are given by God for the path of santicity for the Christian on this side of eternity, are punishments, also given by God; two separate things.

In fact, the only relation I see between the too are the possibility that both might have some actually suffering involved.

While you did not answer the two questions I posed, let me try to answer them:

The Covenant with God operates, in a fundamental sense, the following way: if we are faithful to His covenant with us, we are blessed by Him, if we are unfaithful, we are cursed by him. Agreed? I think that covenant theory is basic for the Jew and Christian since this is what God had established for us.

This is the cup of my blood; the blood of the new and everlasting covenant;

I will qualify that the curse imposed by disobeying the covenant IS medicinal, in the sense that it is designed to bring us back to Him. Whether you call it simply, medicinal or medcinal punishment, is irrelvant since the objective and meaning are the same.

I will say again, if we persist in sin, the is a point where medincal aspect goes away and it becomes judgment, and God forbid, eternal.

---

We do not need to look very hard to see how God operates His Covenant:

14] "But if you will not hearken to me, and will not do all these commandments,
15] if you spurn my statutes, and if your soul abhors my ordinances, so that you will not do all my commandments, but break my covenant,
16] I will do this to you: I will appoint over you sudden terror, consumption, and fever that waste the eyes and cause life to pine away. And you shall sow your seed in vain, for your enemies shall eat it;
17] I will set my face against you, and you shall be smitten before your enemies; those who hate you shall rule over you, and you shall flee when none pursues you.
18] And if in spite of this you will not hearken to me, then I will chastise you again sevenfold for your sins,
19] and I will break the pride of your power, and** I will make** your heavens like iron and your earth like brass;
20] and your strength shall be spent in vain, for your land shall not yield its increase, and the trees of the land shall not yield their fruit.
21] "Then if you walk contrary to me, and will not hearken to me, I will bring more plagues upon you, sevenfold as many as your sins.
22] And I will let loose the wild beasts among you, which shall rob you of your children, and destroy your cattle, and make you few in number, so that your ways shall become desolate.
23] "And if by this discipline you are not turned to me, but walk contrary to me,
24] then I also will walk contrary to you, and I myself will smite you sevenfold for your sins.
25] And I will bring a sword upon you, that shall execute vengeance for the covenant; and if you gather within your cities I will send pestilence among you, and you shall be delivered into the hand of the enemy.
26] When I break your staff of bread, ten women shall bake your bread in one oven, and shall deliver your bread again by weight; and you shall eat, and not be satisfied.
27] "And if in spite of this you will not hearken to me, but walk contrary to me,
28] then I will walk contrary to you in fury, and chastise you myself sevenfold for your sins.
29] You shall eat the flesh of your sons, and you shall eat the flesh of your daughters.NOTE: IN THE WRITING OF JOSEPHUS, WHEN JERSALEM WAS DESTROYED IN 70 AD, THERE WERE ACCOUNTS OF WOMEN EATING THEIR CHILDEN
30] And I will destroy your high places, and cut down your incense altars, and cast your dead bodies upon the dead bodies of your idols; and my soul will abhor you.
31] And I will lay your cities waste, and will make your sanctuaries desolate, and I will not smell your pleasing odors.
32] And I will devastate the land, so that your enemies who settle in it shall be astonished at it.
33] And I will scatter you among the nations, and I will unsheathe the sword after you; and your land shall be a desolation, and your cities shall be a waste.
34] "Then the land shall enjoy its sabbaths as long as it lies desolate, while you are in your enemies’ land; then the land shall rest, and enjoy its sabbaths.
35] As long as it lies desolate it shall have rest, the rest which it had not in your sabbaths when you dwelt upon it.
36] And as for those of you that are left, I will send faintness into their hearts in the lands of their enemies; the sound of a driven leaf shall put them to flight, and they shall flee as one flees from the sword, and they shall fall when none pursues.
37] They shall stumble over one another, as if to escape a sword, though none pursues; and you shall have no power to stand before your enemies.
38] And you shall perish among the nations, and the land of your enemies shall eat you up.
39] And those of you that are left shall pine away in your enemies’ lands because of their iniquity; and also because of the iniquities of their fathers they shall pine away like them.
40] “But if they confess their iniquity and the iniquity of their fathers in their treachery which they committed against me, and also in walking contrary to me,
41] so that I walked contrary to them and brought them into the land of their enemies; if then their uncircumcised heart is humbled and they make amends for their iniquity;
42]*** then I will remember my covenant with Jacob, and I will remem*ber my covenant with Isaac and my covenant with Abraham, and I will remember the land. **
43] But the land shall be left by them, and enjoy its sabbaths while it lies desolate without them; and they shall make amends for their iniquity, because they spurned my ordinances, and their soul abhorred my statutes.
44] Yet for all that, when they are in the land of their enemies, I will not spurn them, neither will I abhor them so as to destroy them utterly and break my covenant with them; for I am the LORD their God;
45] but I will for their sake remember the covenant with their forefathers, whom I brought forth out of the land of Egypt in the sight of the nations, that I might be their God: I am the LORD.”

 

[anthony022071]

The POINT is the same reason we fast or do any other sort of penance- we’re running a marathon and we need training, so to speak! Asceticism and prayer are great spiritual medecines, not *punishments. *

The suffering of purgatory is a matter of purification. When a man tries to become holy and acceptable to God by following the commandments and avoiding sin,it feels painful. He may not be punishing himself,but it may feel like punishment. It is painful to be cleansed of sins and the effects of sins,whether willingly or unwillingly,whether in this life or in the next.

 

[SedesDomi]

The suffering of purgatory is a matter of purification. When a man tries to become holy and acceptable to God by following the commandments and avoiding sin,it feels painful. He may not be punishing himself,but it may feel like punishment. It is painful to be cleansed of sins and the effects of sins,whether willingly or unwillingly,whether in this life or in the next.

In Hinduism, the practice of becoming holy and acceptable to God is said to produce ‘heat’, or in Sanskrit ‘tapas’.

 

[tdgesq]

What is “…what becomes of Orthodox who so badly want to show the supposed errors of the Catholic Church.”? Do you mean that academic masterpiece you just bludgened Ignatios with?

I think you misunderstand the final message of the post. There wasn’t any need for it to come that. In zeal to prove the CC wrong, Ignatios held to absurd positions that in the end destroy even the Orthodox understanding(s) of the afterlife.

Purgatory is wrong because it is deemed a “place” (something that is somewhat debatable from a RC standpoint) rather than a “state,” yet he quotes to a local council of Constantinople where the term “place” is used for both heaven and hades.

RC’s are wrong to believe that the souls of the just go directly to heaven, yet this is what the Council of Jerusalem indicates.

RC’s must accept common dictionary definitions of “purgatory” rather than theological definitions, yet the dictionary definitions of “hell” given clearly contradict the Orthodox notion of hell.

The point: it doesn’t work to disprove someone else’s theology by holding to positions that contradict your own. It makes it look like such a person is willing to say anything to prove the RC is wrong.

Here’s a definition for ya…

hu·bris /ˈhyubrɪs, ˈhu-/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[hyoo-bris, hoo-] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun excessive pride or self-confidence; arrogance.

It is not hubris to point out the logical consequences of a position, particularly when my position is being attacked. Fwiw, I have a difficult time finding dogmatic problems with the Orthodox version of the afterlife, even though they have different theological expressions.

 

[Voco_proTatiano]

Perhaps this concept might help those wasting time turning over this futile argument…
We have, from Our Lord, written in the Gospels, that Final Judgement will NOT take place until Judgement Day, which will be at the END OF TIME for thus Universe.
Until then, the departed lie in wait, for, for them, Judgement is NOT-YET.
Those who died in Mortal Sin, must wait in dread of the Judgement they must face. This waiting will be a very real hell.
Those who died sinless may wait in anticipation of Just Reward. This waiting will be a reward in itself, for the anticipation will be a very real heaven.
As for the majority of us, who are neither remarkably G_dly, nor remarkably evil, the wait will be one of confused worry, and re-evaluation of what might have been. This anticipation will be a very real purgatory.
All three states are the same state, of NOT-YET, but the experience of that state will be dependent upon the state of the person entering it.
The state of NOT-YET, has a parallel in digital logic, which is defined on the basis of only two possibilities, that is, either true, or false. Many logical devices have a third state which actually is a non-state, of not being asserted.
Just Like Schroedinger’s cat, which is neither alive, nor dead, until the box is opened.
And also like Schroedinger’s cat, when the uncertainty of past, present and future is revealed on Judgement Day, the uncertainty which allows this universe to exist will vanish, and with it, this universe, Hence Physics supports the concept of the Last Day, in the event of Judgement.

 

[Ignatius]

In answer to the question in the title: The Eastern Orthodox is not false. It is part of the original, undivided Church founded by Jesus Christ. It is the Church of St. Andrew, brother of St. Peter.

 

[anthony022071]

[Voco proTatiano]

Perhaps this concept might help those wasting time turning over this futile argument…

Please see post 790.

 

[Nicholas82]

[Voco proTatiano]

Please see post 790.

You must think that was a pretty great post to have to bring people’s attention to it again- and it obviously proves your side of the argument well; which is also why you had to bring it to people’s attention again Also, you already knew there is another side to the argument, so you referenced the CCC, which of course agrees with your side of the argument. I guess the matter is settled.

 

[Peter_J]

Please see post 790.

What about it?