Why is the Pope not married?

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dosdog said:
So you don’t care what the Apostles said - Got It

Matthew 19 11 Who said to them: All men take not this word, but they to whom it is given. 12 For there are eunuchs, who were born so from their mother’s womb: and there are eunuchs, who were made so by men: and there are eunuchs, who have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven. He that can take, let him take it.
drbo.org/chapter/47019.htm
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Maybe you should move on to the next topic and just admit Catholics have this wrong.

Christ chose married men to be apostles.
If being celibate was a requirement for leadership then He never would have done so.

game, set, match.
 
Eden said:
  • Christ* was celibate.
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So was John the Baptist.
Aaron was not nor Zacharias nor Peter.
So you believe that Christ who chose married men to be apostles was in error?

Time for you to move on also.
 
Zooey said:
👍 👍 There you go!!
If Christ believed that marriage was a prerequisite to being a spiritual leader, He would have been married Himself.
Since He was not, it is in the court of the “pro-marriage for the pope” crowd, to establish why this should be part of the job description.
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Christ did not make celibacy a requirement.
Time for you to move on also.
 
Benadam said:
Mathew 19

27 Then Peter answering, said to him: **Behold we have left all things, and have followed thee: **what therefore shall we have? 28 And Jesus said to them: Amen, I say to you, that you, who have followed me, in the regeneration, when the Son of man shall sit on the seat of his majesty, you also shall sit on twelve seats judging the twelve tribes of Israel. 29 And every one that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands for my name’s sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall possess life everlasting.

**Peter speaking for the 12 states that they have left all things. **

Jesus in response lists the bonds of family because those are the things we are most attached to and the most difficult things to leave.

Notice there is no qualifier to Peter’s description of what they left as ‘all things’ when Jesus lists the bonds of family and notice that the marital bond is included.

Not an improvement but obedience to the most difficult things to leave and be conformed to Christ.
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Peters wife traveled with him to Rome or dont you believe in tradition.
Maybe its time for you to move on also.
 
This thread should be closed as there is no adequate response.
Just move on to the next topic.
 
Hisalone said:
Christ did not make celibacy a requirement.
Time for you to move on also.
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Why are you so insistant on people ‘‘moving on’’? This discussion is only hours old, one post is not enough for meaningful discussion.

I think that if you are unwilling to listen to anyone else for more than one post, it is you who needs to ‘‘move on’’.

God bless

Peter
 
Hi

I think there is no harm if the popes do marry. It is very natural to be married. Moses had a wife as we gather from OTBible. I understand that except for the conception of Jesus which by order of GodAllahYHWH; later Mary got married and hence Jesus had brothers and sisters I think. Jesus himself got married, in my opinion when he went into exile to India after the incident of crucifixion. There are people in Sirinagar, Kashmir, India who claim that they are Jesus’ offshoots.

There is no commandment not to marry for the popes from GodAllahYHWH or from Jesus, I think.

I respect your religion.

Thanks
paarsurrey.wordpress.com/
 
Hisalone said:
Maybe you should move on to the next topic and just admit Catholics have this wrong.

Christ chose married men to be apostles.
If being celibate was a requirement for leadership then He never would have done so.

game, set, match.
Click to expand...
Sorry can’t do that there is nothing in my bible against a voluntary vow of celebacy - Must have fallen out

Galatians 5 23 Mildness, faith, modesty, continency, chastity. Against such there is no law.
 
Celibacy according to tradition

Elijah and Elisha were celibate al their lives (Zohar Hadash 2:1; Midrash Mishlei 30, 105, Pirke Rabbi Eliezer 33). When for the sake of the Torah (i.e., intense study in it), a rabbi would abstain from relations with his wife, it was deemed permissible, for he was then cohabiting with the Shekinah (the “Divine Presence”) in the Torah (Zohar re Gn 1:27; 13:3 and Psalm 85:14 in the Discourse of Rabbi Phineas to Rabbis Jose, Judah, and Hiya).

It is well known that the rabbis spoke concerning the obligation of all males to be married and procreated: “He who abstains from procreation is regarded as though he had shed blood” (Rabbi Eliezer in Yebamoth 63b, Babylonian Talmud; see also Shulkhan Aruch (Code of Jewish Law) section Evenhar-Ezer 1:1,3,4). According to Yebamoth 62b, B.T. a man is only half a man without a wife, citing Genesis 5:2 where it is said: "Male and female He (God) created them and blessed them, and called their name Adam (lit. “Man”).

Nevertheless, “if a person cleaves to the study of the Torah (i.e., dedicates all his time to it) like Simeon ben Azzai, his refusal to marry can be condoned” (Skulkhan Arukh EH 1:4). Rabbinic scholar Simeon ben Azzai (early second century A.D.) was extraordinary in his learning: “with the passing of Ben Azzai diligent scholars passed from the earth” (Sotah 9:15). He never married and was celibate all his life so as not to be distracted from his studies, and because he considered the Torah his wife, for who he always yearned with all his soul (Yebamoth 63b). He was an outstanding scholar (Kiddushin 20a, B.T.) and also renowned for his saintliness (Berakoth 57b, B.T.).

Other celibates

Jewish tradition also mentions the celibate Zenu’im (lit. “chaste ones”) to whom the secret of the Name of God was entrusted, for they were able to preserve the Holy Name in “perfect purity” (Kiddushin 71a; Midash Ecclesiastes Rabbah 3:11; Yer. yoma 39a, 40a).

Those in hope of a divine revelation consequently refrained from sexual intercourse and were strict in matters of purity (Enoch 83:2; Revelation 14:2-5).

cin.org/users/james/files/talmud.htm
 
Hisalone said:
So men thought to improve on Christ who chose married men to be apostles?
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OF the 14 men named as Apostles, how many were married that we know for sure and how many do we know for sure were not? PLease provide scriptural support for each list.
 
The presumption is that all were married…with Paul being debatable…but I side on Paul having been married and widowed. Jesus chose married men as his apostles because UNMARRIED men were quite rare in Judaism which has a law about being fruitful and multiplying.

Celibacy is not a THEOLOGICAL issue, it’s not a dogma…celibacy in the Church is a DISCIPLINE with a varied history…some of it rooted in following the PRESUMED example of Christ and some of it based on problems the Church experienced with the spouses and children of married clergy trying to inherit property. But again…this is a matter of DISCIPLINE not doctrine.

I say Christ’s PRESUMED example because scripture and early apostolic tradition are SILENT on the issue of whether Christ was married. I presume he was not…

Why do I think Paul was married? He was a faithful Jew who followed the commandments…one of them being about multiplying…also, Paul was a formally trained rabbi…one requirement for ordination as a rabbi (as oppossed to the title being given honorably to folks like Jesus) is that they be married. My guess is that Rabbi Paul was a widower.

I think the Greek Church has done this better than the Latin Church.
 
Hisalone said:
Maybe you should move on to the next topic and just admit Catholics have this wrong.

Christ chose married men to be apostles.
If being celibate was a requirement for leadership then He never would have done so.

game, set, match.
Click to expand...
dosdog said:
Sorry can’t do that there is nothing in my bible against a voluntary vow of celebacy - Must have fallen out

Galatians 5 23 Mildness, faith, modesty, continency, chastity. Against such there is no law.
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However I did find a commandment against Marriage

Jeremias 16 2 Thou shalt not take thee a wife, neither shalt thou have thee sons and daughters in this place.
 
Yerusalyim,

I agree about Paul. He was probably married and then widdowed. We can show through Scriptures that Peter was married as well. There is nothing in the Bible about the rest. John was very young, so there is a chance that he had not yet married.

We know that Jesus was married. It is possible that none of the others were either. After all, God had chosen them for the Apostleship.

The eastern Church does not ordain married men as Bishop. They have the same policy that we do on that. You can be married and be ordained a priest, but once ordained you cannot then marry. Bishops are taken from the ranks of the monks and are therefore celebate.
 
Mickey said:
Me thinks you made a typo. 😃
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You are right.

Now, please note that this typo in no way shows that the EO Church is theologically correct about anything. Just to be clear. I would hate to look at the list of “innovations” and see my name on one.
 
It would be pretty tough to explain why you had two spouses.
One being Jesus. Two being your spouse. If you decide to become a preist or a Nun, I believe you choose Christ as your spouse. You wouldn’t have enough time in your day to dedicate to both Jesus and Your spouse without sacraficing one for another. A preist or Nun should spend more time than most people in prayer and meditation with their friend and spouse Jesus. I think it would be pretty difficult to balance the two and I wouldn’t.

Just my humble opinion.
 
Aaron409 said:
It would be pretty tough to explain why you had two spouses.
One being Jesus. Two being your spouse. If you decide to become a preist or a Nun, I believe you choose Christ as your spouse. You wouldn’t have enough time in your day to dedicate to both Jesus and Your spouse without sacraficing one for another. A preist or Nun should spend more time than most people in prayer and meditation with their friend and spouse Jesus. I think it would be pretty difficult to balance the two and I wouldn’t.

Just my humble opinion.
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And the two shall become one flesh.
Cannot two do more work than one?
Shared ministries can be very powerfull.
 
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