Why Must We Fight Against Same-Sex Marriage?

[CopticChristian]

" Various marriage practices have existed throughout the world. In some societies an individual is limited to being in one suchcouple at a time(monogamy), while othercultures allow a male tohave more than one wife (polygyny) or, less commonly,a female to have more than one husband (polyandry). Some societies also allow marriage between two males or two females. Societies frequently have otherrestrictions onmarriage based onthe ages ofthe participants, pre-existing kinship, and membership inreligious orothersocialgroups."
-from wikipedia

There have been same sex marriages in other cultures.
Please stop trying to force the belief that Christianity is the only authority on marriage.

Wikipedia

your source of information lacks a credible entity. What cultures allow same sex marriage. Expand on that.

 

[CopticChristian]

I say that because christians are trying to ban it despite other cultures allowing same-sex marriages.
Marriage is not a creation of christianity so why should they decide who can marry?
Most of the anti-same-sex messages I have read contain “against my religion”, if that isn’t a group trying to claim authority on marriage then what is?

" The requirement for a marriage license was used as a mechanism to prohibit whites from marrying blacks, mulattos, Japanese, Chinese, Native Americans, Mongolians, Malays or Filipinos."
-wikipedia on u.s. marriage license

Marriage licenses used as a form of racism…now used against gays/lesbians… We have progressed so much!
(Kindle fires are a pain when copying and pasting.)

Sad,

The parallel of race and sex are not equivalents. It was wrong to deny marriage based on race. The issue of sex is another issue and not relevant to race. Race is an element of culture. Japan is a country, China is a country, Native Americans are from a country, Filipinos are from a country…all with common elements including language, food, history, and I for the life of me cannot find the country of “gay”, with a language, culture or ethnic food.

 

[CopticChristian]

I think that’s wrong too and i’ve signed petitions too. I sign any petetion I find that limits the rights of people.

Elizabeth502
If that doesn’t bother you why sould marriage(not a christian creation) bother you?
You don’t have to attend the wedding or see them in their bedroom and if you don’t like what you see you can look away or just tell them you think it’s wrong.

" The requirement for a marriage license was used as a mechanism to prohibit whites from marrying blacks, mulattos, Japanese, Chinese, Native Americans, Mongolians, Malays or Filipinos." -wikipedia on u.s. marriage license

Interracial marriage was banned before, that was wrong, why is something like that happening again?

Homosexuality does not constitute a race. Your thinking is distorted to include race and sex as equivalent. Is there a gay country? Is there a gay language? Is there a gay food culture? Is there gay societies that have left their mark on history as most races have?

 

[CopticChristian]

**I’m trying to persuade you **that gay/lesbian marriage should be allowed though it might be futile. chartsbin.com/view/3nr
I guess my anti-social nature works against me in persuasion(and grammar ). I guess I should stick to petitions.

Reli,

You are a Catholic Answer forum and there are rules against Proseltyizing. You are not allowed to persuade anyone of anything. You are allowed to express you opinion, state your opposition however you are not allowed to persuade anyone of anything.

I am sad that you are an athiest. I am sad that you cannot see race and sex and not equivalent. I am sad that you believe homosexuality hurts no one. I wish I could persuade you to think differently. Only you can do that. I suggest you investigate your beliefs more thoroughly.

 

[CopticChristian]

Whats wrong with a gay person adopting a child? Would you rather that child grow up in an orphanage or a nice loving home?

Pumpkin,

You do not understand. I believe homosexuals have perverted minds. You don’t have to believe this. How we certain things determins how we see other things. Homosexuals I believe are immoral. You don’t have to believe that.

So what is wrong with a homosexual with a perverted, immoral mind adopting a child? I cannot agree with this.

 

[CopticChristian]

From forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=452159

i.imgur.com/CeZtY.jpg

Just saw this and decided to share it

Do animals have free will. We cannot know.

If we lump all creation into the animal kingdom and humans are part of it then one species does not approve of homosexuality. The animal kingdom has species that eat their young, murder their spouse, procreate without intercourse, are hermaphrodite, are cannablistic…etc

So do we mimic the 1500 species in all respects or just the one you want to cling to as acceptable?

 

[Edward_H]

What seems glaringly missing from this discussion is the positive message of the Church regarding the natural order, and how this connects with the message of love in the Gospels.

The Church is very much for all people, including those who have expressed gay desires, tendencies, proclivities.

The Church seeks all person’s greatest good, it has to, this is the Commandmant of Love. And it has to help us discern the good, and to give us the means for pursuing the good and the true.

The Church apparently wants and is seeking the true good of gay people more than practicing gay people are pursuing their own good! This is a wonderfully strong and positive approach the Holy Church has been, and forever will pursue.

 

[CopticChristian]

All right - I’ll bite. Explain the subtext here: how is it two men are incapable of loving one another?

Forgive me. I’ve clearly missed a point along the way here.

Your argument started off with the decay of society. It is a serious matter. It needs to be addressed. But … you went on to attack sexual gratification?

Allow me to demonstrate the error in this line of thought.

QUESTION OPEN TO ANYONE WHO WANTS TO ANSWER
Who among you incites the act of marital relations with thoughts of how to feed an extra mouth, where to put the next car seat, and with the certain guilt it will be impossible to provide a college fund for any child that might result of said relations?

Sexual gratification isn’t a doorway to hell. It’s a biological necessity. Without it, fear and uncertainty alone would have ended the human race a long, long time ago. We, after all, cannot predict the future. We can’t know we’ll be there for our children when they need us, or what troubles their lives may bring them. Sexual gratification is also something else: when the act is committed by two people who care about each other, enough not to leave one another in a bind without taking responsibility for the consequences of said relations, it is a sign of faith that we can handle what life throws at us.

Does that make the LGBT lifestyle indecent? No. But by design, they can never hold a child that is one half them and one half that of the person they love - knowing full well that never to be child is proof they believe in something larger. I believe it weighs heavily on the hearts of many.

**You seem to believe they don’t care about morality, that they are interested in sexual gratification for the sake of gratification, that this is an equality agenda for the sake of equality. **
What is the purpose in that? Adopting children they don’t want? To rub a same-sex marriage in the face of whomever they please? To sleep with as many human beings as possible - regardless of gender? To what end?

There is a simpler answer here - if you’re willing to hear it: you, my friend, lack faith in your fellow man.

Weigh,

This is Catholic Answers. Catholics have a Church, History, a Catechism outlining teachings, basically a manifesto for Catholic Moral beliefs and actions. Yet, you will find a diversity of opinion and actions. Yes within the structure of the Church there are those that stray from the teachings as well as the members and so it is with humanity.

Protestant groups have differing beliefs. The Mormons have a wavering view on abortion. I just discovered that some Protestant groups do not assign contraception and masturbation as immoral. There is a diversity of beliefs and here too there are supposedly common beliefs and actions that sometimes fulfill and sometimes do not fulfill.

When you speak of this group and for simplicity I will say LGBT, there is no common belief other than alternate lifestyle. Who speaks for this group as a unified whole? What is the common belief held by all? How do I know what morals they have? Who can point to something and say…this is what they care about. This is a diverse group of humanity with one common element. This common element in my opinion is aberrant sexual behavior. That is it.

 

[CopticChristian]

The problem I have with your statement, is what basis do you have that same-sex couples are not as supporting as mother/father families? Just because you do not like the idea of it, does not mean that it is a bad mix. The number 1 reason and perhaps only reason why same-sex households struggle is due to the negative views they receive from people such as yourself. All of your claims that same sex families are rubbish and were debunked as faulty, is the most erroneous piece of propaganda I have read in my entire life. What non biased psychiatric website/article did you receive that info from? I have been writing for the APA for 40 years and heard of nothing like it.

Dr Irene,

You state your designation as Christian. You appear to supprt same sex marriage. Give the doc a break here and tell me from whence your Christian beliefs come and how it is you supprt same sex marriage or do I read you wrong.

You are aware that the DSM took homosexuality out of this book as a disorder because of Gay psychiatrists. Psychiatry is diagnosis by committee.

let me know

from one Doc to another…

 

[CopticChristian]

Please stop trying to pull the AIDS card. You need to educate yourself in the history of the disease a bit more. My niece died from the result of AIDS in 1983 after a blood transfusion. Also if you knew about AIDS, you would know that a person cannot transmit AIDS from one person to another as an STD or through blood transfusion. You can transmit HIV which after sometime untreated can turn into AIDS.

Dr,

AIDS is transmitted through body fluids including semen and that is why it spread so rapidly in the homosexual community. You are wrong that it cannot be transmitted as an STD.

 

[Edward_H]

Weighted heart

Sexual gratification isn’t a ‘biological necessity.’

What rubbish and bad thinking.

Sexual exchange is a biological necessity FOR THE SPECIES, not for the individual.

AND, in no case is gratification (another mumblihood term) a biological necessity for the individual.

Wrong on a least 3 counts.

 

[CopticChristian]

And as soon as they find a treatment for HIV it will become eradicated just as Syphillis was after the invention of penicillin. Even though homosexuality facilitated in the spread of HIV, you cannot deem it abusive and it existed for thousands of years prior to HIV and it will continue to exist until the end of time.

Dr,

Syphillis still exists. There are few if any contagious diseases that have been eradicated. Al Capone died of Syphillis. HIV will not be eradicated as it is a world wide problem and the mode of transmission trough aberrant sexual behavior will not stop. Africa has a problem with HIV greater than this country. Your opinion is in error.

 

[CopticChristian]

I would ask you to look into your heart and ask why you are against homosexuality. The original Hebrew and Aramaic Bible does not say homosexuality is a sin. Modern versions of the Bible have been changed to include homosexuality as a sin. People, until recently, interpreted the Bible as saying interracial marrage is a sin. If there is hate in your heart for gays and lesbians, that is a sin. Jesus never says homosexuality is a sin. God wants us to love him and one another. It is not our task to judge, that is God’s task. I would encourge you to look into your heart first and start there. God will show you the way to his love and guidance and answer your prayers about how best to help to strengthen the family unit, of all forms that raise healthy, loving families.

Tony,

Your heart is a muscle that pumps blood. In order to understand beliefs you must understand that those beliefs are formed in the mind. I wish I could tell you that the mind is right here or right there. All I know is that somewhere in my head it exists. You may want to go to youtube and search for the BBC “The story of the Brain”…it is about 6 hours but it will get you on the right track.

Catholics are not Bible alone and do not turn to the Bible for interpretation of what we want to believe. We believe that the Church is the mystery hidden for all ages through which the manifold wisdom of God is known and it is the Church that guides us.

We need to look to the Church to help our minds so that we know that homosexuality is a sin. You don’t have to believe this. Somehow you came to accept this as normal. I cannot.

 

[surritter]

I would ask you to look into your heart and ask why you are against homosexuality. The original Hebrew and Aramaic Bible does not say homosexuality is a sin. Modern versions of the Bible have been changed to include homosexuality as a sin. People, until recently, interpreted the Bible as saying interracial marrage is a sin. If there is hate in your heart for gays and lesbians, that is a sin. Jesus never says homosexuality is a sin. God wants us to love him and one another. It is not our task to judge, that is God’s task. I would encourge you to look into your heart first and start there. God will show you the way to his love and guidance and answer your prayers about how best to help to strengthen the family unit, of all forms that raise healthy, loving families.

Tony … does everything you believe have its foundation in whether or not it’s in the Bible? Let’s suppose that the Bible is silent on homosexual acts (which it’s not, but you apparently wish to twist it to be saying the opposite).

But without the Bible, consider the biological function of sex. Might it have a “design,” or a functional reason to be a part of our species? These natural-law points of discussion can be a good foundation to explain why homosexual acts are contrary to our nature. Call it a sin if you want. But they are “disordered” acts because they fail to conform to the “order” for which God (or evolution, if you wish) made them.
This is not about the personhood or the respect due to those who have homosexual inclinations. But to act upon those inclinations is to show a lack of self-control, and it is permitted to speak out against that without slighting the person.

 

[Dan_Grelinger]

I would ask you to look into your heart and ask why you are against homosexuality. The original Hebrew and Aramaic Bible does not say homosexuality is a sin. Modern versions of the Bible have been changed to include homosexuality as a sin. People, until recently, interpreted the Bible as saying interracial marrage is a sin. If there is hate in your heart for gays and lesbians, that is a sin. Jesus never says homosexuality is a sin. God wants us to love him and one another. It is not our task to judge, that is God’s task. I would encourge you to look into your heart first and start there. God will show you the way to his love and guidance and answer your prayers about how best to help to strengthen the family unit, of all forms that raise healthy, loving families.

It is confusing to NOT separate those with same-sex attractions (homosexuals) from homosexual acts. I understand why those trying to suggest that homosexual acts are OK will do that, but we must stay true to the difference between people and their actions. There is a big difference between people and actions! I humbly request that in these forums you always make the distinction of what your are referring to.

Those with same-sex attractions are God’s children, just as all the rest of us are. We all have our crosses to bear, and their specific crosses do not mean that they are rejected by God. I also see very little, if any, rejection of homosexual persons in these forums. I see much rejection of propositions that homosexual activity is somehow OK.

And precisely because I don’t like to see people acting selfishly and abusive towards one another (even if they consent to being abused by one another), I can only express my love for them by stating what is true.

The Church has consistently taught throughout the ages that God’s plan for sexuality is consistent with what is naturally obvious. Those capabilities are reproductive capabilities. That’s why the secular world refers to them as ‘reproductive organs’, and not something like ‘pleasure-providers’.

 

[tonyinatl66]

Tony,

Your heart is a muscle that pumps blood. In order to understand beliefs you must understand that those beliefs are formed in the mind. I wish I could tell you that the mind is right here or right there. All I know is that somewhere in my head it exists. You may want to go to youtube and search for the BBC “The story of the Brain”…it is about 6 hours but it will get you on the right track.

Catholics are not Bible alone and do not turn to the Bible for interpretation of what we want to believe. We believe that the Church is the mystery hidden for all ages through which the manifold wisdom of God is known and it is the Church that guides us.

We need to look to the Church to help our minds so that we know that homosexuality is a sin. You don’t have to believe this. Somehow you came to accept this as normal. I cannot.

I agree that our beliefs are formed in the mind. And God gave us a mind to use and develop and explore and grow. God gave us a brain so that we could listen and learn and not follow blindly.

Similarly, in order to comprehend what the original Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek texts Bible says about gay and lesbian relationships, we must pass over the references to homosexual rape, male sexual abuse of boys, and homosexual prostitution, same-sex orgies by heterosexuals, Pagan sexual rituals in temples, etc. We would be left with only those references relating to consensual sexual activities within homosexual partnerships. There may not be any of these. The Bible may be as silent on loving, committed same-sex partnerships as it is about planes, trains and automobiles.

We need to use our own reason and experience in interpreting these scripture passages. Our knowledge of science, psychology, and modern scholarly understandings need to inform our approach to these passages. Our knowledge about common allusions in scripture - from leprosy to demon possession, from conception and birth to race and gender realities - will inform our interpretation based on new findings from the secular realm.

The bible never says homosexuality is a sin. If someone wants to filter their own beliefs through the bible, then that is on them. Just because we do not find same sex committed relationships right for us does not mean they are wrong. Just because something is against your nature, does not mean it is against God’s nature.

 

[tonyinatl66]

Tony … does everything you believe have its foundation in whether or not it’s in the Bible? Let’s suppose that the Bible is silent on homosexual acts (which it’s not, but you apparently wish to twist it to be saying the opposite).

But without the Bible, consider the biological function of sex. Might it have a “design,” or a functional reason to be a part of our species? These natural-law points of discussion can be a good foundation to explain why homosexual acts are contrary to our nature. Call it a sin if you want. But they are “disordered” acts because they fail to conform to the “order” for which God (or evolution, if you wish) made them.
This is not about the personhood or the respect due to those who have homosexual inclinations. But to act upon those inclinations is to show a lack of self-control, and it is permitted to speak out against that without slighting the person.

Sex serves much more than a biological function of reproduction. What a sad unfulfilled relationship that would be. I would encourage you to learn the ancient text. The Bible never says homosexuality in a committed relationship is a sin. Idolatry, rape, incest, etc, yes, the Bible explains they are wrong.

 

[tonyinatl66]

Dr Irene,

You state your designation as Christian. You appear to supprt same sex marriage. Give the doc a break here and tell me from whence your Christian beliefs come and how it is you supprt same sex marriage or do I read you wrong.

You are aware that the DSM took homosexuality out of this book as a disorder because of Gay psychiatrists. Psychiatry is diagnosis by committee.

let me know

from one Doc to another…

Hate used to be the way homosexuality was diagnosed. Now, with modern science, shown to us by God, most of us know homosexuality is not a disorder.

 

[CopticChristian]

I agree that our beliefs are formed in the mind. And God gave us a mind to use and develop and explore and grow. God gave us a brain so that we could listen and learn and not follow blindly.

Similarly, in order to comprehend what the original Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek texts Bible says about gay and lesbian relationships, we must pass over the references to homosexual rape, male sexual abuse of boys, and homosexual prostitution, same-sex orgies by heterosexuals, Pagan sexual rituals in temples, etc. We would be left with only those references relating to consensual sexual activities within homosexual partnerships. There may not be any of these. The Bible may be as silent on loving, committed same-sex partnerships as it is about planes, trains and automobiles.

We need to use our own reason and experience in interpreting these scripture passages. Our knowledge of science, psychology, and modern scholarly understandings need to inform our approach to these passages. Our knowledge about common allusions in scripture - from leprosy to demon possession, from conception and birth to race and gender realities - will inform our interpretation based on new findings from the secular realm.

The bible never says homosexuality is a sin. If someone wants to filter their own beliefs through the bible, then that is on them. Just because we do not find same sex committed relationships right for us does not mean they are wrong. Just because something is against your nature, does not mean it is against God’s nature.

Tony,

I do not believe in going to the Bible for my answers. I go to the Church for answers. The Bible was birthed by the Church and the Church says homosexsuality is a sin. Protestants go to the Bible and here is one Protestant that disagrees with you…

gotquestions.org/homosexuality-Bible.html

Question: “What does the Bible say about homosexuality? Is homosexuality a sin?”

Answer: The Bible consistently tells us that homosexual activity is a sin (Genesis 19:1-13; Leviticus 18:22; 20:13; Romans 1:26-27; 1 Corinthians 6:9). Romans 1:26-27 teaches specifically that homosexuality is a result of denying and disobeying God. When people continue in sin and unbelief, God “gives them over” to even more wicked and depraved sin in order to show them the futility and hopelessness of life apart from God. 1 Corinthians 6:9 proclaims that homosexual “offenders” will not inherit the kingdom of God.

God does not create a person with homosexual desires. The Bible tells us that people become homosexuals because of sin (Romans 1:24-27) and ultimately because of their own choice. A person may be born with a greater susceptibility to homosexuality, just as some people are born with a tendency to violence and other sins. That does not excuse the person’s choosing to sin by giving in to sinful desires. If a person is born with a greater susceptibility to anger/rage, does that make it right for him to give into those desires? Of course not! The same is true with homosexuality.

However, the Bible does not describe homosexuality as a “greater” sin than any other. All sin is offensive to God. Homosexuality is just one of the many things listed in 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 that will keep a person from the kingdom of God. According to the Bible, God’s forgiveness is just as available to a homosexual as it is to an adulterer, idol worshipper, murderer, thief, etc. God also promises the strength for victory over sin, including homosexuality, to all those who will believe in Jesus Christ for their salvation (1 Corinthians 6:11; 2 Corinthians 5:17; Philippians 4:13).

Are you sure that the Bible says nothing about homosexuality as sin?

 

[tonyinatl66]

Weigh,

This is Catholic Answers. Catholics have a Church, History, a Catechism outlining teachings, basically a manifesto for Catholic Moral beliefs and actions. Yet, you will find a diversity of opinion and actions. Yes within the structure of the Church there are those that stray from the teachings as well as the members and so it is with humanity.

Protestant groups have differing beliefs. The Mormons have a wavering view on abortion. I just discovered that some Protestant groups do not assign contraception and masturbation as immoral. There is a diversity of beliefs and here too there are supposedly common beliefs and actions that sometimes fulfill and sometimes do not fulfill.

When you speak of this group and for simplicity I will say LGBT, there is no common belief other than alternate lifestyle. Who speaks for this group as a unified whole? What is the common belief held by all? How do I know what morals they have? Who can point to something and say…this is what they care about. This is a diverse group of humanity with one common element. This common element in my opinion is aberrant sexual behavior. That is it.

That is fine if it is aberrant sexual behavior for you, then don’t practice it and enjoy your life. Just know your beliefs are yours and not God’s. The Bible teaches us what is aberrant behavior. Not all Catholics or Catholic Churchs have the same beliefs.