Why not accept that Jesus will speak to you audibly?

[Giver]

montanaman:

This is what happens when you let all the “isms” creep into your head–subjectivism, relativism, post-modernism, etc. You think we can’t know anything by using reason, so you listen to the “voices” in your head.

#1, you have to understand that it’s not humility that makes you deny reason and truth.

#2, you have to dig deep to find the courage to embrace objective truth OUTSIDE OF YOURSELF.

What you and the modern world have in common, Giver, is that you both think you’re the barometer of truth–that it all comes from inside.

Who knows, maybe you’ve convinced yourself that you actually hear the voice of Christ (telling you heresy). If so, you’ve got bigger problems than anything that’s going to be solved on an anonymous message board.

Well, if you have never heard Jesus talk to you, I couldn’t expect you to believe me. When someone who has a closed mind to the idea that Jesus does talk to his people, it takes a lot of convincing, so I’m sure my witness won’t be accepted. Again it is your loss not mine.

 

[montanaman]

Giver:

Well, if you have never heard Jesus talk to you, I couldn’t expect you to believe me. When someone who has a closed mind to the idea that Jesus does talk to his people, it takes a lot of convincing, so I’m sure my witness won’t be accepted. Again it is your loss not mine.

Not quite, Vern. I didn’t deny that it happens, I’m just pointing out that I don’t believe you’re some kind of prophet. When you arrogate for yourself private interpretation and prophesying, promote heresy, and act condescending, I don’t have to be a genius to realize we’re dealing with a delusional person. Your witness isn’t accepted because it’s a new gospel according to Giver.

 

[montanaman]

And by the way, the smug implication that we’re a bunch of poor schmucks who don’t hear the words of Christ, and if only we’d listen to you, we’d be enlightened, is a real turn-off.

 

[Pax]

Giver:

Well, if you have never heard Jesus talk to you, I couldn’t expect you to believe me. When someone who has a closed mind to the idea that Jesus does talk to his people, it takes a lot of convincing, so I’m sure my witness won’t be accepted. Again it is your loss not mine.

Robert,

Do you believe that Jesus tells you things that do not agree with scripture?

 

[pacersFan]

Scout:

This excerpt is from a meditation in a devotional book called “An Hour With Jesus” by Rev. Ralph Lawrence and Most Rev. Carl. K. Moeddel. I use it during my adoration times. I thought the subject was appropriate for this conversation. The meditation is entitled, “How Does He Speak”.

"Yes, I speak. But you try to hear my words only through your human ears. Your heart must be still. I spoke. My words are all printed in a book. Do you read it? I actually walked the face of your earth, and spoke my words to my people. Many rejected them, and their persecution of me resulted in my death-for your salvation.
Yes, I spoke through my prophets, my saints. I still do. I speak also through my Pope. Do my people listen to him?
But most importantly, I speak directly to you. I need for you to be silent to hear me; to be acompletely empty vessel. For you see, I speak through your mind, and most importantly, through your heart. In your meditation, in your contemplation, in your silent recognition of my presence. I respond to you. It will be the thoughts you suddenly sense in your mind. It will be the truths you painfully accept in your heart regarding your unworthiness. The ache you feel for serenity, peace, and comfort, that frustration you sense struggling for constant control of your own destiny, your desire to actually hear me, these are all the words of your God speaking to you. If your heart and soul are truly silent, your throughts will be my words to you.
One thing more, I need you to give me your heart unconditionally. You must truly commit to give me your love, just as I give you mine. Then our hearts speak to each other. No words are needed!"

*Scout :tiphat: *

That was great! Thanks for sharing

 

[Giver]

montanaman:

Not quite, Vern. I didn’t deny that it happens, I’m just pointing out that I don’t believe you’re some kind of prophet. When you arrogate for yourself private interpretation and prophesying, promote heresy, and act condescending, I don’t have to be a genius to realize we’re dealing with a delusional person. Your witness isn’t accepted because it’s a new gospel according to Giver.

It is only new to you, what I have been taught has been in the word from the beginning. Love your enemy, Christian are dead to sin, can’t be a disciple of Jesus unless you give up all your possessions, don’t call any man father, don’t store, usury is evil, Jesus is God, the Bible is God’s word. Now have I been taught anything wrong?

 

[Dan-Man916]

Giver,

you edited the first post in your thread, so there are some of us who don’t really know what message from Jesus you were given.

What did you remove from your first post?
maybe i could figure this thread out?

 

[pacersFan]

Giver:

can’t be a disciple of Jesus unless you give up all your possessions, don’t call any man father

Were these two items told to you audibly? I ask because they sound out of the ordinary from what I’ve heard taught by the Church.

 

[pacersFan]

Dan-Man916:

Giver,

you edited the first post in your thread, so there are some of us who don’t really know what message from Jesus you were given.

What did you remove from your first post?
maybe i could figure this thread out?

I’m right there with you. I’m having a tought time making any sense out of this thread.

 

[Giver]

Pax:

Robert,

Do you believe that Jesus tells you things that do not agree with scripture?

Pax, we have been all through this, you know I judge everything by the Word of God. Everything I have been taught by Jesus is scriptural. Not everything I have been taught agrees with your theology, but that doesn’t make me wrong.

 

[Giver]

Dan-Man916:

Giver,

you edited the first post in your thread, so there are some of us who don’t really know what message from Jesus you were given.

What did you remove from your first post?
maybe i could figure this thread out?

Why is it that many Christians are not willing to accept that Jesus will speak to them audibly?

 

[Church_Militant]

Robert, you have been shown again and again why none of us accept you as a prophet.
It’s really pretty simple.
In spite of all the verses and passages that you quote us…your teachings contradict the Word of God as well as the verifiable teachings of the early church.

That being the case, it becomes a matter of research and discernment that leads me and other Catholics to reject your teachings.

I have no problem with believers hearing from Our Lord, nor would any bishops, BUT, since the Bishops you supposedly spoke to didn’t know specifically what you are teaching and that it is contrary to both the Bible and the teachings of the Catholic Church, there is no reason for us to give that any more weight than we give your own ramblings.

Many have seen and heard Our Lord. Francis of Assisi, Padre Pio, The Little Flower, Faustina and many others whose messages in no way have any of the problems that yours suffer. The result is that yours lack credibility. As a matter of fact, as we get to hear more and more of your teachings…the less likely I am disposed to listening.

Even a demon possessed person would answer with “… Jesus I know, and Paul I know; but who are you?” (Apostles 19:15)
Pax vobiscum,

 

[Dan-Man916]

Giver:

Why is it that many Christians are not willing to accept that Jesus will speak to them audibly?

You are missing the point because no one here is saying that Jesus speaking to them audibly is not possible.

The problem they have is your interpretation of Scripture, not Scripture itself.

Muhammed claimed that an angel spoke to him and he dictated God’s word in the Koran. Muhammed believed the Koran is God’s word.
The same reason you don’t believe that claim by Muhammed is the same reason people don’t believe your claim; it is because it is not consonant with what has been handed down from the Apostles both orally and in written form.

 

[Giver]

Church Militant:

Robert, you have been shown again and again why none of us accept you as a prophet.
It’s really pretty simple.
In spite of all the verses and passages that you quote us…your teachings contradict the Word of God as well as the verifiable teachings of the early church.

That being the case, it becomes a matter of research and discernment that leads me and other Catholics to reject your teachings.

I have no problem with believers hearing from Our Lord, nor would any bishops, BUT, since the Bishops you supposedly spoke to didn’t know specifically what you are teaching and that it is contrary to both the Bible and the teachings of the Catholic Church, there is no reason for us to give that any more weight than we give your own ramblings.

Many have seen and heard Our Lord. Francis of Assisi, Padre Pio, The Little Flower, Faustina and many others whose messages in no way have any of the problems that yours suffer. The result is that yours lack credibility. As a matter of fact, as we get to hear more and more of your teachings…the less likely I am disposed to listening.

Even a demon possessed person would answer with “… Jesus I know, and Paul I know; but who are you?” (Apostles 19:15)
Pax vobiscum,

You have never even tried to hear what I have been saying, otherwise you would know that I have never contradicted scripture, and if you don’t want to listen to me, it is your loss not mine.

 

[montanaman]

Giver:

You have never even tried to hear what I have been saying, otherwise you would know that I have never contradicted scripture, and if you don’t want to listen to me, it is your loss not mine.

Heh. No, you’ve never tried to listen to any of these fine apologists, otherwise you’d know that you’re mired in heresy.

Lol. See how debates go when they’re cut loose from objective reality?

 

[Pax]

Giver:

Pax, we have been all through this, you know I judge everything by the Word of God. Everything I have been taught by Jesus is scriptural. Not everything I have been taught agrees with your theology, but that doesn’t make me wrong.

Your agreement/disagreement with my theology is not the problem or the point. It is your disagreements with the clear words of scripture that disturb me and others. You frequently refuse to acknowledge the truth spelled out in scripture when it denies your erroneous contentions.

You might take note that the numerous Catholics and Protestants that have responded to you do not share all of the same theology with one another. Nevertheless, all of these people have recognized your mistatements and erroneous interpretations of scripture and have, together, patiently tried to help you see what scripture really says. It is your rejection of all of the scriptural truth that has been given you that is so utterly troubling.

 

[mercygate]

Many saints and mystics have received supernatural locutions from Christ himself. Many of those saints and mystics were counseled by their spiritual directors and bishops not to speak of these experiences publicly until the spirits could be tested against the word of God. Those locutions that have been demonstrated to be authentic have been promulgated for the edification of the faithful but since they lie outside the core of public revelation, no Catholic is required to accept them de fide.

One of the signs of an inauthentic locution is the insistence by the person receiving it that it supercedes Scripture or the legitimate authority of the bishop.

When you say that all disciples of Jesus are to have no property, this clearly contradicts the evidence of Scripture. Yes, many were called to “sell all they had and give it to the poor” but others, like the Bethany family and Joseph of Arimathea, were called to a different discipleship and used their material substance to support the apostolic effort, as did the women who followed Jesus and later those who aided the apostles. St. Francis of Assisi was called to perfect poverty, and thousands of men and women have followed him. But not all are called to the evangelical counsel of total poverty.

 

[Pax]

Giver:

You have never even tried to hear what I have been saying, otherwise you would know that I have never contradicted scripture, and if you don’t want to listen to me, it is your loss not mine.

Try listening to the Spirit filled Catholics on these forums and then try applying this statement to yourself. It will be to your spiritual gain. If you do not, it will indeed be your loss.

 

[thistle]

Well Giver, has your voice said anything about post #7 yet?
The voice has had plenty of time to think about it.
Why are you refusing to answer??

 

[mlchance]

Giver:

Why is it that many Christians are not willing to accept that Jesus will speak to them audibly?

Ask Jesus. Tell us what he says. After all, you’re the one he talks to.

– Mark L. Chance.