Why not distribute unconsecrated bread and wine at Mass to those unable to take part in the Eucharist?

[Mrs_Sally]

Thank you very much ConstantineTG. That was an extremely helpful explanation.

So the Eastern/Orthodox also do not offer “communion lite” to those who are not members of that Church.

You also brought up an important point - in the past non-Catholics / non-Orthodox would not still be in church for the Liturgy of the Eucharist. So not only were they not allowed to receive, they were not even allowed to stay and see or hear the consecration.

We need to remember that today. The Holy Eucharist is our Lord, truly and completely and at the consecration heaven comes down to earth. This is not at all the same as a “memorial” done in a protestant church. Our separated bretheran and non-believers cannot receive, because they do not know what they are receiving.

Rather than trying to find a way to sneak them snacks during Mass, we need to be praying and working toward a real conversion among our friends and family.

 

[Cavaradossi]

It really does depend on the jurisdiction. At my parish, visitors are free to receive antidoron, although at times it can confuse people (as one of our priests once joked, ‘if I happen to give a visitor antidoron, he will usually look at me like I’ve handed him a bomb’). It is also not uncommon for people to grab two pieces of antidoron and to give a piece to others who did not commune. But then in other jurisdictions, I know that such practices are discouraged. Antidoron presents an awkward problem, being blessed, as there is a question as to how exactly it should be treated when the heterodox and penitents are involved. That being said, it definitely is not some sort of feel-good communion-lite. If it is handed out to visitors, that is simply a gesture of good will, nothing more.

 

[ByzCathCantor]

Antidoron presents an awkward problem, being blessed, as there is a question as to how exactly it should be treated when the heterodox and penitents are involved. That being said, it definitely is not some sort of feel-good communion-lite. If it is handed out to visitors, that is simply a gesture of good will, nothing more.

Indeed - of goodwill, and for health and God’s blessings. On the EC side, at least in the Ruthenian Church, blessed bread (phosphora) is only distributed as part of festive annointing (Mirovanije), with such properly blessed at the Litija the evening before (but sometimes right after the Ambon Prayer, if Vespers were not held), and is typically phosphora not used for the Eucharistic celebration. The “distance” from the Eucharist is even greater in this case.

 

[LilyM]

Well, with the caveat that it should probably only be given to Orthodox or Catholics who cannot commune, I still think it could be a good idea, and properly employed could dispel the feeling some Latins have that they need to commune at every Mass, and the sense of exclusion of non-communicants that leads at least some to commune improperly (eg not having fasted or whilst in a state of unconfessed mortal sin)

 

[TrueLight]

When I attended the Divine Liturgy at the Orthodox Church in America, I was obviously a visitor/non-Orthodox member and a woman came from behind and handed me a piece of the bread. They gave communion by liturgical spoons there.

I was so happy because it felt very welcoming to me. I had not gone on the non-communion line to receive the blessed bread, but it was like she was saying, “We welcome you”. At the time, I was not even yet Catholic.

I looked at the Orthodox woman who had been assigned as my “guide” so to speak, for the liturgy and asked if it was okay for me to have it and she said yes.

So it did fell like a “feel good” gesture.

I love the idea of the bread being used to assuage some of the hunger from the fast.

 

[Celtic_Maiden]

During Christmas time, the Poles (and others) exchange unconsecrated bread (opłatek) with one another as a show of communion. I’ve heard this done after the liturgies as well. It’s really a beautiful custom, something even some Americans who attend there like to participate in.

This person is a non believer, maybe even a Non Catholic, hence does not understand what Our Lord said “I am the living bread that came down from heaven whoever eats this bread that I will give is my flesh for the life of the world, the Jews quarreled among themselves “How can this man give us his flesh to eat” and Jesus said to them unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood you do not have life within you” Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life and I will raise him on the last day" Then many of his disciples who were listening said "This saying is hard ( the unbeliever’s) and cannot accept it, and as a result of this many of his disciples returned home. This describes our Protestants brethren, the saying is hard and cannot accept it,we will do this as a symbol with grape juice and a loaf of bread, we have to pray for them to get the Grace and see that the Lord’s Word is bigger than what mankind can comprehend, Satan has a way of throwing spanners in the works like this unbeliever with there stupid comments and trying to put the Catholic Church into a spin, it wont work, we loyal Catholics wont fall for these absurb suggestions from a non believer to boot, it is the way it is, the way it is taught to us by Mother Church and will be that way until the end of time, begone Satan.take your suggestions to the Protestant Church who by what I hear change there teachings with what the media want. At the last Supper they were all Jews who are very traditional and what was done is done for all time ( Having been Jewish I should know and now a Catholic) As one member rightly stated IT WAS AN ABSURB QUESTION POSTED BY A ?:

 

[TrueLight]

he end of time, begone Satan.take your suggestions to the Protestant Church who by what I hear change there teachings with what the media wants]\quote]

Agree with Jharek.

Without derailing the thread, you might want to research protestants a little better, to pray fir them and to share your faith with them more effectlively.

 

[ConstantineTG]

When I attended the Divine Liturgy at the Orthodox Church in America, I was obviously a visitor/non-Orthodox member and a woman came from behind and handed me a piece of the bread. They gave communion by liturgical spoons there.

Same thing happened to me. I fasted anyway that morning despite knowing I won’t be receiving Communion. But we receive Jesus Christ anyway in the Liturgy through His Word. So I still fasted. I saw them set out the antidoron but I didn’t come up to get them. They were set far from where Communion is given so I wouldn’t have bumped into the Communicants, but I still didn’t. One of the catechumens then came back and handed me a piece of bread. Very nice gesture.

I was so happy because it felt very welcoming to me. I had not gone on the non-communion line to receive the blessed bread, but it was like she was saying, “We welcome you”. At the time, I was not even yet Catholic.

Maybe it was a hint,hint

I looked at the Orthodox woman who had been assigned as my “guide” so to speak, for the liturgy and asked if it was okay for me to have it and she said yes.

So it did fell like a “feel good” gesture.

I love the idea of the bread being used to assuage some of the hunger from the fast.

It is much better if someone gives it to you than you take it for yourself

 

[jmjconder]

Would you give your leftover bread to a starving child?

**If a starving child came to me and asked for leftover bread and I had a piece of styrofoam that looked like bread - would I give it to them anyway? NO. If the “leftover bread” was of no nutritional value to a starving child why would you offer a piece of nothing.

Why give someone a fake piece of bread when what they are asking for will satisfy their hungry heart and soul?**

 

[ByzCathCantor]

**If a starving child came to me and asked for leftover bread and I had a piece of styrofoam that looked like bread - would I give it to them anyway? NO. If the “leftover bread” was of no nutritional value to a starving child why would you offer a piece of nothing.

Why give someone a fake piece of bread when what they are asking for will satisfy their hungry heart and soul?**

As you are “Born Latin Married a Byzantine”, I suppose your spouse or priest can explain the custom of Mirovanije to you. I doubt that they will tell you that styrofoam is shared.

 

[ConstantineTG]

**If a starving child came to me and asked for leftover bread and I had a piece of styrofoam that looked like bread - would I give it to them anyway? NO. If the “leftover bread” was of no nutritional value to a starving child why would you offer a piece of nothing.

Why give someone a fake piece of bread when what they are asking for will satisfy their hungry heart and soul?**

The blessed bread in Byzantine services are still blessed bread. They do have spiritual “nutritional value”. But we should not pretend they are some sort of Eucharist for non-members of our Church. As long as they are taken in the proper context, there should be no problem in sharing them with everyone.

 

[MarMax]

This is ridiculous and stinks of the fetid fruit of modernist mindsets where everyone is equal and the focus is on mealtime (versus the Sacrifice of the Mass). It’s confusing; it erodes the entire point. It’s like a booth for kissing the best man so no one feels left out that only the bride and groom got to kiss. In context of the Eucharist, this is a despicable idea.

 

[ByzCathCantor]

This is ridiculous and stinks of the fetid fruit of modernist mindsets where everyone is equal and the focus is on mealtime (versus the Sacrifice of the Mass). It’s confusing; it erodes the entire point. It’s like a booth for kissing the best man so no one feels left out that only the bride and groom got to kiss. In context of the Eucharist, this is a despicable idea.

Yes, indeed - Eastern Christians (including Eastern Catholics) do tend to be overt, flagrant modernists …

 

[ConstantineTG]

Yes, indeed - Eastern Christians (including Eastern Catholics) do tend to be overt, flagrant modernists …

I agree with MarMax here in that if we’re doing this just to placate the non-Catholics who can’t receive Communion, then it is indeed a terrible modernist idea. The Byzantine traditions was never intended to be used as “Communion Lite” and therefore has nothing to do about his comments.

 

[TrueLight]

This is ridiculous and stinks of the fetid fruit of modernist mindsets where everyone is equal and the focus is on mealtime (versus the Sacrifice of the Mass). It’s confusing; it erodes the entire point. It’s like a booth for kissing the best man so no one feels left out that only the bride and groom got to kiss. In context of the Eucharist, this is a despicable idea.

Let’s keep in mind that the OP is “not a believer”, and is satisfying his curiosity, which is fine.

Now if a Catholic started this thread, I’d be worried.

 

[Hokomai]

This is ridiculous and stinks of the fetid fruit of modernist mindsets where everyone is equal and the focus is on mealtime (versus the Sacrifice of the Mass). It’s confusing; it erodes the entire point. It’s like a booth for kissing the best man so no one feels left out that only the bride and groom got to kiss. In context of the Eucharist, this is a despicable idea.

I was just asking …

 

[MarMax]

I agree with MarMax here in that if we’re doing this just to placate the non-Catholics who can’t receive Communion, then it is indeed a terrible modernist idea. The Byzantine traditions was never intended to be used as “Communion Lite” and therefore has nothing to do about his comments.

I was just asking …

See Constantine’s reply.

 

[Cristiano]

Would you give your leftover bread to a starving child?

You can kill a person by feeding them the wrong food, especially starving ones.

I think that the best approach is to invite everybody to donuts and coffee in the parish hall after Mass for some nice Christian socialization.

 

[ByzCathCantor]

I agree with MarMax here in that if we’re doing this just to placate the non-Catholics who can’t receive Communion, then it is indeed a terrible modernist idea. The Byzantine traditions was never intended to be used as “Communion Lite” and therefore has nothing to do about his comments.

No one would dispute that, yet that is not the nature of the custom and tradition, as you are aware.

 

[ConstantineTG]

You can kill a person by feeding them the wrong food, especially starving ones.

I think we are talking past each other here. ByzCathCantor is merely upholding our Eastern tradition of blessed bread during our Liturgies which in recent times we have allowed non-believers to partake of. Surely the non-believers still deserve our prayers and blessings, we are not sharing the Eucharist with them but the blessed bread and wine, we do not hold back. But ByzCathCantor is not suggesting that we institute a practice as “Communion Lite” for non-believers. He is just defending the fact that we have allowed non-believers to share in this even though the original intention of the blessed bread was to feed the hungry faithful (ie. those who can and have received Communion) after fasting for a long time.