Why not distributism?

  • Thread starter Thread starter InJesusItrust
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
I

InJesusItrust

Guest
Why do many Catholics jump to defend Capitalism like its the only just economic system here?
 
InJesusItrust said:
Why do many Catholics jump to defend Capitalism like its the only just economic system here?
Click to expand...
I am one Catholic who defends Capitalism. Why, because it without any doubts the best economic system in the history of man. In every country there is poverty. In every capitalist country poverty is relative. In every non-capitalist country poverty is absolute. There is a big difference between the poor that cannot afford the latest iPhone and the poor that cannot afford food. I work hard for my education and I work hard for my money. I give to the church and to charity and I have a right to keep the rest of MY money.

The question is not why we defend Capitalism. The real question is, “What other economic system would you suggest we convert to?”

Obamaism? :eek:

Ran
 
Is it all Catholics, or is it mainly American Catholics, that are being culturally influenced by their home country?
 
InJesusItrust said:
Why do many Catholics jump to defend Capitalism like its the only just economic system here?
Click to expand...
Most of them because they don’t know any better. Also, because the democratic party is so dedicated to objective evil, it’s easy for the GOP to lure Catholics. Capitalism is not by itself evil. The way we implement it surely is evil, however.

Distributism still has a future, though. We have tried the other two systems and they failed us. So it’s only a matter of time before we transition to some form of distributism or something that uses much of those ideas. Capitalism is already failing spectacularly. It wasn’t all that long ago that Kenneth Clark predicted the end of capitalism’s “heroic materialism”. Back then, people thought he was crazy. Not so much now.

youtube.com/watch?v=r9lmepH9STs
The moral and intellectual failure of Marxism has left us with no alternative to heroic materialism, and that isn’t enough.
Click to expand...
 
I am subscribing to this!

Personally I find heavily socialistic and communistic systems a bit disconcerting because people depend on the Government and not much else and it can lead to disastrous results-Russia,Nicaragua and Zimbabwe cutting social services in order to fit austerity(similar to what is happening to Europe(especially Greece) quite recently so. I would rather live in a system of smaller limited government with a vibrant and active civil society.

Distributionism seems like a middle ground though-but what exactly would it look like in a modern context-wasn’t it invented back then and not brought up compared to conventional liberalism and conservatism(in fact it appears to be quite recently when libertarianism also made a comeback)

Do you think libertarianism and distributionism could be compatible.
**"… Grace to you, and peace from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ." Romans 1:7 **
 
fallow_spirit said:
Is it all Catholics, or is it mainly American Catholics, that are being culturally influenced by their home country?
Click to expand...
Your culture influences you no matter where you are, even if you don’t realize it. This is why it’s important to have a good culture, or a culture period, if you go by Ghandi’s theory that the West doesn’t even have a culture.
 
I don’t believe in corporatism but I do believe in capitalism. The reason is because it is rooted in personal accountability and responsible work ethic, which are both integral to Christian Tradition. It’s generally secular or even Marxist minds that are attracted to more collectivist models.

The majority of corruption that comes out of capitalistic societies is when corporations succeed in becoming shadow policymakers. This is why Coke doesn’t taste as good in the US; high fructose corn syrup is subsidized and natural sugar cane is unable to compete. So when you drink a Coke elsewhere, it’s made with natural sugar cane. In the US market, it’s high fructose corn syrup.
 
Distributism is not the answer. Just look at how our world has advanced technologically over the past 150 years or so. It’s big business that made it all possible. Distributism would take us back to the dark ages.
 
It’s big business that made it all possible.
Click to expand...
There should be a way to restrain their excesses though but yeah its companies like Monsanto,Apple and Walmart that do help make life easy for us. And not all CEOs are evil people-it’s just the evil ones that corrupt the Capitalism of ideology.
 
and if we go back to the dark ages all we would have is swords and dirks, now we can manufacture lots and lots of guns.[SIGN] hooray capitalism[/SIGN]
 
RCIAGraduate said:
Personally I find heavily socialistic and communistic systems a bit disconcerting because …
Click to expand...
What? :bigyikes:

If there is any lesson from the 20th century it is that socialism and communism are total failures! If you think those systems have any value then why are you not living (not visiting) in Cuba, China, or North Korea? I can only guess that you were born after the fall of the Berlin wall.:rolleyes:
 
Rete #4
Capitalism is not by itself evil.
Click to expand...
Correct.
The way we implement it surely is evil, however
Click to expand...
.
That is not because of the free enterprise system whose virtuous bases were explained by the Catholic Late Scholastics and originated with the Benedictine monks in the ninth century, but due to Original Sin and human greed in people which is present in all human endeavour. Hence the need for virtues and values and laws to curb immoral behaviour.
Distributism still has a future, though. We have tried the other two systems and they failed us.
Click to expand...
Well, hardly. What has created failure in economies is government interference and the idiotic ideas that support welfare states and government interference in free enterprise rather than sensible laws.
 
InJesusItrust said:
Why do many Catholics jump to defend Capitalism like its the only just economic system here?
Click to expand...
Regarding the title of your thread, why don’t you, rather than attacking capitalism, defend distributism?

And, while you’re at it, why don’t you describe how you would suggest a State implement such a system on a national basis…without managing to violate all of Catholic Social Teaching in the process?

(NB: I have heard a lot of people talk about it as a pie-in-the-sky type of thing, but I have yet to hear of one practical method of a State implementing such an economic system. But I’m open to listening)
 
The first step to distributism is to realize that capitalism is unjust to the poor, measures the worth of humans by productivity, and relies on usury to succeed. It’s aim is not for the common good and leads to both consumerism and selfish individualism. Popes have spoken out against both capitalism and socialism, but distributism is consistent with Catholic Social Teaching.
 
InJesusItrust said:
The first step to distributism is to realize that capitalism is unjust to the poor, measures the worth of humans by productivity, and relies on usury to succeed. It’s aim is not for the common good and leads to both consumerism and selfish individualism. Popes have spoken out against both capitalism and socialism, but distributism is consistent with Catholic Social Teaching.
Click to expand...
So you want to play Obama and take the money I work really hard for and give it to others? Well, why would I keep working if the fruit of my work is taken from me? Why would I not sit back with my hand out for my share of distribution and banging a drum at some Occupy-Someplay event?

This distributism stuff is just silly. This thread is like listening to drunken political science majors discuss who they could fix all of the nations problems. Silly.

Ranp
 
Looks like you don’t care what the Church teaches. Do you understand that distributism distributes the means of production? It’s the opposite of Obama.
 
InJesusItrust #16
Popes have spoken out against both capitalism and socialism….
capitalism is unjust to the poor, measures the worth of humans by productivity, and relies on usury to succeed.
Click to expand...
As Jesus chastised His Apostles the mistaken should listen and learn.
To His own Apostles, “whom He loved to the end” Jesus exclaimed: “Have you no sense, no wits, are your hearts dulled, can’t you see, your ears hear, don’t you remember?” (Mk 8:17-18). (Frank Sheed, Christ In Eclipse, Sheed & Ward 1978, p 42).

Don’t you know of the acknowledged St John Paul II’s support of free enterprise in *Centesimus Annus, *1991?
CA 42. ‘Returning now to the initial question: can it perhaps be said that, after the failure of Communism, capitalism is the victorious social system, and that capitalism should be the goal of the countries now making efforts to rebuild their economy and society? Is this the model which ought to be proposed to the countries of the Third World which are searching for the path to true economic and civil progress?
‘The answer is obviously complex. If by “capitalism” is meant an economic system which recognizes the fundamental and positive role of business, the market, private property and the resulting responsibility for the means of production, as well as free human creativity in the economic sector, then the answer is certainly in the affirmative, even though it would perhaps be more appropriate to speak of a “business economy”, “market economy” or simply “free economy”.
‘CA 43. The Church has no models to present;’ [My emphasis].

Pope Benedict XVI felt it necessary to teach that “Society does not have to protect itself from the market, as if the development of the latter were ipso facto to entail the death of authentically human relations…Therefore it is not the instrument that must be called to account, but individuals, their moral conscience and their personal and social responsibility.” (Caritas et Veritate, Benedict XVI, 2009, #36).

Usury is not involved in free enterprise. It is people who do evil by being greedy, cheating, stealing and all the other vices.
 
First of all, Capitalism today does indeed involve usury. Private banks charge interest for countries using their worthless currency, and it is one of the reason why everything is coming apart.

Secondly, Pope Francis and Pope Benedict XVI have routinely critique unregulated Capitalism. What do you think free enterprise is?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top