Why not Orthodoxy?

[Eden]

I’ll pray for you JSmitty.

 

[Eden]

JSmitty2005:

No, not I. The Church has protested against itself. Pius X would have condemned/excommunicated/anathematized many of the bishops (including the Roman one) in the “Church” over the past 40 years. He warned us. We didn’t listen. Look where we are. Although the destruction of the Liturgy was a tragedy, the change in direction of the Church with regard to false religions is irreconcilable with the Church’s previous teachings. Ecumenism, religious liberty, and freedom of speech are evil; there is NO salvation outside of the Church; and relativism and indifference are a result of all of these teachings that the Church has strayed from. She is a traitor and has betrayed Herself. I think I’m leaving the forums. Goodbye, guys.

Isn’t Pope Benedict XVI working toward reuniting the SSPX with the Church?

From the SSPX website:

The Society of Saint Pius X professes filial devotion and loyalty to Pope Benedict XVI, the Successor of Saint Peter and the Vicar of Christ.

The priests of the SSPX pray for the intentions of the Holy Father and the welfare of the local Ordinary at every Mass they celebrate.

www.sspx.org

As far as Vatican II, what I have been told by members of my family who lived through it, is that nothing from the “deposit of faith” was “changed”. We are talking about traditions (small t) from the Middle Ages that were changed. Do I prefer the TLM? Yes. But I don’t agree that joining schismatic churches is the solution! Especially when the SSPX is on the verge of reuniting with Rome and indults for the TLM are increasing. Like I said, I will pray for you. You have been deceived.

 

[Lazerlike42]

JSmitty2005:

No, not I. The Church has protested against itself. Pius X would have condemned/excommunicated/anathematized many of the bishops (including the Roman one) in the “Church” over the past 40 years. He warned us. We didn’t listen. Look where we are. Although the destruction of the Liturgy was a tragedy, the change in direction of the Church with regard to false religions is irreconcilable with the Church’s previous teachings. Ecumenism, religious liberty, and freedom of speech are evil; there is NO salvation outside of the Church; and relativism and indifference are a result of all of these teachings that the Church has strayed from. She is a traitor and has betrayed Herself. I think I’m leaving the forums. Goodbye, guys.

Are you aware that several of the teachings of the Church with regards to false religions that we consider new today were first taught explicitly by Pius IX and Pius X?

 

[Lazerlike42]

Pope St. Pius X Catechism, Question 132 - Will a person outside the Church be saved? It is a most serious loss to be outside the Church, because outside one does not have either the means which have been established or the secure guidance which has been set up for eternal salvation, which is the one thing truly necessary for man. A person outside the Church by his own fault, and who dies without perfect contrition, will not be saved. But he who finds himself outside without fault of his own, and who lives a good life, can be saved by the love called charity, which unites unto God, and in a spiritual way also to the Church, that is, to the soul of the Church.

Pope St. Pius X Catechism, Question 280 - If Baptism is necessary for all men, is no one saved without Baptism? - Without Baptism no one can be saved. However, when it is impossible to receive Baptism of water, the Baptism of blood suffices, that is, martyrdom suffered for Jesus Christ; and also the Baptism of desire suffices, which is the love of God by charity, desiring to make use of the means of salvation instituted by God.

1. Here, too, our beloved sons and venerable brothers, it is again necessary to mention and censure a very grave error entrapping some Catholics who believe that it is possible to arrive at eternal salvation although living in error and alienated from the true faith and Catholic unity. Such belief is certainly opposed to Catholic teaching. There are, of course, those who are struggling with invincible ignorance about our most holy religion. Sincerely observing the natural law and its precepts inscribed by God on all hearts and ready to obey God, they live honest lives and are able to attain eternal life by the efficacious virtue of divine light and grace. Because God knows, searches and clearly understands the minds, hearts, thoughts, and nature of all, his supreme kindness and clemency do not permit anyone at all who is not guilty of deliberate sin to suffer eternal torments.

1. Also well known is the Catholic teaching that no one can be saved outside the Catholic Church. Eternal salvation cannot be obtained by those who oppose the authority and statements of the same Church and are stubbornly separated from the unity of the Church and also from the successor of Peter, the Roman Pontiff, to whom “the custody of the vineyard has been committed by the Savior.”[4] The words of Christ are clear enough: “If he refuses to listen even to the Church, let him be to you a Gentile and a tax collector;”[5] “He who hears you hears me, and he who rejects you, rejects me, and he who rejects me, rejects him who sent me;”[6] “He who does not believe will be condemned;”[7] “He who does not believe is already condemned;”[8] “He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters.”[9] The Apostle Paul says that such persons are “perverted and self-condemned;”[10] the Prince of the Apostles calls them “false teachers . . . who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master. . . bringing upon themselves swift destruction.”[11]

1. God forbid that the children of the Catholic Church should even in any way be unfriendly to those who are not at all united to us by the same bonds of faith and love. On the contrary, let them be eager always to attend to their needs with all the kind services of Christian charity, whether they are poor or sick or suffering any other kind of visitation. First of all, let them rescue them from the darkness of the errors into which they have unhappily fallen and strive to guide them back to Catholic truth and to their most loving Mother who is ever holding out her maternal arms to receive them lovingly back into her fold. Thus, firmly founded in faith, hope, and charity and fruitful in every good work, they will gain eternal salvation.

• Pius IX, Quanto Conficiamur Moerore [Emphasis mine]

I don’t want to hijack the thread, but just a few things for you to consider, JSmitty. JPII was not really as far off from Pius IX and St. Pius X as you may think.

 

[RyanL]

Lazerlike42:

I don’t want to hijack the thread, but just a few things for you to consider, JSmitty. JPII was not really as far off from Pius IX and St. Pius X as you may think.

To echo this sentiment:
From Orthodoxinfo.com:

The status of the heterodox is properly seen in two ways. When speaking of their *ecclesial *status - i.e., their relation to the Orthodox Church - we would say that the heterodox [non-Orthodox] cannot be seen as Her members, because they have not been grafted into the one true Body of Christ through Holy Baptism. On the other hand, when speaking of their eternal status - i.e., the implications of this ecclesial separation - , we leave them to the mercy of God and do not judge them. Affirmation of their separation does not require belief in their damnation.

Source.

If you want, I’m sure I could find you a Fundamentalist group that says you can’t be saved unless you’re a part of their club…

God Bless,
RyanL