Why our body must die?

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Benadam said:
I’m not sure if I’m thinking as an analogy. I was considering the entire creation renewed in a great Eucharistic ontological change of substance.
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Hmm. But, our substance doesn’t change in the eschaton, does it? I mean, I’ll still be me! I’ll still possess what makes me me – that is, my soul!

When Aquinas discussed transubstantiation, he was distinguishing between substance and accident – that is, between “what makes a thing be that thing” and “what material stuff is present in that thing.” In the eschaton, our accidents will have changed, but our substance remains the same.
 
Gorgias said:
Hmm. But, our substance doesn’t change in the eschaton, does it? I mean, I’ll still be me! I’ll still possess what makes me me – that is, my soul!
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I( have these Scriptures in mind when I think it’s a change in substance.
1 cor.
So it is with the resurrection of the dead. What is sown is perishable, what is raised is imperishable.
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2 Peter
10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a loud noise, and the elements will be dissolved with fire, and the earth and everything that is done on it will be disclosed.[c]

11 Since all these things are to be dissolved in this way, what sort of persons ought you to be in leading lives of holiness and godliness, 12 waiting for and hastening[d] the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be set ablaze and dissolved, and the elements will melt with fire? 13 But, in accordance with his promise, we wait for new heavens and a new earth, where righteousness is at home.
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I’m thinking for those who are changed to life everlasting, the substance (soul) changes in that the accidents(body) don’t necessarily exist. But are subject to the will.( thus appearing or not, passing through walls) For the damned their substance changes in that the accidents enslave the will.
 
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Gorgias said:
When Aquinas discussed transubstantiation, he was distinguishing between substance and accident – that is, between “what makes a thing be that thing” and “what material stuff is present in that thing.” In the eschaton, our accidents will have changed, but our substance remains the same.
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I see what you mean about the accidents changing. I think there is a unity of being that is substance and accident. That the substance is the form of the accident. So the substance is revealed by the accident for the damned .But that doesn’t happen to the saved. Their accidents are subject to the substance. I’m thinking the substance must undergo change for those things to be.
 
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“…[place] all your hope in the GRACE to
be brought to us AT THE REVELATION
of Jesus Christ(Eschaton)” 1 Pet.1:13
 
I wonder if that is a substantial change to the soul or a change more like some kind of imprint. Does baptism change substance? The Church teaches it as an imprint. A mark. I’m think @Gorgias is right. But what is New about Heaven? Hypostatic union with Earth
 
I do not see why it would be a change to the substance, I would agree it is more an imprint.

Heavenly things are difficult to think about. The Hypostatic Union refers to Christ’s one Person in 2 Natures, so I’m unsure of what you mean.
 
Kei said:
Hypostatic Union refers to Christ’s one Person in 2 Natures, so I’m unsure of what you mean.
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It’s His hypostatic union of spiritual and material that is the New union of heaven and earth
 
Is there something that makes you unsure or need some further validation? If so nothing wrong with that.
 
I simply do not know that such is true, that the material and spirit are combined in such a way.

But the Hypostatic Union is a bit different from merely a mixture of spirit and material; all human souls seem to fit that in some form. It is the union of Jesus’ Divine Nature and His human Nature in the One Person, both fully. What was assumed at the Incarnation is human nature.
 
Kei, I think you are the type that remains open to all the possibilities so if its true or not you’ll end up knowing. 😊
 
I thought we got you sorted on this one…it is accidental. If it was substantial you would turn into something non human! Well the Easterns might say one was divinised and you have become a god.

But really, you have only become “super-human” and been taken into God rather than become God.
A bit like adding a wireless keyboard extension to your tablet or overclocking it. Its still a tablet…but a super-charged tablet running with the big boys (ie small computers). Accidental change.
 
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Nope. This is Platonic Christianity(Augustinian spirituality) - acceptable enough in the first 800 years of Christianity but not so much now.

The union of human and divine natures is NOT the union of heaven and earth in the way you seem to be using those words (spiritual and material). You have confused Greek paradigms (matter versus form/soul) with Hebrew paradigms (flesh versus Spirit).

There is already spiritual in human nature (the soul inclined to matter) as there obviously is in the divine nature (pure spirit). Jesus had a soul, it was not replaced by his divine nature.
 
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On Paul’s second missionary journey in the Book
of Acts in the Bible, he refers to the Holy Spirit as
the Spirit of Jesus.See Acts 16:7, so when He gave
up the ghost, it was the Holy Ghost, or Holy Spirit,
is MY understanding. See CCC 1120, 2605
 
GLam1761 said:
…so when He gave up the ghost, it was the Holy Ghost, or Holy Spirit,
is MY understanding. See CCC 1120, 2605
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No. This is simplistic “proof texting” based on the idiosyncrasies of the English language.
It doesn’t work if we realise the English is but a translation of Hebrew, Greek or Latin where this sort of associating of English words falls over.

For example, “giving up the spirit” is simply a euphemism for dying.
It makes more sense in the original Hebrew where it literally means a “ceasing of the breath.”
Breath in Hebrew signifies “life” (as in God breathing life into the clay of Adam). In Latin that often gets translated as “soul”. So it is best read as Jesus’s soul leaving his body.

The “Spirit of Jesus” like the “Spirit of the Father” is a primitive, loose expression for the Holy Spirit.

So no, Jesus did not give up the Holy Ghost when he died. It was his human soul.
 
I think that I made a mistake in posting this,
because you are RIGHT, Jesus was fully
Human and therefore MUST possess a soul
and therefore His own will. “Jesus knew that
the hour had come for HIM TO GO TO the
Father” Jn. 13:1 That meant that not only His
Body, but His SOUL was going to the Father!!
 
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