Why outlaw secular gay marriage?

[wisedom]

I would be much happier to live in a society where the governing authority is the Church, a society where all were civilized, honest, and of solid moral character. A society where no one would be violent towards another and no one would steal from another (except maybe to prevent starvation- but if such a society were to exist I am quite confident that anyone without food would be given food by his neighbors.

God Bless,
Bill

you are blissfully ignorant or unaware that violence and stealing most characterises the so called church - violence in its worst form unleashed on innocent children whose birth-rights are stolen! ???

 

[wisedom]

I already found what I was looking for, but I’ll respond to you so I don’t leave you hanging.

It not an imposition of the Church to outlaw murder because society agrees. If two people agree, there is no imposing. The reason why so many people agree with us on the argument against murder is because the consequences are absolute and immediate; Someone was killed, their family will grieve, and their children lost a parent.

For something like gay marriage, the consequences are not so immediate. Since the average person does not like to think past lunch, why should they care if some gays want to get married? No skin off their back. Due to this mentality, public support for the ban on gay marriage is softening and in some places it is already legal. This makes the Church lobbying for banning or keeping the ban on gay marriage an imposition because we now have a difference of opinion and our opinion is the minority.

The same one the Catholic Church uses. I do not agree with gay marriage. I am just trying to find the Church’s justification for going against the public-at-large on this. The Church usually shys away from scandal and this issue is a battle that affects the public opinion of the Catholic Church. I’m not saying it isn’t a battle worth fighting. I just want to know the reasoning behind why this issue seems to be so serious. I found my answer here.

the church has received a mandate to operate as a political organisation?..from whom?

 

[wisedom]

Hi Daniel. Welcome to the forums.

I think that you can respond by pointing out that the only way you can “allow” gay marriage is by re-defining marriage in a way that completely separates the institution from its procreative aspects. But without the procreative aspect, even the most loving same-sex relationship cannot really be considered a “marriage” in the way that society has understood the institution from the beginning.

I noted in your earlier post you raised the concern that “imposing” the traditional definition of marriage would be akin to forcing people to take a cure for cancer. I would tweak that analogy a bit, to say that allowing the definition of marriage to be altered so that it simply meant the public recognition of a committment made between two people, would be akin to taking that cancer cure and diluting it to the point that it becomes ineffective. Or perhaps. Similarly, if we were required to acknowledge two forms of equivalent marriage (traditional and so-callled “gay marriage”) it would be akin to saying that the cancer medication was the same thing as a blood pressure medication. Although blood pressure medication can save lives, and may hold beneficial health properties, it is most certainly not the same thing as the cancer drug. So it goes with marriage. The distinction should remain.

Peace,
Robert

GOD ALLOWS THE SUN TO SHINE AND THE RAIN TO FALL ON ALL MEN, INDEPENDENT OF THEIR AFFILIATIONS TO GOOD OR EVIL…and of course, we can never say that gays are evil or wicked or can you???

 

[AT_Cross]

I’ve wrested with this as well, but I’ve noticed that where homosexual marriage has been legalized, those who teach that homosexual behaviors are contrary to God’s law and this sinful are facing rising persecutions. There is even a movement I’ve seen spreading where governments are passing stronger laws to remove children from the homes of parents when the government believes it is in the child’s best interest. Some are calling it a form of child abuse to teach that sexual encounters are meant for a man and a woman in marriage. This is not a case of equality. When gay marriage is legal, it is only the beginning. There will be intensive persecution against those with different principles.

 

[Robert_in_SD]

GOD ALLOWS THE SUN TO SHINE AND THE RAIN TO FALL ON ALL MEN, INDEPENDENT OF THEIR AFFILIATIONS TO GOOD OR EVIL…and of course, we can never say that gays are evil or wicked or can you???

I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make here? I agree that God allows the rain to fall on the just and the wicked. But that has nothing to do with the point I’m making.

Similarly, we cannot judge the state of a person’s soul, but we can look to the Church’s teaching on morality and determine whether particular acts are objectively sinful or not. Again, that has nothing to do with the point I was making. I’m sure there are good people and evil people with same-sex attraction, just as there are good people and evil people who are attracted to the opposite sex. That is for God to judge, and has nothing to do with the definition of marriage.

Marriage is the term that defines a relationship between two people of complimentary gender, who commit to each other *and to the rearing of any children that they produce. * You cannot separate the latter without ignoring a fundamental element of the relationship being described. It does not alter this outcome to say that same-sex couples are composed of people who are “evil” or people who are “good.” The fact remains that they cannot be truly married, because they lack the complimentarity necessary for a fruitful union.

Peace,
Robert