Why so little denunciation by Muslims to

[Antwill]

terrostic violence perpetrated by Muslims around the world?

This is something that has really bothered me, especially since 9/11.

We have Muslims saying that their religion does not condone such things, but I see very few Muslims in positions of authority publicly denouncing these attacks. Are they afraid of the repercussions from the extremists if they speak out?

How about you Muslims on this board? Do you denounce these acts?

 

[tm30]

Islam is extremely fractured, but that doesn’t excuse the fact that there is almost no effort whatsoever to curtail or simply denounce those who kill in the name of Islam. I’m sad to say that the deafening silence makes it very hard for me to trust anyone in a hajeeb or other Islamic religious garb. Instead of standing up to evil in their midst, moderate Islamics play the “victim” card because they’ve drawn suspicion on themselves with the general lack of concern for what their brethren perpetrate.

If terrorism is truly destroying what some call a “religion of peace”, then the adherents of this “peaceful” religion need to start cleaning house and proving themselves to a society that is tired of carting home loved ones in bits and pieces from their latest treachery.

 

[Rodrigo_Bivar]

But boy are they quick to jump up and down and demonstrate and rampage and burn and kill when someone draws some 'toons or the pope makes a speech or Salman Rushdie gets a knighthood.

But the response is sooo muted when Muslims kill (or attempt to do so).

 

[Antwill]

This post has been up for nearly five hours and not one Muslim has responded. I’m beginning to believe that all this talk about Islam being a “peaceful” religion is just that - talk. When push comes to shove, most Muslims will not denounce the violence.

I can understand that fear may be a motivating factor, but on an virtually anonymous discussion board such as this, what is the reason for not denouncing these terroristic attacks?

Really, the non-response is pretty scary to me.

 

[BelFarfalla]

This post has been up for nearly five hours and not one Muslim has responded. I’m beginning to believe that all this talk about Islam being a “peaceful” religion is just that - talk. When push comes to shove, most Muslims will not denounce the violence.

I can understand that fear may be a motivating factor, but on an virtually anonymous discussion board such as this, what is the reason for not denouncing these terroristic attacks?

Really, the non-response is pretty scary to me.

Don’t forget that if a Muslim is in a Muslim country their internet usage is usually monitored. They have to be very carful what they say or they can be in a lot of serious trouble.

 

[Danni]

Why would a Muslim be posting at a Catholic message board? How many Catholics on this site post on Muslim message boards?

 

[Antwill]

Don’t forget that if a Muslim is in a Muslim country their internet usage is usually monitored. They have to be very carful what they say or they can be in a lot of serious trouble.

Good point and if this is true, I apologize to those who are in that situation. However, are there not any Muslims on the board who are not in that predicament?

 

[Antwill]

Why would a Muslim be posting at a Catholic message board? How many Catholics on this site post on Muslim message boards?

There are Muslims who post on this board. Look at some of the other threads and you will see them.

 

[Ella]

I can’t speak for Muslims in general, but I think the ones that post here get sick of repeating that they do not support 9/11 and terrorism.
Where things get ‘sticky’ is when we discuss stuff like ‘insults to Islam’ being answered with violence, and so forth.

 

[BelFarfalla]

Why would a Muslim be posting at a Catholic message board? How many Catholics on this site post on Muslim message boards?

We have many Muslims who post here.

The name of this forum is Non-Catholic Religions. I do believe that Islam falls under that title.

 

[BelFarfalla]

Why would a Muslim be posting at a Catholic message board? How many Catholics on this site post on Muslim message boards?

Danni, what religion is ‘other’? It really is useful, on a forum about religion, to know a person’s religion. “other” does not tell us a lot. Can you share with us what religion you belong to is any?

 

[Antwill]

I can’t speak for Muslims in general, but I think the ones that post here get sick of repeating that they do not support 9/11 and terrorism.
Where things get ‘sticky’ is when we discuss stuff like ‘insults to Islam’ being answered with violence, and so forth.

I’m relatively new to the board, so I very well may have missed posts from our Muslim brothers and sisters that denounce terroristic violence. However, I think this issue is important enough to be discussed more than once.

Plus, part of my original post was an explanation for why more Muslim leaders (clerics, sheiks, etc.) haven’t denounced these actions. In answering that question, one wouldn’t have to divulge their personal feelings, would they?

As for “insults to Islam” being justifiable reasons for violence - I’m sure that the 9/11 attackers and those who agree with them would argue that those attacks were because of what they perceived to be “insults to Islam.” Would those acts then be considered justified under the doctrine of jihad?

Again, any Muslim posters care to respond?

 

[BelFarfalla]

Here is the law of Jihad…

http://www.masud.co.uk/ISLAM/nuh/reliance.htm

O9.0 JIHAD

(O: Jihad means to war against non-Muslims and is etymologically derived from the word mujahada, signifying warfare to establish the religion. And it is the lesser jihad. As for the greater jihad, it is spiritual warfare against the lower self (nafs), which is why the Prophet (Allah bless him and give him peace) said as he was returning from jihad.

The scriptural basis for jihad, prior to scholarly consensus is such Koranic verses as:

(1) “Fighting is prescribed for you” (Koran 2:216)
(2) “Slay them wherever you find them” (Koran 4:89)
(3) “Fight the idolaters utterly” (Koran 9:36);

and such Hadiths as the one related by Bukhari and Muslim that the Prophet (Allah bless him and give him peace) said:

“I have been commanded to fight people until they testify that there is no god but Allah and Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, and perform the prayer, and pay zakat . If they say it, they have saved their blood and possessions from me, except from the rights of Islam over them. And their final reckoning is with Allah”;

and the hadith reported by Muslim,

“To go forth in the morning or evening to fight in the path of Allah is better than the whole world and everything in it.”

09.1 Jihad is a communal obligation.

O9.6 It is offensive to conduct a military expedition against hostile non-Mulims without the caliph’s permission. (A: Though if there I s no caliph, no permission is required).

WHO IS OBLIGATED TO FIGHT IN JIHAD

O9.4 Those called upon (o: to perform jihad when it is a communical obligation) are every able-bodied man who has reached puberty and is sane.

(continued below)

 

[BelFarfalla]

(continued from above)

“o9.8 The caliph makes war upon Jews, Christians, and Zoroastrians (N: Provided he has first invited them to enter Islam in faith and practice, and if they will not, then invited them to enter the social order of Islam by paying the non-Muslim poll tax (jizya) – which is the significance of their paying it, not the money itself- while remaining in their ancestral regions. (O: and the war continues) until they become Muslim or pay the non-Muslim poll tax. (O: in accordance with the word of Allah Most High,

“Fight those who do not believe in Allah and the Last Day and who forbid not what Allah and His messenger have forbidden-who do not practice the religion of truth, being of those who have been given the Book-until they pay the poll tax out hand and are humbled.” (Koran 9:29),

the time and place for which is before the final descent of Jesus (upon who m be peace). After his coming, nothing but Islam will be accepted from them, for taking the poll tax is only effective until Jesus’ decent (upon him and our Prophet be peace), which is the divinely revealed law of Muhammad. The coming of Jesus does not entail a separate divinely revealed law, for he will rule by the law of Muhammad. As for the Prophet’s saying (Allah bless him and give him peace)).

O9.9 the caliph fights all other peoples until they become Muslim (O: because they are not a people with a Book, nor honored as such, and are not permitted to settle with paying the poll tax (jizya)) (n: though according to the Hanafi school, people of all other religions, even idol worshipers, are permitted to live under the protection of the Islamic state if they either become Muslim or agree to pay the poll tax, the exceptions to which are apostates from Islam and idol worshipers who are Arabs, neither of whom has any choice but becoming Muslim.

O9.13 When a child or a woman is taken captive, they become salves by the fact of capture, and the woman’s previous marriage is immediately annulled.

 

[Ilocia]

O9.13 When a child or a woman is taken captive, they become salves by the fact of capture, and the woman’s previous marriage is immediately annulled.

wtf! what has the previous marriage anything to do with captivation?

 

[daniel_edge]

I embraced Islam 10 years ago. Now dissalusioned I’m seeking answers from the catholic church and I’m very interested in becoming a Catholic. This is why I post and often surf this site.
God bless. Daniel

 

[Ilocia]

I embraced Islam 10 years ago. Now dissalusioned I’m seeking answers from the catholic church and I’m very interested in becoming a Catholic. This is why I post and often surf this site.

                        God bless.             Daniel

What made you interested with Islam 10 years ago?

 

[dolphinlove]

I embraced Islam 10 years ago. Now dissalusioned I’m seeking answers from the catholic church and I’m very interested in becoming a Catholic. This is why I post and often surf this site.

                        God bless.             Daniel

God is defnantly leading you in the right direction Daniel.
I hope you enjoy and are fulfilled with the holy spirit the way all of us Catholics are.
God Bless you

 

[Antwill]

(continued from above)

“o9.8 The caliph makes war upon Jews, Christians, and Zoroastrians (N: Provided he has first invited them to enter Islam in faith and practice, and if they will not, then invited them to enter the social order of Islam by paying the non-Muslim poll tax (jizya) – which is the significance of their paying it, not the money itself- while remaining in their ancestral regions. (O: and the war continues) until they become Muslim or pay the non-Muslim poll tax. (O: in accordance with the word of Allah Most High,

“Fight those who do not believe in Allah and the Last Day and who forbid not what Allah and His messenger have forbidden-who do not practice the religion of truth, being of those who have been given the Book-until they pay the poll tax out hand and are humbled.” (Koran 9:29),

the time and place for which is before the final descent of Jesus (upon who m be peace). After his coming, nothing but Islam will be accepted from them, for taking the poll tax is only effective until Jesus’ decent (upon him and our Prophet be peace), which is the divinely revealed law of Muhammad. The coming of Jesus does not entail a separate divinely revealed law, for he will rule by the law of Muhammad. As for the Prophet’s saying (Allah bless him and give him peace)).

O9.9 the caliph fights all other peoples until they become Muslim (O: because they are not a people with a Book, nor honored as such, and are not permitted to settle with paying the poll tax (jizya)) (n: though according to the Hanafi school, people of all other religions, even idol worshipers, are permitted to live under the protection of the Islamic state if they either become Muslim or agree to pay the poll tax, the exceptions to which are apostates from Islam and idol worshipers who are Arabs, neither of whom has any choice but becoming Muslim.

O9.13 When a child or a woman is taken captive, they become salves by the fact of capture, and the woman’s previous marriage is immediately annulled.

Thanks for the info, but I was hoping to hear from an actual Muslim on this topic. Alas, I don’t think that is going to happen. Sad.

 

[daniel_edge]

In answer to IIoca and Dolphin Love (Maybe I should of thought of a better name )

I came to Islam through my quest for the truth. What appealed to me the most was the simplicity and the monotheism and that the muslims believed in all the prophets sent by God. It also seemed very peacefull too. There were many reasons.

Since then my faith has been shaken a bit and I have found myself reading books that I only read when I was studying theology at university. Whats good this time is that I’m not reading them from the point of view of a student but of someone seeking for the truth about Jesus. I’ve told my self that if I can provr to myself that Jesus died on the cross for our sins then I would have no choice but to embrace Catholicism ( being the true universal church and the ‘Rock’ )
Whats really odd is that it took me to move myself and my family to Saudi Arabia for me to realize the things really laking in Islam.

What I find really beautiful about the message of Christ is that message of love. At the moment I’m reading about Jesus and I find myself feeling happier and more loving by the moment.

I pray God is leading me to the right path, though Iam very worried that I’m leading myself and my family astray.

On returning from Saudi my Mother who is a member of the church of England said to me ‘If you become Catholic I will join you’. amazing.

Sorry I dont have more time. Gos willing I will write again soon.
Daniel