Why So Much Stuff To Become Catholic?

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I have a friend who was brought up Catholic and attends mass with his family but since being “born again” and accepting Christ as his Savior in college (40 years ago) has issue with the Catholic faith. One of his “problems” is why do you need to go through RCIA to become Catholic? To him all that is necessary is to tell the person “the good news of Jesus Christ”, have him accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, say the “sinner’s paryer” and you are good to go. To be honest I do not think any answer would convince him. I don’t know if this is the right way to state it but his princples of faith are quite simple: accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, humble yourself before him, submit to his will and read the Bible to find that will. NO MORE, NO LESS! His excuse is that he is too stupid (this from a guy who is an college graduate and engineer) to understand anything deeper and God wants it to be simple.

Any (name removed by moderator)ut?
 
Because accepting Jesus as your savior means you proceed with every word that comes out of the mouth of God (Mt 4:4), not just some bumper sticker concept in your mind. So a person should understand that which he is accepting prior to giving his assent. If the person believes Jesus is God but then rejects the Church Christ established when it teaches, say, Purgatory, then the person cannot be said to be properly submitting himself to Christ.
 
How does he know that God wants it to be simple? Where is this written?

The Bible itself is a very complex book, written over the period from Moses to St. John the Evangelist, in a wide variety of literary styles. Most of what is written in the Old Testament came down for many generations in the form of oral tradition - songs, drama, poetry, various liturgies, and memorized lists.

Further, the living out of the Christian life is not a simple thing. I am sure that he would agree that someone who claims to have accepted Christ as his saviour, but shows no evidence of it in his lifestyle, is likely to be deceiving himself. But the habits of a lifetime are difficult to break. If a person is used to sleeping in and then doing housework on Sundays, it takes a few weeks to develop the habit of Church attendance. If a couple is living together without the benefit of marriage, arrangements need to be made to repair that situation, one way or another.

RCIA provides the necessary time to develop the understanding about why change is necessary, and to make these lifestyle adjustments. It also provides sufficient time for the person to learn what all is involved, and for the person to reflect on whether he or she is really interested in taking up the Christian lifestyle.

By not rushing people into the Church, they have time to reflect and consider whether this lifetime commitment to Christ is something they are really able to take on, day in and day out for the rest of their lives.

But how many of those who get accosted on the street by an evangelist and agree to sign a Four Spiritual Laws card, show up in Church the next Sunday, and every Sunday thereafter for the rest of their lives? How many of them actually stop living in sin, and take up the lifestyle of a Christian?
 
The_Wizard said:
I have a friend who was brought up Catholic and attends mass with his family but since being “born again” and accepting Christ as his Savior in college (40 years ago) has issue with the Catholic faith. One of his “problems” is why do you need to go through RCIA to become Catholic? To him all that is necessary is to tell the person “the good news of Jesus Christ”, have him accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, say the “sinner’s paryer” and you are good to go. To be honest I do not think any answer would convince him. I don’t know if this is the right way to state it but his princples of faith are quite simple: accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, humble yourself before him, submit to his will and read the Bible to find that will. NO MORE, NO LESS! His excuse is that he is too stupid (this from a guy who is an college graduate and engineer) to understand anything deeper and God wants it to be simple.

Any (name removed by moderator)ut?
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Yes it is simple…the must intellectually challenged can enter into Christ via baptism etc and live the Faith.

Te RCIA is not absolutely necessary…but it does point back to how how the Early Church started doing things in the first few centuries …after the initial period of conversions (when such was not yet in place). Often it was a much longer process back then…even around 3 years from the initial evangelization to Baptism…
 
There’s a lot of instruction in RCIA because it’s a big commitment to make.

My Mom was Protestant, considered becoming Catholic, said there were “too many rules.” I have on occasion wondered has the Catholic Church become like the OT Pharisees? But I don’t think so. Rules and explanations do have their place in clarifying uncertain situations. And we do have the guidance of the NT on how to follow the law but also have the loving intention in our hearts along with it. Then we have the completeness:)
 
Here’s another way of thinking about the many doctrines and dogmas and practices of Catholicism:

**A Church that is over two-thousand years old has had a very, very long time to develop practices and rituals which carry on the traditions of the Apostles.

I appreciate the spirit of many Protestant brethren who vocally accept Christ. But talk is cheap. Catholicism calls us not only on our pledge to the Lord to imitate Him not only by word but by demonstration in how we act, every single day of our lives, despite a baptism or “being accepted”. (Christ specially warns us about this behavior in the famous “Lord, Lord” verses in Matthew 7:21.)
 
There is more to following Christ than just “accepting Him as your savior”.

Its like saying, how does one become an American? Is it as simple as an immigrant coming in, stay for some years, file for naturalization, take the test, take the oath, boom, you’re an American. But many miss the other parts of being an American, like contributing to society, paying your taxes, etc. Being baptized and professing the faith is just the beginning of being a Christian. Catholics realize that.
 
He may never “get it”. The Reformation redesigned and reengineered the Sacraments. “Take this and eat it, this is my Body” is a symbol or remembrance within denominations. The Bible alone holds importance over the instruction of the Bishops (which most denominations don’t recognize as being valid) once saved always saved, saved by faith alone, saved by grace alone, etc.

Whereas, for Catholics, the Eucharist is center to our worship. The Mass is oriented to the Eucharist. Our Sacraments of Baptism, Confirmation, Holy Orders, Last Rites, Marriage and Reconciliation all anchor to the receiving of the Body and Blood of Christ.

When we receive Christ, we are in communion as a Church body.

A person becoming Catholic should know and believe that they are being received into the Church that Christ instituted with the Apostles.

We believe in Sacred Scripture, Sacred Tradition and the Magisterium.
 
It sounds like someone’s just making an excuse. People think it’s OK to work hard and to put in a lot of time and effort into everything else (jobs, school, family, etc) but our relationship with God. This is laziness. They justify it by saying “God wants it to be simple.” Following Christ is tough- and it will be until the end. If it isn’t, you’re doing something wrong- because the world’s ways are opposed to God.
 
The_Wizard said:
I have a friend who was brought up Catholic and attends mass with his family but since being “born again” and accepting Christ as his Savior in college (40 years ago) has issue with the Catholic faith. One of his “problems” is why do you need to go through RCIA to become Catholic? To him all that is necessary is to tell the person “the good news of Jesus Christ”, have him accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, say the “sinner’s paryer” and you are good to go. To be honest I do not think any answer would convince him. I don’t know if this is the right way to state it but his princples of faith are quite simple: accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, humble yourself before him, submit to his will and read the Bible to find that will. NO MORE, NO LESS! His excuse is that he is too stupid (this from a guy who is an college graduate and engineer) to understand anything deeper and God wants it to be simple.

Any (name removed by moderator)ut?
Click to expand...
Ha ha! Ask him to read the section of the Old Testament on construction of the temple, Arc, and Tabernacle… Then ask him if God doesn’t appear to go into the details and the nuances Himself.

Point out that everything in the New Covenant is the fulfillment and perfection of the old covenant. There is no instruction in the old covenant that does not have a direct and perfected fulfillment in the new. (example: Jesus unbroken body as the unbroken body of the lamb, Mary’s womb as tabernacle, her body as temple, the door in jerusalem where only the king could enter israel is fullfilled by Mary’s virginity).

Since the new covenant contains the perfected and fulfilled aspects of the old covenant in entirity, why would he expect the new covenant to be ludicrously simple by comparison?

That’s what makes Catholicism so rich: for those who want simple faith, they can have it by going through RCIA and then devoutly going to mass, praying, reading their scriptures, and living according to the faith of the Church.

But what if a person wants more? I do. If the faith was really as shallow as he makes it out to be, I’d condemn such a god as a mere simpleton unworthy of worship and put on the atheist hat. Instead, Catholicism offers what his belief does not: RICH, theological, sensible, nuanced, mysterious depth.

In other word, God, through His church, offers it ALL to us: the simple, the beautiful, the deep, the technical. It truly is a church which is made for EVERYONE.
 
The_Wizard said:
I have a friend who was brought up Catholic and attends mass with his family but since being “born again” and accepting Christ as his Savior in college (40 years ago) has issue with the Catholic faith. One of his “problems” is why do you need to go through RCIA to become Catholic? To him all that is necessary is to tell the person “the good news of Jesus Christ”, have him accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, say the “sinner’s paryer” and you are good to go. To be honest I do not think any answer would convince him. I don’t know if this is the right way to state it but his princples of faith are quite simple: accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, humble yourself before him, submit to his will and read the Bible to find that will. NO MORE, NO LESS! His excuse is that he is too stupid (this from a guy who is an college graduate and engineer) to understand anything deeper and God wants it to be simple.

Any (name removed by moderator)ut?
Click to expand...
Honestly why so much to become Protestant. They have different denominations and have stricter laws than us Catholics. I accepted Jesus and my Lord and Savior at Baptism and have continually professed that all my life. I read scripture, attend mass, do the LOTH, prayer group, other spiritual reading such as encyclicals and readings of the Saints like Padre Pio. Why?? Because I have to??? No, because I want to. I want to grow in my faith/
 
The_Wizard said:
I have a friend who was brought up Catholic and attends mass with his family but since being “born again” and accepting Christ as his Savior in college (40 years ago) has issue with the Catholic faith. One of his “problems” is why do you need to go through RCIA to become Catholic? To him all that is necessary is to tell the person “the good news of Jesus Christ”, have him accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, say the “sinner’s paryer” and you are good to go. To be honest I do not think any answer would convince him. I don’t know if this is the right way to state it but his princples of faith are quite simple: accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, humble yourself before him, submit to his will and read the Bible to find that will. NO MORE, NO LESS! His excuse is that he is too stupid (this from a guy who is an college graduate and engineer) to understand anything deeper and God wants it to be simple.

Any (name removed by moderator)ut?
Click to expand...
🙂 You betcha…Who REALLY Preaches “A Different Gospel”?

You might point out to him that unlike his system, the Catholic Church follows the very clear mandate from Our Lord Himself in Matthew 28, where it says. “[18] And Jesus coming, spoke to them, saying: All power is given to me in heaven and in earth. [19] Going therefore, teach ye all nations; baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. [20] Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and behold I am with you all days, even to the consummation of the world.”

Not only do we call people to Christ, but we proceed to teach them just as Our Lord commanded. The fact is that the whole idea of “the simplicity of the gospel” is an unscriptural fabrication of modern men. (Make him show that phrase in the New Testament. He can’t because it doesn’t exist. :D)
 
Church_Militant said:
🙂 You betcha…Who REALLY Preaches “A Different Gospel”?

You might point out to him that unlike his system, the Catholic Church follows the very clear mandate from Our Lord Himself in Matthew 28, where it says. “[18] And Jesus coming, spoke to them, saying: All power is given to me in heaven and in earth. [19] Going therefore, teach ye all nations; baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. [20] Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and behold I am with you all days, even to the consummation of the world.”

Not only do we call people to Christ, but we proceed to teach them just as Our Lord commanded. The fact is that the whole idea of “the simplicity of the gospel” is an unscriptural fabrication of modern men. (Make him show that phrase in the New Testament. He can’t because it doesn’t exist. :D)
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good point. I too have always wandered that. I couldn’t agree with you any better
 
m134e5 said:
It sounds like someone’s just making an excuse. People think it’s OK to work hard and to put in a lot of time and effort into everything else (jobs, school, family, etc) but our relationship with God. This is laziness. They justify it by saying “God wants it to be simple.” Following Christ is tough- and it will be until the end. If it isn’t, you’re doing something wrong- because the world’s ways are opposed to God.
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Very well put. And I wonder if it isn’t one of the devil’s easiest ways to get at all of us. Because I find myself making the same lame excuses “I don’t have time to pray right now, I will in a little while” - well, before I know it the day’s half over or further and it doesn’t get done.😦 I am recognizing this and working to do better. But it’s amazing how the devil can make prayer seem complicated, or tiring, or just difficult to get started on. There’s never been a time when I regretted praying.:nope: But many times when I have regretted not praying! :sad_yes:
 
It’s NOT really THAT complicated.

NOT really THAT much stuff.

And thou shalt love the Lord thy God, with thy whole heart, and with thy whole soul, and with thy whole mind, and with thy whole strength. This is the first commandment.

bible.cc/mark/12-30.htm

And that’s not just for Catholics … it is for everyone.

God comes first.

Jesus was here 2000 years ago.

Since that time, a LOT has happened.

We don’t have to read all of the Church Fathers and the Doctors of the Church or the lives of the saints. But a LOT has happened over the past 2000 years and it is useful and helpful to us.

I read this book the other day.

dynamiccatholic.com/index…ge=confessions

He really talks a lot about his conversion from being a Methodist minister to being an ordinary Catholic layperson.

He talks a lot about the challenge of John 6 … verses 20 to 70 or so.

And he talks a lot about the “communion of saints” … how we don’t adore or worship the saints, but how we should not ignore them either.

How Catholic worship does not revolve around the ability of the priest to write a great sermon, but how it focuses around the Consecration.

Excellent read. Easy to follow.

He suggests looking at Dali’s “Last Supper”

And reading Kreeft’s “Jesus Shock”.

And reading Joan Carroll Cruz’s fabulous book, " The Incorruptables".
 
The_Wizard said:
I have a friend who was brought up Catholic and attends mass with his family but since being “born again” and accepting Christ as his Savior in college (40 years ago) has issue with the Catholic faith. One of his “problems” is why do you need to go through RCIA to become Catholic? To him all that is necessary is to tell the person “the good news of Jesus Christ”, have him accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, say the “sinner’s paryer” and you are good to go. To be honest I do not think any answer would convince him. I don’t know if this is the right way to state it but his princples of faith are quite simple: accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, humble yourself before him, submit to his will and read the Bible to find that will. NO MORE, NO LESS! His excuse is that he is too stupid (this from a guy who is an college graduate and engineer) to understand anything deeper and God wants it to be simple.

Any (name removed by moderator)ut?
Click to expand...
Catholic doctrine is difficult for one who isn’t a ‘cradle Catholic.’
Even then I have found that many Catholics do not have a very good understanding of what their church teaches.
Buy a Catholic Catechism, that will help along with RCIA class.

bluelake

Read Jn.14:1-4 "In my Fathers House are many mansions…’
 
MarcoPolo said:
Because accepting Jesus as your savior means you proceed with every word that comes out of the mouth of God (Mt 4:4), not just some bumper sticker concept in your mind. So a person should understand that which he is accepting prior to giving his assent. If the person believes Jesus is God but then rejects the Church Christ established when it teaches, say, Purgatory, then the person cannot be said to be properly submitting himself to Christ.
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marco,
Be careful when judging anothers persons walk with the Lord.
See Mt.7:1-5

God bless,
bluelake
 
bluelake said:
marco,
Be careful when judging anothers persons walk with the Lord.
See Mt.7:1-5

God bless,
bluelake
Click to expand...
Would you please point out the judgemental part in the other’s post. I saw no condemnation of anyone. All I saw was a clear explanation of the conditions that may lead to condemnation.
 
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