Why the big fuss over homosexuality?

[thirsty4uolord]

Teenage Thinker
Bless you
You can end your self esteem sufferring this very instant by asking God to take away all your desires for sin .If you believe in the LORD CHRIST he will answer your prayer and you can change this very moment, but you must believe he loves you ,has died for all your sins past present and future ,and become entirely willing to do so ,this can end right now , if you will let it . Self seeking will slip away. Trust in him he will never fail you. A parable for you " you either are or you are not, you exist or you do not, there is and there is not, positive or negative, neutron or proton,since you can not give birth why be a woman ? connect a bolt to a bolt, win or lose surrender to him and you shall win ."

Justifacation is the first sign of doing something you know is wrong.

I will pray for you

 

[Traditional_Ang]

thirsty4uolord:

Teenage Thinker
Bless you
You can end your self esteem sufferring this very instant by asking God to take away all your desires for sin .If you believe in the LORD CHRIST he will answer your prayer and you can change this very moment, but you must believe he loves you ,has died for all your sins past present and future ,and become entirely willing to do so ,this can end right now , if you will let it . Self seeking will slip away. Trust in him he will never fail you. A parable for you " you either are or you are not, you exist or you do not, there is and there is not, positive or negative, neutron or proton,since you can not give birth why be a woman ? connect a bolt to a bolt, win or lose surrender to him and you shall win ."

Justifacation is the first sign of doing something you know is wrong.

I will pray for you

Thirsty:

It’s not as easy as you make it sound, but that’s at least 3 requests for him to “Teenage” to come out of the cold.

Let’s hope that he listened and got the message.

Blessings.

In Christ, Michael

 

[Lisa_N]

Riley259:

Werner,

I appreciate your candor in this post. I have several friends who are openly gay. I respect them and admire them for many of their qualities as a human being. However, I also have looked at the issue of homosexuality in detail and feel very strongly that the Church is correct regarding their position. To be homosexual is not inherently sinful and yes, people with same-sex attractions in the majority of cases do not choose their sexual orientation. But most of the evidence (religious issues aside) points very strongly to homosexuality being the result of a constellation of environmental issues often including a psycho-sexual disorder very early in life - there is simply no credible evidence that it is biologically determined (see works of Joseph Nicolosi and Richard Fitzgibbons for a wealth of empirical studies on this issue). Homosexuality is a disorder and it is possible to live chastely - we don’t have to obey sexual urges! Please don’t define yourself by your sexual orientation - too many gay individuals do this (my friends included). You are so much more than that. You are a human being who God loves - you are made in His image and as a result have incomparable dignity. Your Catholic faith is not worth throwing away or dissenting from because you can’t help giving in to same-sex urges. I’d also recommend visiting the Courage website and reading some material by Fr. John Harvey and David Armstrong (a gay man who wrote the wonderful book, “Beyond Gay”). To be a faithful Catholic these days means being counter-cultural and sometimes politically incorrect. Pray hard and be strong but faithful to the Church’s teachings - it won’t be easy but it will definitely be worth it. God Bless.

Your post is so on point that it’s hard to clip and respond to the various comments. I agree homosexuality is not a ‘choice.’ I assume my father didn’t CHOOSE to become an alcoholic. My nephew didn’t CHOOSE to become a meth addict. To use that word infers it’s like picking the tiramisu from a dessert tray full of goodies. In reality we don’t CHOOSE any of our feelings. We only choose our response to them. Everyday we are faced with various choices based on non-chosen feelings. How we respond to them is the difference between living life based on pleasure or principle.

Say I’m in traffic and some nut cuts me off, slams on his brakes and nearly causes an accident. I don’t CHOOSE that feeling of fear and anger. I do choose what I do next. Maybe I’d get some kind of temporary kick out of doing the same to him. But again, it’s the action that is chosen, not the feeling.

Unfortunately our society has elevated feelings to a religion of sorts. As Michael asked, “who is your God?” Is it your genitalia? Your urges? Your desires? All of us face feelings that may inspire actions with long term negative consequences. Right now homosexuality is given a ‘pass’ and people are running around trying to “affirm” this choice under some kind of misguided idea this is compassionate. In the long run though, it is anything but compassionate.

Lisa N

 

[thirsty4uolord]

Hello Michael Bless You

I understand how you feel about the not easy part. I Know however in my heart the truth is as easy has it gets, it’s the believing part that manefest the results of prayer , a willingness (entirely) to let go and let God, and cling with strength to his word, for what things are not easy for God ? and do we, has Christians, acting in faith deserve to expect our prayers answered? Did not Christ say you could move mountains? I must confess I ,at times, many over felt that my problems where special , and no one understood about me . In the end however I learned that lack of faith and feeling worthy (“thru my prayers and faith in Christ for he alone makes me worthy”) was always the problem. When I eliminate those two It has always worked for me .I really can not relate to the gender problem , but I will continue to pray for tolerance of others and the well being of all peoples.
Thanks for your comment it has made me think . :tiphat:
Traditional Ang:

Thirsty:

It’s not as easy as you make it sound, but that’s at least 3 requests for him to “Teenage” to come out of the cold.

Let’s hope that he listened and got the message.

Blessings.

In Christ, Michael

 

[thirsty4uolord]

Werner
Bless You and Peace be with You

I have a question for you ,not to offend but rather so I can better understand.
If a homosexual was to be confronted by Jesus , would he say “Oh Lord you can not heal me for my problem is to great” . or would he say “Heal me Lord for I wish to be Christlike” ,or would he say nothing and stay the way he is?
For in your answer, lies the solution to the problem with living in sin or not .
I pray your answer is to be healed and if not I will pray for better understanding. God Bless

Werner:

Thank you very much Luke for your post.
Even though my conclusion is a different one than yours i loved reading it.

I’m not made for chastity, and i live together with my partner since 17 years now. We literally had all those good times and bad times will be together until death may part us.

Just two things i’d like to clarify:
You say “I’m sure you see that just because something else may be a greater sin, that doesn’t make homosexual acts less of a sin than they are.”
That wasn’t my point. I don’t know if practised HS is a sin, but i know that for most people it is, and i don’t want to qualify it, everybody has to ask his own conscience about it.

What annoys me though is that many people have such a big zeal in condemning especially this sin. They get upset when they see two men kissing each others but don’t see the homeless man standing next to them. That was my point.

The second thing is:
You say “That can’t be the only thing you think the Church is wrong about.”
You are right, there are other things i don’t like, but none of these is as essential and radical as this one. Let me give you some examples:

• i don’t really understand the reason why women cannot be priests, but the Pope decided they can’t, so be it.
• i don’t understand why using a condom is a sin because it “hinders new life” while tricking nature by having sex only when a pregnancy is not possible is ok, but so be it.

There are some other points but not one of them is as grave as HS, where the church demands from me to stay alone for my whole life, never able to be together with the one i love.

A priest, a nun or a monk does it voluntarily, and the Lord himself said that only some are capable to do so. I have no decission according to the church.

And most of those who are fast with condemning homosexuals have never even thought about what that means.

So to come back to you initial question, yes this is the only topic i really think the church commits a grave error.

But i don’t expect to find many believers who share that thought…

OK, enough for now, i’d like to share more thoughts with you and to hear more of yours.

best regards,
Werner

 

[terrcatholic]

I agree with that question. Is it not the purpose of marriage, as per Church teachings, and in scripture is to populate heaven, and marriage as defined is per a man and a woman. All societies that homosexuality became rampant, from the Greeks to the Romans were eventually destroyed and corrupted from within.

Notwithstanding, I truly believe that homosexuals are born that way, which is not what the church teaches and I dont want any trouble, but I can recall growing up at the age of 6 or 7 and some of the kids in school that seemed “odd” back then in the neighborhood, eventually turned out to be Gay.

What bothers me is that the church is so into being politically correct about everything now, and that does not work in todays world. Jesus was not PC, he saw sin and he blasted it, he saw abuse in the temples and he turned those tables over, he called it like it is. Unfortuantely, even our Pope says little, and is more into appeasing the other faiths and denominations than tending to the flock, and the wolves are hungry and they are picking off the sheep one by one by one…

thirsty4uolord:

Werner
Bless You and Peace be with You

I have a question for you ,not to offend but rather so I can better understand.
If a homosexual was to be confronted by Jesus , would he say “Oh Lord you can not heal me for my problem is to great” . or would he say “Heal me Lord for I wish to be Christlike” ,or would he say nothing and stay the way he is?
For in your answer, lies the solution to the problem with living in sin or not .
I pray your answer is to be healed and if not I will pray for better understanding. God Bless

 

[terrcatholic]

From and article which is quite clear backed up by scripture:

Contraceptive sex is no different than the sin of sodomy because both unquestionably deny the sacrament of marriage by intentionally closing the sexual act to procreation and therefore are empty and can never unify those who engage in them. Just about every imaginable sexual activity is mentioned in the Bible, and the only form that is pleasing to God is uncorrupted conjugal love. As for a vasectomy, Deuteronomy 23:1 says, “No one who is emasculated, or has his male organ cut off, shall enter the assembly of the Lord.” Contraception is condemned in Genesis 38:8-10 where God took the the life of Onan because he spilled his seamen rather than produce children. The New Testament also condemns contraception in Romans 1:24-26 “Wherefore God gave them up to the desires of their heart, unto uncleanness, to dishonor their own bodies among themselves. Who changed the truth of God into a lie; and worshipped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. For this cause God delivered them up to shameful affections. For their women have changed the natural use into that use which is against nature.” Christians do not conform themselves to the world but are transformed. Intentional sterility is an affront before the Lord. God despises any sexual act that deliberately departs from the possibility of new life in its design.

 

[theTaxCollector]

Lisa N:

Your post is so on point that it’s hard to clip and respond to the various comments. I agree homosexuality is not a ‘choice.’ I assume my father didn’t CHOOSE to become an alcoholic. My nephew didn’t CHOOSE to become a meth addict. To use that word infers it’s like picking the tiramisu from a dessert tray full of goodies. In reality we don’t CHOOSE any of our feelings. We only choose our response to them. Everyday we are faced with various choices based on non-chosen feelings. How we respond to them is the difference between living life based on pleasure or principle.

Lisa -

While I understand your comments, there is a line of thinking that believes that the sexual identification process starts around 3 years old. As the child begins to understand differences between Mom & Dad, he begins to ‘choose’ to emulate one or the other.

This is not the same as an adult who one day ‘chooses’ to have relations with members of the same sex. Instead, as with many developmental aspects of human beings, it is a series of choices and affirmations that eventually solidify into the person’s “core entity”. This seems very plausible to me.

However, I am certainly no expert.

 

[Lisa_N]

theTaxCollector:

Lisa -

While I understand your comments, there is a line of thinking that believes that the sexual identification process starts around 3 years old. As the child begins to understand differences between Mom & Dad, he begins to ‘choose’ to emulate one or the other.

This is not the same as an adult who one day ‘chooses’ to have relations with members of the same sex. Instead, as with many developmental aspects of human beings, it is a series of choices and affirmations that eventually solidify into the person’s “core entity”. This seems very plausible to me.

However, I am certainly no expert.

Hmmm Tax, I’m trying to understand what you mean. I remember being a very small child (3 or 4) and clearly understood that boys were different than girls. But it was based on clothes and haircuts and what toys we got for our birthday, not on an understanding of biology. I didn’t understand sex at all or sex roles. I knew boys had different plumbing but again, I thought it was simply for elimination, not procreation.

My mother was anything but domestic, hated all things female and I certainly didn’t learn feminine wiles from her. I was a very energetic, athletic, wild little kid who preferred playing with boys because girls just sat around and played with dolls. Boys did cool stuff like climbing trees and swinging REALLY high in the swings. I was known as a ‘tomboy’ but again it really had nothing to do with sexuality. I never had the SLIGHTEST sexual response to anything female though. The whole thought of same sex relationships frankly is repulsive to me.

Now from my homosexual friends, I understand that they recognized a same sex attraction about puberty. I don’t know if they identified with their mothers PRIOR to that point or whether they were different in mannerisms early on. I do recall what was called a ‘sissy boy’ when I was a kid but neither sissies or tomboys were identified as homosexual at a young age. I fear that the apparent obsession with the identification of homosexuals from early on will typecast kids who are simply not following along with societally appointed interests (dolls for girls, trucks for boys).

I guess my point is that we don’t choose our feelings or urges, we do choose our response to them. By blaming someone’s addiction or homosexuality on some kind of genetic or hardwired make up, it gives them leeway to excuse the behavior that results.

Lisa (probably confusing the issue totally)

 

[theTaxCollector]

Lisa N:

I guess my point is that we don’t choose our feelings or urges, we do choose our response to them. By blaming someone’s addiction or homosexuality on some kind of genetic or hardwired make up, it gives them leeway to excuse the behavior that results.

Lisa -

Your quote about being ‘hardwired’ is my point. As far as I know there is no proof that homosexuality is genetically or biologically predestined. Instead, I tend to believe that events that occur in a young person’s life influence the child’s general leanings.

As I said I am no expert, but I believe many homosexuals had an inappropriate sexual experience when they were young. In addition, gender confusing situations during the impressionable childhood years probably factor into the mix (or mixup, if you will).

Again, I’m certain there is no simple formula. I am generalizing to an extent. You being a tomboy (or young boys being sissies) of course could not indicate what your sexual orientation would be. But the fact that you grew with a fairly clear understanding of what mommies are supposed to do and daddies are supposed to do laid the groundwork for understanding the complex nature of human male-female relationships. Simply out, as you got older the pieces just fell into place naturally for you.

Children that grow up without that basic example of man and woman working together are at a competitive disadvantage when it comes to growing into adult sexual relationships. My guess is that puberty is the exact time that their identities solidify precisely because of its sexual nature. By that time, however, no one would remember all of the events in their lifetime that led them to be what they are.

One last comment before I sign off, playing with dolls or trucks does not necessarily indicate sexual orientation. After all , sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. Kids try out a lot of things. But reinforcement of the behavior by a parent will influence a child’s actions. My sons both played with dolls at one time or another. I neither encouraged nor discouraged. However, if my wife had spent a lot of time playing dolls with them, I believe a certain cloudiness would set in, especially if I weren’t so involved with them in other ways.

I feel like I’m rambling here. I hope I’ve made some sense.

 

[Lisa_N]

theTaxCollector:

Lisa -

Your quote about being ‘hardwired’ is my point. As far as I know there is no proof that homosexuality is genetically or biologically predestined. Instead, I tend to believe that events that occur in a young person’s life influence the child’s general leanings.

As I said I am no expert, but I believe many homosexuals had an inappropriate sexual experience when they were young. In addition, gender confusing situations during the impressionable childhood years probably factor into the mix (or mixup, if you will).

Children that grow up without that basic example of man and woman working together are at a competitive disadvantage when it comes to growing into adult sexual relationships. My guess is that puberty is the exact time that their identities solidify precisely because of its sexual nature. By that time, however, no one would remember all of the events in their lifetime that led them to be what they are.

I feel like I’m rambling here. I hope I’ve made some sense.

Tax, thank you for the clarification. I hope I didn’t make it sound like I thought homosexuality, drug addiction or alcoholism were genetic or hardwired. I absolutely do not think that someone is born homosexual or a drug addict waiting for a fix.

I think that some mental afflictions (is that the right word?) do run in families. My father was an alcoholic and his family was full of alcoholics. OTOH it also might result from observation of behaviors and access rather than genetics. IOW someone with my father’s genetic makeup might never have become an alcoholic had he been born into a Mormon family in Salt Lake City. Thus he’d have no deviant behavior to observe and no access to alcohol. Just as an example, the strongest prediction of whether a child will become a smoker is whether his parents were smokers. Do I think people are born smokers? No, but it’s a lot easier to start if you watch your parents AND have access to cigarettes.

As to what leads to homosexuality, I found the video “It’s Not Gay” very informative because it pretty much backed up the anecdotal information I’ve picked up along the way. The basic theory is that a confused and perhaps vulnerable young person is usually seduced into ‘the life’ by an older and more ingrained homosexual. He is attracted by the attention, the seeming glamour, the availability of “no consequences” anonymous sexual encounters. Once you get into ‘the life’ it’s hard to get out. I have seen more than one predatory homosexual focus on a younger man and seduce him into the homosexual world. But like other ingrained desires and urges, once you taste the forbidden fruit, it’s hard to get away.

That’s why I am so disturbed by the seeming desire to “affirm” a confused adolescent who may wonder if he is homosexual. I don’t think kids are needing to know about this sort of thing until they are mature and ready. I think back to my own growing up and we did have one young man who was quite effete and somewhat ostracized by other males at the time. We didn’t know about homosexuality in those days at that age (high school) so Bill was just Bill. A bit wierd but a nice guy. IOW it really wasn’t necessary to categorize and brand him as a homosexual at age l6.

I truly think the homosexual activists WANT young people to self identify early on. Not only is it “more for our team” but it affirms the life that the older homosexual has invested in.

Lisa N (really rambling as well.)

 

[Traditional_Ang]

thirsty4uolord:

Hello Michael Bless You

I understand how you feel about the not easy part. I Know however in my heart the truth is as easy has it gets, it’s the believing part that manefest the results of prayer , a willingness (entirely) to let go and let God, and cling with strength to his word, for what things are not easy for God ? and do we, has Christians, acting in faith deserve to expect our prayers answered? Did not Christ say you could move mountains? I must confess I ,at times, many over felt that my problems where special , and no one understood about me . In the end however I learned that lack of faith and feeling worthy (“thru my prayers and faith in Christ for he alone makes me worthy”) was always the problem. When I eliminate those two It has always worked for me .I really can not relate to the gender problem , but I will continue to pray for tolerance of others and the well being of all peoples.
Thanks for your comment it has made me think . :tiphat:

Thirsty,

You might be confusing SIMPLE and EASY. They might seem like they’re alike, but they’re not. In fact, there are times nothing could be further from the truth.

Right at the beginning of my “Sojourn” away from the Church, I joined a Christian Commune (Protestant-NO Outside Authority). While I was there. I did most of the physical labor of building a basement UNDER a 2 story building that had ALREADY BEEN BUILT!

The first thing we had to do was dig a pit WITHOUT ANY OF THE EQUIPMENT we’d usually use. So, this was pretty much a pick, shovel and wheelbarrel operation, esp. after I finished off the clutch of a compact truck we were using to haul out the dirt.

Now, that was surprisingly simple, but don’t anybody tell you that wasn’t HARD!

I won’t go into the details of setting up a temporary foundation in place of part we had to take out, or of pouring the concrete slab, or of laying the concrete retaining wall and the new foundation (remember, with a 2 story building over our heads)!

All I can tell you is that most of this was fairly simple, but that almost NONE of it was easy!

Do you get the difference??

Gays, or anyone with really STRONG urges to SIN is going to need a lot of prayer and fasting. Either that, or God is going to need to supply Grace by the Truckloads.

Blessings.

In Him, Michael

 

[Traditional_Ang]

Lisa N:

Hmmm Tax, I’m trying to understand what you mean. I remember being a very small child (3 or 4) and clearly understood that boys were different than girls. But it was based on clothes and haircuts and what toys we got for our birthday, not on an understanding of biology. I didn’t understand sex at all or sex roles. I knew boys had different plumbing but again, I thought it was simply for elimination, not procreation.

My mother was anything but domestic, hated all things female and I certainly didn’t learn feminine wiles from her. I was a very energetic, athletic, wild little kid who preferred playing with boys because girls just sat around and played with dolls. Boys did cool stuff like climbing trees and swinging REALLY high in the swings. I was known as a ‘tomboy’ but again it really had nothing to do with sexuality. I never had the SLIGHTEST sexual response to anything female though. The whole thought of same sex relationships frankly is repulsive to me.

Now from my homosexual friends, I understand that they recognized a same sex attraction about puberty. I don’t know if they identified with their mothers PRIOR to that point or whether they were different in mannerisms early on. I do recall what was called a ‘sissy boy’ when I was a kid but neither sissies or tomboys were identified as homosexual at a young age. I fear that the apparent obsession with the identification of homosexuals from early on will typecast kids who are simply not following along with societally appointed interests (dolls for girls, trucks for boys).

I guess my point is that we don’t choose our feelings or urges, we do choose our response to them. By blaming someone’s addiction or homosexuality on some kind of genetic or hardwired make up, it gives them leeway to excuse the behavior that results.

Lisa (probably confusing the issue totally)

Lisa;

Most of what you’e talking about is referred to as “Gender Identity” That means do we tend to act more masculine or Feminine, or which of those aspects of our personality do we tend ot express more and identify ourselves with more. Very few people are pure Masculine or Feminine. Men do Cry and Women aren’t totally helpless.

The Subject of this board has been “Object Choice” as in, are we attracted to and do we choose people of the opposite or of the same sex. Actually, more precisely, thee ropic of this Board has been that “Object Choice” in action, as in "With Whom do I have sex?

Thank God the Church’s teaching is clear on this, because if ti weren’t, we’d have a situation like what they’re having in some of the more liberal Protestant bodies right now, where Bible-Believing Christians are being told to shut up if they want to stay, or are simply being shown the door. That may be why some of us are upset with some of what seems to be waffling on the parts of some of the more liberal National Councils of CBiships and the Priests under them.

Blessings.

In Christ, Michael

 

[Lisa_N]

Traditional Ang:

Lisa;

The Subject of this board has been “Object Choice” as in, are we attracted to and do we choose people of the opposite or of the same sex. Actually, more precisely, thee ropic of this Board has been that “Object Choice” in action, as in "With Whom do I have sex?

Thank God the Church’s teaching is clear on this, because if ti weren’t, we’d have a situation like what they’re having in some of the more liberal Protestant bodies right now, where Bible-Believing Christians are being told to shut up if they want to stay, or are simply being shown the door. That may be why some of us are upset with some of what seems to be waffling on the parts of some of the more liberal National Councils of CBiships and the Priests under them.

Blessings.

In Christ, Michael

Good point. I think ‘love the sinner, hate the sin’ is the right approach and I am certainly glad to be in a church that follows this philosophy. I feel bad for my friends in the Episcopal church because they are going through some really rocky times.

It’s so odd that if you were to substitute virtually ANY other sin within the same context, no sane person would be talking about “affirming who you are.” Can you imagine a church saying “We welcome thieves and liars and adulterers and encourage them to be who they are by continuing to steal, lie and cheat on their spouses.” Yet more than a few churches and certainly homosexual activist groups have that philosophy regarding homosexuality.

As to the gender identification question, indeed, it is not determinative. I am sure most tomboys grow up and marry men while “sissies” may well outgrow their apparent lack of boyishness and go on to a normal life married to a woman.

So you are Anglican? Is that different than Episcopal? Other than geographical?

Lisa N

 

[theTaxCollector]

Lisa N:

It’s so odd that if you were to substitute virtually ANY other sin within the same context, no sane person would be talking about “affirming who you are.” Can you imagine a church saying “We welcome thieves and liars and adulterers and encourage them to be who they are by continuing to steal, lie and cheat on their spouses.” Yet more than a few churches and certainly homosexual activist groups have that philosophy regarding homosexuality.

Lisa -

I love the point that you make here. It speaks somewhat of the nature of evil and how it pretends to be good but really sows confusion.

 

[theTaxCollector]

Lisa N:

So you are Anglican? Is that different than Episcopal? Other than geographical?

By the way, your profile indicates that you are Protestant. Where do you fall?

 

[thirsty4uolord]

Michael

THANK YOU and BLESS YOU

Yes I think I get the Diff ,But I did say “ENTIRELY WILLING”,
CLING WITH STRENGHT TO HIS WORD", “LACK OF FAITH AND FEELING WORTHY” .
Simple and Easy
Faith, Faith, Faith.
Faith without works is dead.
Read St. Matthew 21 verse 21 and 22
Are we then to beleive our LORD is a Liar, or should have a closer look at our Faith and the motives of our Prayers ?
Traditional Ang:

Thirsty,

You might be confusing SIMPLE and EASY. They might seem like they’re alike, but they’re not. In fact, there are times nothing could be further from the truth.

Right at the beginning of my “Sojourn” away from the Church, I joined a Christian Commune (Protestant-NO Outside Authority). While I was there. I did most of the physical labor of building a basement UNDER a 2 story building that had ALREADY BEEN BUILT!

The first thing we had to do was dig a pit WITHOUT ANY OF THE EQUIPMENT we’d usually use. So, this was pretty much a pick, shovel and wheelbarrel operation, esp. after I finished off the clutch of a compact truck we were using to haul out the dirt.

Now, that was surprisingly simple, but don’t anybody tell you that wasn’t HARD!

I won’t go into the details of setting up a temporary foundation in place of part we had to take out, or of pouring the concrete slab, or of laying the concrete retaining wall and the new foundation (remember, with a 2 story building over our heads)!

All I can tell you is that most of this was fairly simple, but that almost NONE of it was easy!

Do you get the difference??

Gays, or anyone with really STRONG urges to SIN is going to need a lot of prayer and fasting. Either that, or God is going to need to supply Grace by the Truckloads.

Blessings.

In Him, Michael

 

[Lisa_N]

theTaxCollector:

By the way, your profile indicates that you are Protestant. Where do you fall?

Goodness, I didn’t realize it said that! I signed up when I was a Protestant. I am currently in RCIA and planning to enter the Catholic church at Easter. I started on this board hoping to learn more about Catholicism as I was planning to convert. I better figure out how to change the profile.

FWIW I was a Methodist who became totally disgusted by the moral relativism that has crept into the church—mostly regarding human life issues but they went through their own problems with homosexual ministers as well. Now you see 'em, now you don’t. It just didn’t make sense.

Sorry this is off topic!
Lisa N

 

[Riley259]

Lisa N:

As to what leads to homosexuality, I found the video “It’s Not Gay” very informative because it pretty much backed up the anecdotal information I’ve picked up along the way. The basic theory is that a confused and perhaps vulnerable young person is usually seduced into ‘the life’ by an older and more ingrained homosexual. He is attracted by the attention, the seeming glamour, the availability of “no consequences” anonymous sexual encounters. Once you get into ‘the life’ it’s hard to get out. I have seen more than one predatory homosexual focus on a younger man and seduce him into the homosexual world. But like other ingrained desires and urges, once you taste the forbidden fruit, it’s hard to get away.

That’s why I am so disturbed by the seeming desire to “affirm” a confused adolescent who may wonder if he is homosexual. I don’t think kids are needing to know about this sort of thing until they are mature and ready. I think back to my own growing up and we did have one young man who was quite effete and somewhat ostracized by other males at the time. We didn’t know about homosexuality in those days at that age (high school) so Bill was just Bill. A bit wierd but a nice guy. IOW it really wasn’t necessary to categorize and brand him as a homosexual at age l6.

I truly think the homosexual activists WANT young people to self identify early on. Not only is it “more for our team” but it affirms the life that the older homosexual has invested in.

Lisa N (really rambling as well.)

Lisa,

You make some excellent points here. I think that young teenagers are being “affirmed” into this lifestyle too casually and on a different thread there was even a discussion of a school exclusive to gay teenagers. In terms of the origins of homosexuality, I think there’s plenty of evidence to suggest that it is not biologically determined but unfortunately most of the public has “bought into” the well-worn and inaccurate findings from the early 1990’s (the Levay and Hamer studies) of a gay gene. All of these studies have been long discredited or found not replicable. Dr. Nicolosi talks about the psycho-sexual origins of homosexuality and he refers to something called the kitchen window syndrome. For example, boys who are uncoordinated or don’t fit in with their peers (for a variety of reasons including a poor same-sex role model) find themselves looking at their same-sex peers from the outside in (thus the kitchen window reference). They’re not able to bond properly with their same-sex peers and eventually those same-sex peers become the “other gender”, a process that normally happens with children during the latency stage with their opposite-sex peers. If left unchecked, during adolescence (when hormones and sexual urges begin to emerge)these same individuals begin to eroticize their feelings for the same-sex peers that they had admired and wished they had been more like during their formative years. The powerful behavioral conditioning that goes along with sexual feelings eventually takes over and eventually the individual has a full-fledged same-sex attraction. Of course, it doesn’t always happen like the scenerio I just described but the similarities among Nicolosi’s (and other therapists who specialize in this area) patients are astounding. Also, I would recommend the book “My genes made me do it!” by Neil and Briar Whitehead. Neil is a geneticist and clearly presents the case for homosexuality being non-genetically based. This leaves us with a conclusion that is the functional equivalent of the white elephant in the room: If the above-described factors can be identified and treated early enough in life then homosexuality can be largely prevented. I realize that this is a position that gay activists (or any other gay person who has made the decision to have sexual relations) would call outrageous and probably condemn as the zealot rantings of a homophobic, but the facts speak for themselves. As I stated in an earlier post, I admire and respect my gay friends and definitely do not “fear” them but I pray for them every day because their path is ultimately self-destructive.

 

[Lisa_N]

Riley your post was fascinating and in one place puts together much of the information I’ve read as well as my observations. Although on another thread “Ken” who later morphed into “Zoot” belittled my comments, I’ve encountered many homesexuals over the years and have a pretty good layman’s understanding of their world. Some I consider dear friends (some I knew before the coming out) and while I still adore them, I am heartbroken over their embracing of this world. Incidentally they fit the pattern to a “T” being somewhat outside the world of their peers and eventually being seduced into the homosexual world by an older, much admired male. They are continuously affirmed, petted and admired by others who have taken this step, thus affirming the decision to step over the line.

As you said, it is incredibly distressing that young, confused, lonely and highly hormonal teens are being pushed to declare themselves at a very early age. Having not even a basic understanding of homosexuality until well past high school, I am not sure what the hurry is. After all would anyone suggest to a teen “Well we see you as an alcoholic at age 30 so let’s get started now!”

I wish that the discussion could be less passionate and more rational. Homosexuals have become incredibly defensive and have been able to use our collective guilt over discrimination of other groups (females, people of color, people with mental or physical handicaps) to avoid any real challenge to the homosexual life.

Lisa N