Why weren't/aren't laity allowed passed the altar rail?

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ajpirc

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Why weren’t the laity, especially women, allowed passed the altar rail in the Tridentine Mass?
 
Every aspect of the Mass has symbolism, and this aspect of the ceremony is no exception. The area where the the people sit is called the “Nave” and represents Earth. The area past the altar rail, where the tabernacle and altar reside, and where the Priest conducts the Mass, is called the “Sanctuary” and represents Heaven. As a person kneels at the altar rail, they are symbolically approaching Heaven and actually receiving a part of Heaven with the body, blood, soul and divinity of Christ in the blessed host.

The laity were kept separate from the priest as we here in our mortal exile are separated from God.
 
Stavros said:
Every aspect of the Mass has symbolism, and this aspect of the ceremony is no exception. The area where the the people sit is called the “Nave” and represents Earth. The area past the altar rail, where the tabernacle and altar reside, and where the Priest conducts the Mass, is called the “Sanctuary” and represents Heaven. As a person kneels at the altar rail, they are symbolically approaching Heaven and actually receiving a part of Heaven with the body, blood, soul and divinity of Christ in the blessed host.

The laity were kept separate from the priest as we here in our mortal exile are separated from God.
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👍
 
I’m not going to explain this very well so maybe someone more articulate can help out. The Jews had the sanctuary, and within that, the Holy of Holies, which one priest would enter only once a year, after doing blood sacrifices. A rope was tied to his waist or ankle because if he should sin within the Holy of Holies, he could die, and no one else was permitted to enter. A very sobering thought, and God was teaching His people how Holy He was. We have today the tabernacle where Jesus resides, which I think corresponds to the Holy of Holies, then He comes to us when we receive communion to be a living temple. For the 10 min that He comes to stay with us, I can’t imagine doing anything else but praise Him for the tremendous privilege of Him being ‘under our roof’ and we can live to tell about it!

The thought of it should make one hurry to have a good confession before receiving Christ in the Eucharist.
 
PennyinCanada said:
…one priest would enter only once a year…and no one else was permitted to enter…We have today the tabernacle where Jesus resides, which I think corresponds to the Holy of Holies…
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If the tabernacle corresponds to the Holy of Holies, shouldn’t we only have our priests enter (open) it? But it’s not the Holy of Holies that made itself holy, it was God inside that made it holy. If the Holy of Holies corresponds to the tabernacle, then Whom was inside would correspond to the Blessed Sacrament, correct? If only one priest were allowed to enter once a year with no one else permitted to enter, should we be allowing Eucharistic Ministers to enter the tabernacle or even touching what makes the tabernacle holy?

What I’m saying is (with rhetorical questions), is this the symbolism about why people were not allowed to hold the Eucharist in the Latin Mass and only the priest was allowed?
 
ajpirc, Good questions. I am in the Eastern Rite and these things are more apparent, with the iconastas, and the tabernacle on the altar. The priest and deacon are clothed in vestments and laity shouldn’t be entering. I hope some knowledgeable RC folks comment on your questions.

The OT had things that foreshadowed Christ, pointed to Christ to come. The OT things were all lesser, pointing to something greater. Christ in the tabernacle is greater than what was in the Holy of Holies. I think the Ark of the Covenant, with 3 items (rod of Aaron, miraculous manna, and…, forgive me, my memory fails me at the moment) When John the Baptist pointed to Christ and said There is the Lamb of God, Who takes away the sins of the world! all the lambs that were slaughtered pointed to Christ, and were lesser. So it was with the Holy of Holies. We have something greater with us today.
 
Thank you for the comment PennyinCanada.

That is quite something! People in the Old Testament would have been struck down by God if they had entered the Holy of Holies and the tabernacle and Eucharist are even greater! In the Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite, we have men and women walking up toward the altar into the sanctuary, OPENING THE TABERNACLE, and TOUCHING, WITH THEIR UNCLEAN HANDS, GOD HIMSELF TO DISTRIBUTE TO THE HANDS OF OTHERS!!! :mad:

Wow!!! With non-ordained people entering something greater than the Holy of Holies, something went wrong when someone was drawing out the plans for the Mass.

Also, Sorry if the yelling was to loud, it’s just a pretty big deal. 😃
 
If you check 1 Chronicles 14, David was transporting the Ark from one place to the next. With celebration, dancing, and music, they were going along, the ark being brought by oxen. Now as they went along, I suppose the ground was uneven, and Uzzah reached up to steady the ark as it as it was shifting in the cart. Verse 10 says Then the Lord became angry with Uzzah and struck him; he died there in God’s presence, because he had laid his hand on the ark.

It helps me to appreciate the grace that Christ offers us in covering us with His Blood, that we may become temporary tabernacles! We should approach the Mystery with fear and trembling, yet with tender love and devotion, knowing God always had this design in mind for us.

Someone in authority has decided to allow laity certain tasks, and God will decide *and reveal *if He is pleased with the duties that have been performed with this most august sacrament. We as laity can offer prayer and penance when we find that our care and devotion have been found wanting.

The above incident with the ark also is a way of presenting the perpetual virginity of the Mother of God. St Joseph would understand that she is the ark of the new covenant who carried *God himself *in her womb. She is greater than the ark! Her marriage partner was the Holy Spirit! For her to conceive a child with a man would seem to be an act worse than adultery, since her spouse is the Holy Spirit. For those who are challenged with the phrase “Show me in the bible that Mary had no other children”, I think there’s a strong argument right here.
 
PennyinCanada said:
I’m not going to explain this very well so maybe someone more articulate can help out. The Jews had the sanctuary, and within that, the Holy of Holies, which one priest would enter only once a year, after doing blood sacrifices. A rope was tied to his waist or ankle because if he should sin within the Holy of Holies, he could die, and no one else was permitted to enter. A very sobering thought, and God was teaching His people how Holy He was.
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It must have been a very awesome event.

This might be a good explanation:

the-tabernacle-place.com/tabernacle_articles/tabernacle_holy_of_holies.aspx

Possible visual:

youtube.com/watch?v=frZpEHaZbaY

Movie:

youtube.com/watch?v=sQx2QegUrbg&playnext=1&list=PL94C2EC834963A0C8
 
ajpirc said:
Why weren’t the laity, especially women, allowed passed the altar rail in the Tridentine Mass?
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Lay men were and are allowed past the altar rail in the Tridentine Mass. Altar servers are laity and they serve within the sanctuary. I believe it was women in particular who were not permitted in the sanctuary. That idea may have survived in some places post-Vatican II. I remember as a child that our parish church was cleaned by ladies but a man cleaned the sanctuary.
 
ajpirc said:
Thank you for the comment PennyinCanada.

That is quite something! People in the Old Testament would have been struck down by God if they had entered the Holy of Holies and the tabernacle and Eucharist are even greater! In the Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite, we have men and women walking up toward the altar into the sanctuary, OPENING THE TABERNACLE, and TOUCHING, WITH THEIR UNCLEAN HANDS, GOD HIMSELF TO DISTRIBUTE TO THE HANDS OF OTHERS!!! :mad:

Wow!!! With non-ordained people entering something greater than the Holy of Holies, something went wrong when someone was drawing out the plans for the Mass.

Also, Sorry if the yelling was to loud, it’s just a pretty big deal. 😃
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If your hands cannot touch God, why can your mouth receive Him?
 
ajpirc said:
Thank you for the comment PennyinCanada.

That is quite something! People in the Old Testament would have been struck down by God if they had entered the Holy of Holies and the tabernacle and Eucharist are even greater! In the Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite, we have men and women walking up toward the altar into the sanctuary, OPENING THE TABERNACLE, and TOUCHING, WITH THEIR UNCLEAN HANDS, GOD HIMSELF TO DISTRIBUTE TO THE HANDS OF OTHERS!!! :mad:

Wow!!! With non-ordained people entering something greater than the Holy of Holies, something went wrong when someone was drawing out the plans for the Mass.

Also, Sorry if the yelling was to loud, it’s just a pretty big deal. 😃
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That was the old covenant, if I’m not mistaken. Unclean hands? If we are in a state of grace, as we should be in order to worthily receive the Eucharist, then God has declared us clean by virtue of the absolution we receive in the Sacrament of Confession. If we are not in a state of grace, then that is what the Sacrament is for. Frankly, I find your attitude in this post to be nearly heretical. The Eucharist is for the Church. Jesus gives Himself to us because He loves us. He died on the cross to make us clean so that we could approach Him with joy, love and confidence.

Do you understand at all why God gave us the sacraments? God desires intimacy with His people. Do you understand how intimate receiving the Eucharist truly is? Terese of Lisieux said that Jesus does not come down from Heaven to remain in a golden ciborium but to dwell in the Heaven of our hearts.
 
Theophilus777 said:
That was the old covenant, if I’m not mistaken. Unclean hands? If we are in a state of grace, as we should be in order to worthily receive the Eucharist, then God has declared us clean by virtue of the absolution we receive in the Sacrament of Confession. If we are not in a state of grace, then that is what the Sacrament is for. Frankly, I find your attitude in this post to be nearly heretical. The Eucharist is for the Church. Jesus gives Himself to us because He loves us. He died on the cross to make us clean so that we could approach Him with joy, love and confidence.

Do you understand at all why God gave us the sacraments? God desires intimacy with His people. Do you understand how intimate receiving the Eucharist truly is? Terese of Lisieux said that Jesus does not come down from Heaven to remain in a golden ciborium but to dwell in the Heaven of our hearts.
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Beautiful 👍:clapping:
 
Theophilus777 said:
That was the old covenant, if I’m not mistaken. .
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And the New Covenant is the fulfillment of the Old Covenant; it did not abolish it. Are you saying that we don’t have to treat God Himself with more respect and reverence than how the Jews treated the Holy of Holies? Is God worth less?
Theophilus777 said:
Unclean hands? If we are in a state of grace, as we should be in order to worthily receive the Eucharist, then God has declared us clean by virtue of the absolution we receive in the Sacrament of Confession. If we are not in a state of grace, then that is what the Sacrament is for.
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How many people do you see in the lines waiting for Confession before Mass? I don’t see any. Many of my family members haven’t been to Confession in maybe 10 years! Even for the ones that go to Confession every week, does that exclude them from saying, “Lord, I am not worthy to receive you, but only say the word and I shall be healed,” before communion?
Theophilus777 said:
Frankly, I find your attitude in this post to be nearly heretical.
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Seriously? Heretical? Give me one thing heretical that I have said, not only in the post you pointed out, but also in this entire thread.
Theophilus777 said:
The Eucharist is for the Church. Jesus gives Himself to us because He loves us. He died on the cross to make us clean so that we could approach Him with joy, love and confidence.
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The Eucharistic Sacrifice of the Mass is for the Church and this is his love for Her. He may have died for Her once, but every Mass is the same sacrifice. We should approach him as sinners, though humbly.
 
ConstantineTG said:
If your hands cannot touch God, why can your mouth receive Him?
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Because Jesus told us to eat His flesh. It’s pretty hard to eat His flesh without having it touch our mouths. Unless you know how to eat something without it touching your mouth?
 
ajpirc said:
Why weren’t the laity, especially women, allowed passed the altar rail in the Tridentine Mass?
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This comes from the Jewish tradition of the Holy of Holies. Women were seen as unclean if I am not mistaken unless they were churched and even then it was left to men. Still even in the OF the Priest who can only be male is allowed to handle the species primarily. I have seen women put the hosts away in the tabernacle though in the OF. Women aren’t singled out in the EF. The EF just follows the tradition of the church much more. St. Paul does talk about how women should not speak at church. It is simply tradition of the apostles. Lately, we have been changing though…at least we didn’t allow women priests.
 
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