Why women cant be Catholic Priests

[Zaccheus]

Gorgias:

Would it have been appropriate for God to take a human wife? To have borne human children with her? Wouldn’t that give the lie to His statements about who his family is (see Luke 8:21)?

He had a human mom, so why not? Point is, the good padre didn’t specify that his absolute statement applied to everyone but Jesus.

If Jesus had married He would have had to be open to new life as a result of sex with His wife.
Imagine the results if Jesus had been the father of six or eight sons and daughters.
Would not many, even most of His worshippers have thought they must also worship His children?

What about their children?

"I am the grandson of Jesus the Savior. Worship me now, pray to me and pay me the honor I am entitled to as a divine being."

What would that have done to the Church?

On the other hand what good would Christ have accomplished by taking a wife?

 

[HeDa]

The deacons, priests and bishops lay on the floor during the Litany of the Saints when they are ordained. Isn’t that submissive when everyone else, including the bishop who is ordaining the new deacon, priest or bishop, are on their knees praying Lord have mercy, Saint X pray for us etc. The priesthood is all about serving the people of God and bring them to heaven. This is also seen during the Washing of Feet during the Mass on Thursday before Easter. The priest ends the foot washing with kissing the feet of the person he is washing. How much power and authority does that show?

The bishop is washing the feet in the Cathedral. Isn’t the deacon supposed to be the bishops handyman and then do the foot washing? Then the question would be: Why is the bishop doing the washing and not the deacon? It is all about serving!

My suggestion is to go to Mass on Thursday and really listen to all the words spoken and see what the priest is doing. Next thing is to go to an ordination either deaconate or priesthood. Listen to the questions the ordaining bishop asks the rector of the seminary or responsible person for the deaconate teaching or other formator of the one being ordained.

 

[Sugabee43]

Ok, so can you explain how to understand that men can be married to the bridegroom?

Why is it so horrendous to think of a woman being a minister to God’s family but not a man?

Again: you are only focusing on the pastoral aspect of the priesthood and not focusing in any way on the theological aspect of the priest acting in persona Christi at the Sacrifice of the Mass. God, whether anyone likes it or not, chose to be incarnated as a man. Why do you insist on telling God that He was wrong?

 

[Sugabee43]

The April 1976 Pontifical Biblical Commission unanimously concluded, “It does not seem that the New Testament by itself alone will permit us to settle in a clear way and once and for all the problem of the possible accession of women to the presbyterate.”

Later deliberation saw the commission vote 12-5 in support of the view that Scripture alone provides no exclusionary requirement to the ordination of women. A second vote found 12-5 in favour of the notion that the Church could pursue female ordination without violating Christ’s original intentions in instituting the Sacrament of Holy Orders.

Subsequent declarations in “Inter Insignores” and by Pope John Paul II in “Ordinatio Sacerdotalis” were entirely founded on appeals to Tradition. We are a Church predicated jointly on reliance between both Scripture and Tradition. Where Tradition appears to run counter to Scripture, a re-evaluation is required.

This issue is very much not settled.

Please read this. It absolutely is settled. Why Can't Women Be Priests? | Catholic Answers

The final paragraphs: "In 1994, Pope John Paul II declared, "Although the teaching that priestly ordination is to be reserved to men alone has been preserved by the constant and universal Tradition of the Church and firmly taught by the Magisterium in its more recent documents, at the present time in some places it is nonetheless considered still open to debate, or the Church’s judgment that women are not to be admitted to ordination is considered to have a merely disciplinary force. Wherefore, in order that all doubt may be removed regarding a matter of great importance, a matter which pertains to the Church’s divine constitution itself, in virtue of my ministry of confirming the brethren (cf. Luke 22:32), I declare that the Church has no authority whatsoever to confer priestly ordination on women and that this judgment is to be definitively held by all the Church’s faithful" (Ordinatio Sacerdotalis 4).

One year after this was written, the Church ruled that this teaching "requires definitive assent, since, founded on the written Word of God, and from the beginning constantly preserved and applied in the Tradition of the Church, it has been set forth infallibly by the ordinary and universal Magisterium (cf. Second Vatican Council, Dogmatic Constitution on the Church, Lumen Gentium 25:2)"

 

[QwertyGirl]

Again…Matthew 16: 17-19. Jesus gives the authority. No one asked Him; He conferred the authority upon Peter and the Apostles.

So this leads itself to a question. If God has full authority, that means he can make changes whenever he sees fit, yes? So, let’s pretend he has (in 2018) decided to make a change and allow for women to be priests. Whatever changes need to be made to “make that happen”, he is OK with, and his will be done. He is God after all. What is the method of communication the Catholic Church finds acceptable for this modification to be implemented? Does the Pope have to hear a whisper in his ear? I honestly would like to know. It seems perfectly logical that what was fitting in one point of history is not fitting in another. And who better than God to make adjustments are they are needed? The Catholic Church seems to be all about authority, but I never get a clear answer on who is listening for changes. And please don’t say, “There aren’t any changes to be made.” You don’t know that, because God can do whatever he sees fit, yes?

 

[Sugabee43]

Again…Matthew 16: 17-19. Jesus gives the authority. No one asked Him; He conferred the authority upon Peter and the Apostles.

So this leads itself to a question. If God has full authority, that means he can make changes whenever he sees fit, yes? So, let’s pretend he has (in 2018) decided to make a change and allow for women to be priests. Whatever changes need to be made to “make that happen”, he is OK with, and his will be done. He is God after all. What is the method of communication the Catholic Church finds acceptable for this modification to be implemented? Does the Pope have to hear a whisper in his ear? I honestly would like to know. It seems perfectly logical that what was fitting in one point of history is not fitting in another. And who better than God to make adjustments are they are needed? The Catholic Church seems to be all about authority, but I never get a clear answer on who is listening for changes. And please don’t say, “There aren’t any changes to be made.” You don’t know that, because God can do whatever he sees fit, yes?

It’s only ‘logical’ if you think God was wrong all along. As Blessed John Henry Neumann succinctly put it, (Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

 

[QwertyGirl]

It’s only ‘logical’ if you think God was wrong all along. As Blessed John Henry Neumann succinctly put it,

Where you replying to me? Your response didn’t address the question I asked at all.

My question was: What does the Catholic Church deem as an acceptable method of communication between God and the hierarchy if God wants to use his authority to modify the way the Church operates?

 

[Sugabee43]

My question was: What does the Catholic Church deem as an acceptable method of communication between God and the hierarchy if God wants to use his authority to modify the way the Church operates?

The Holy Spirit, through the Magisterium, would be my first guess.

 

[Zaccheus]

Where you replying to me? Your response didn’t address the question I asked at all.

My question was: What does the Catholic Church deem as an acceptable method of communication between God and the hierarchy if God wants to use his authority to modify the way the Church operates?

You’re looking for something like “God will whisper into people’s ears”? It doesn’t work that way.

 

[QwertyGirl]

The Holy Spirit, through the Magisterium, would be my first guess.

So, given the fact that God is all powerful, with authority, and with the ability to switch things up in an instant if that is his will…
How are Catholics so adamant about declaring there will never be women priests? How are they so adamant about declaring any issue won’t be changed. If God wants to change it, God will change it, yes?

 

[QwertyGirl]

I understand your distinction with regards to the word “operates”. But I still am asking, how does the Church know that God won’t switch things up one day? How will the Church know, if it isn’t willing to listen? What would be an acceptable method of communication between God and the Church should He decide to switch things up?

This is the part where I get stuck. God is all-knowing and all-powerful. It seems really small-minded and, for lack of a better word, arrogant for the Church to declare God won’t ever make a change.

No disrespect intended, of course. I hope none is taken. In 55 years, I have never received a good solid answer to this.

 

[Zaccheus]

How are Catholics so adamant about declaring there will never be women priests? How are they so adamant about declaring any issue won’t be changed. If God wants to change it, God will change it, yes?

We are adamant about it because God has said it. And God is not going to change His mind.

 

[deMontfort]

Sigh. God isn’t making things up as he goes…

 

[QwertyGirl]

Sigh. God isn’t making things up as he goes…

I never said He was. I certainly don’t believe he would be. But I do believe if there is a God, he has a master plan.

 

[Zaccheus]

It seems really small-minded and, for lack of a better word, arrogant for the Church to declair God won’t ever make a change.

God has changed many things over the centuries. But God will not change those things that God has told us He will not change.

 

[QwertyGirl]

God has changed many things over the centuries. But God will not change those things that God has told us He will not change.

And this is where we part ways. I don’t ever remember God specifically telling anyone that only men can be priests and women cannot be priests. And he certainly didn’t say it, and then follow it up by saying he would never change it.

 

[Sugabee43]

[quote="QwertyGirl, post:310, top
And this is where we part ways. I don’t ever remember God specifically telling anyone that only men can be priests and women cannot be priests. And he certainly didn’t say it, and then follow it up by saying he would never change it.
[/quote]

But He did. I refer to the post earlier: Why women cant be Catholic Priests - #309

People who insist that God “got it wrong” by not ordaining women to the priesthood, are basically telling God they know better than Him. Oldest sin in The Book.

 

[QwertyGirl]

Thanks to @(name removed by moderator) and @Sugabee43 for respectfully answering my questions. I still don’t buy it, but I appreciate you taking the time to explain it to me from your (and the Church’s) POV.

I hope when CAFers read these exchanges, they realize people like me aren’t just trying to be obstinant, or anti-authority, or ultra-feminist. I am none of those things. I just don’t see the world the same way you do. It means I don’t see God the same way either. With that said, I believe the world is plenty big for all of us and God loves us all. Thanks again, as I said, for responding to my questions so charitably. I have a better understanding of why Catholics believe what they do with regards to this issue now.

 

[Zaccheus]

And this is where we part ways. I don’t ever remember God specifically telling anyone that only men can be priests and women cannot be priests. And he certainly didn’t say it, and then follow it up by saying he would never change it.

God has made plain through His Church that it is His will that only men be priests.

There was no point at which Jesus of Nazareth said “God wants His priests to be men and men only. Now you, John, write that down and include it in the Gospel.”
But God did give the Church the authority to teach and God did, through Jesus, tell us the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
You aren’t going to find a Biblical passage that satisfies you on this point. You aren’t going to hear the Holy Father say that God whispered in his ear.
None the less Mother Church has addressed this. The Holy Father has declared it as dogma. Christ’s promise applies. Mother Church is telling us the truth.
The Holy Roman Catholic priesthood is exclusively male.

And Mother Church has explained the reason for this. It remains for us to trust Mother Church enough to accept it.

And you have been both civil and respectful. May God bless you.

 

[Wingz]

Can any of you explain these two verses? I am confused about why only a men can stand in persona Christi and not women.

" 27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. "

Doesn’t this verse suggest that all who are baptized “clothe themselves with Christ” and can stand in persona Christi?

“28 There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.”

Or in latin- all are one “in persona Christi”

Doesn’t this verse mean that when it comes to standing in the person of Christ as priests do, race, class, and gender do not matter.