Why would God care?

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God had every right to create however He desired.

Yes, knowing Adam and Eve would fall.

Yes, even knowing that children would be subject to the suffering and death that “the fall” introduced to humanity.

God’s knowledge does not end with this life. He knows what is to come. As He formed Adam and Eve, He knew each one of us, our joys and our sufferings. He knew our final destination as well.

If God came to you right now and said you are to have a baby. This baby would be born with a myriad of health issues. Additionally, God tells you that in 4 years, while this baby is still a toddler, you will find yourself in a financially dire situation. You will have a very hard time housing and feeding yourself and the baby. There will be years of hardship and some real suffering.

keep in mind that God doesn’t “make” these things happen…He’s just telling you how it will play out because He already knows. Due to sin, suffering and death, illness, etc are part of our current condition. We to whom much has been given, are supposed to be caring for the suffering and infirm.

Now God tells you that the years of hardship are not the end of the story. The child, after much physical pain and illness, will die. God shares with you “the rest of the story”. The child, at death, is greeted by brilliant light, music of unearthly beauty, wonderous sights and smells and sounds. A being will take his hand and lead him further in. He will suddenly realize he is not in any more pain. He sees and recognizes others there. They greet and hug him. He is filled with overwhelming joy, peace and love. Some time later, he will, in turn, greet you with open arms and complete love.

God pauses and give you a second to digest this story. He then asks you if you are on board with having this child. If you say no (because of his and your anticipated earthly pain), his soul will never, ever exist or know the intense joy of heaven. However, if you say yes, you will participate in the creating of a fellow human soul, made in the image and likeness of God to love and be loved by Him for all eternity.

While suffering seems unfair, it is just part of our earthly condition. Suffering is not racist or sexist. Some of us are starving. Abused. Mourning. Terrorized. Tortured. Sick. Lonely. Etc.

God didn’t promise us that this life would be a bowl of cherries. He did promise that He’d be with us through it
 
reen12 said:
When I was 12, I asked - expecting a clear, concise reply:

“Father, we’re learning in history, that the change in the
English penal laws was considered a humane advance.
No longer would children be thrown in jail, when the father was in debt which he could not pay.
How is it, that we are still paying for the sin of Adam and Eve? Are human beings, then, more merciful than God is?”
I asked this question in all innocence.
I thought that this cleric would be able to reply. He couldn’t.
My eyes narrowed with suspicion, for the first time in my life. That was 50 years ago.

Does not Catholicism have an answer?
That adults suffer, I can understand, from a theological perspective.

Can no one offer reply?

reen12
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The original sin - the misuse of the God-given free will – the fallen human nature, is rooted in our parents Adam and Even and passed down. It is hereditary.

It is not God did not forgive Adam and Eve; it is this fallen nature that continues to stay with us. God has long forgiven Adam and Eve. For justice sake, God has even sent Jesus to fill the huge gap resulted from the original sin between heaven and earth. However, this did not erase the rooted fallen nature in each of us.

Because of the fallen human nature and the continued misuse of free will, sin remains in this world. Many misery and sufferings are caused by the fallen human nature. Thus, it is not God wants to throw crosses on us, often times various crosses come from the natural result of sins, either others’ sin or our own, or the combination of both. Sufferings could also come from the combination of wrong time and wrong place, or any other unexplainable reasons.

All these happen in a world of natural law (cause and consequence), within God’s permissive will. God permits things to happen because God has given us free will and allows this world to run under its own natural law.
 
Thank you, to each of you, for your kind replies.

2 years ago, a 4 year old went missing, in Portugal.
A four year old, torn from her mother and comfort and love.

It helps, in keeping one’s sanity, to think the world absurd -
meaningless - than to think that there is a loving God,
Who would stand by and let that 4 year old child suffer hell on earth,
all alone, with no word of comfort or love.

It gives a hollow ring to “God is love.” It also makes
me wonder, about Jesus crying out, over His feeling
that He had been abandoned by His Father.
A grown man, feeling abandoned. A grown man, with the
powers of intellect of an adult. A way to orient - to what was
happening to Him, even in the midst of His suffering.

What of that 4 year old, who felt abandoned, too?
Where is my mommy? A four year old would feel abandoned,
not understanding what had happened.
She did not wake, to find her abandonment over, two days later
  • as did a grown man, suffering and feelings of abandonment now over, in rising.
Others may find both comfort and reason, in a theological explanation
of the suffering of children. Yet, just as 50 years ago, I find that
human beings are often much more merciful than God is,
as He is portrayed - in that which is considered ‘the word of God.’

That God exists, I have no doubt, whatsoever. The
complexity of creation speaks to this. We can know
that He exists and that He creates. If others choose to
accept further explanation of Who God is, that is, of course,
up to them. I can at least pray “Hear, O Israel, the Lord our G-d,
the Lord is One.” I can pray these words, knowing that the
One Who hears them, understands why I can go no further.

reen12
 
That God exists, I have no doubt, whatsoever. The
complexity of creation speaks to this. We can know
that He exists and that He creates. If others choose to
accept further explanation of Who God is, that is, of course,
up to them. I can at least pray “Hear, O Israel, the Lord our G-d,
the Lord is One.” I can pray these words, knowing that the
One Who hears them, understands why I can go no further.
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…👍 …Mystery…in the face of the suffering of the innocent and especially the overwhelming suffering of some children reason and logic are silenced … did something overwhelmingly terrible and evil enter this world with sin to which we all contribute - undoubtedly I think it has, but this offers no comfort confronted with the suffering innocent and the experience of a Loving God of Mercy…reason and logic are silenced…there is only humanly pain and helplessness in the face of another’s suffering and perhaps even “why?”…
 
If this life is all there is, then suffering makes no sense.

But this world is not our home, and whether we live to be 9 or 99, our lives aren’t even a blink of an eye in light of eternity. Everything God does or allows is for our salvation, even if it seems painful and senseless to us in this life. Humans are not more merciful than God. People may be able to step in and lessen temporal suffering, but only God can save us from eternal suffering.
 
quote: BarbaraTherese
…Mystery… in the face of the suffering of the innocent and especially the overwhelming suffering of some children reason and logic are silenced … did something overwhelmingly terrible and evil enter this world with sin to which we all contribute - undoubtedly I think it has, but this offers no comfort confronted with the suffering innocent and the experience of a Loving God of Mercy…reason and logic are silenced…there is only humanly pain and helplessness in the face of another’s suffering and perhaps even “why?”…
Click to expand...
Thank you, Barb.

quote: BarbaraTherese
…reason and logic are silenced…
Click to expand...
reen
 
reen12 said:
quote: BarbaraTherese

Thank you, Barb.

quote: BarbaraTherese

reen
Click to expand...
…Thanks Reen - it sure helps to have a powerful intellect affirm one’s concepts…👍 …I was reading an article a few days ago that said more or less that sooner or later we are confronted with our own limitedness and we are forced to admit that we are limited on all fronts and that we must let God be God and Mystery. I think to contemplate the terrible sufferings of some complete innocents and especially babies and children forces us to this frontier where a God of Love and Mercy and the sufferings that confront us, in some cases,and to our human logic and reason present an absurdity and an irreconcilable contradiction - and another phrase of yours, Reen - “The God of The Absurd”…
Human existence must needs to play out completely to Final Judgement I think for things to make anywhere near sense to us on all fronts…
…and all this is the only way I can make peace with my own logic and reason and the sufferings of innocents especially babies and children which I had to come to terms with with the onset of my own illness while my children still very much needed a Mum and I just was not there for them. That difference de Mello mentions between sighting a snake on the ground, or having it wrapped around ones arm. Some seem to find easy theological rationalizations for the sufferings of children and babies, the innocents - which therefore becomes only ‘a snake on the ground’ …Blessings and warm regards…Barb:)
 
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