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TimothyH
Guest
This is the answer.
Faith is in God, not in an event. We believe in the resurrection because He has revealed it to us.
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Faith is in God, not in an event. We believe in the resurrection because He has revealed it to us.
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D0UBTFIRE
Guest
Yes, but, God has not only “revealed himself to us” in the Bible, he’s also “revealed himself to us” in the Quran and the Book of Mormon. SO, why should I reject those other books and accept the Bible’s version of events? By choosing any of them, even the Bible, one is putting their faith in the events described in that book. Faith in God is something separate. Muslims also have faith in God but they put their faith in a different set of events, a different revelation, so to speak.
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TimothyH
Guest
The Quran and the Book of Mormon are not the inspired word of God. They are not part of revelation. There is no “different revelation” for God cannot contradict himself.
You can start with the fact that the Christian Bible alone has over 5000 fulfilled prophesies.
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TimothyH
Guest
Karl Keating touches on why the Christian religion is true in parts of his debate with a Baptist preacher at youtube.com/watch?v=stS4eveIbQQ
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AmbroseSJ
Guest
You have to discern whether God’s revelation is found in Christianity, Islam, or wherever.
You are not putting your faith in events, but rather in which religion you have found God’s revelation.
That decision is based on your own searchings, Divine Faith from God, and your conscience.
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D0UBTFIRE
Guest
You are right, you understand the dilemma. Different religions claim this and we have to search to see if any of these are more likely to be true, if even true at all…
At least you get it.
It seems sometimes that some people think that because they were raised in this or that religion that it must be the true one without realizing there’s a great big world out there with all sorts of other ideas…
I am keenly aware of this because I was raised in a cult, and had to realize they weren’t the Truth they claimed to be - and it was hard to let go, but I eventually did. Drifted in atheism for a while…eventually came to fully embrace Catholicism …but alas, I realize now I’ve drifted into agnosticism. It’s where I’m at in this journey, and I’ve come to terms with it. Doesn’t mean I stop searching, doesn’t mean I won’t change my mind later…but that is where I’ve landed for now.
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dcana
Guest
Following your train of logic, God should reveal Himself personally to every human being who ever existed, who exists, or who will ever exist in some miraculous way, so that we might all believe in Him. Where would faith be then? Nowhere, for that would be sight. Or should He perform some spectacular miracle in every generation of humanity so that the whole world can see it and then know He exists and then believe in Him? Where would faith be then? What if He performed this miracle in the year 1790 and you were only 3 at the time? What if he did perform such a miracle in 1790? How would every person on earth know about it, given that at the time, the only way communication occurred was by word of mouth or letters by horse or ship or whatever? Why should the rest of the world believe these witnesses? Should He perform His miracle in every country, would that suit you better? Or should He have waited until the late 20th century when we had recording devices so someone could record Jesus’ miracles, death, and resurrection, and then we could make millions of copies of the VHS tape, so everybody could watch it at home on their TV? Or maybe thousands of reporters could have thronged Jerusalem and Israel for the three years and we could have live shots of “Jesus in action”? Would that have suited you? But where would faith be then?
Guess, what, bud, this is not what God has chosen to do. He came in the “fullness of time” i.e. at the exact time that HE chose, which was the PERFECT time to come, whether you, personally, some agnostic (now) in 2014, agree with His designs or not.
We are called to live BY FAITH: “The just man will live by faith.”
In fact, we did witness His miracles (all Catholics, that is, since we are the Body of Christ). The twelve apostles, who are the first Catholic bishops, ate, drank, and lived with Him for 3 years. THEY WITNESSED Jesus’ miracles, because some people, at some point in history, would have to witness with their eyes and ears what God had designed from all eternity to reveal to us, which He did through His Son, and then these witnesses would proclaim their witness to others and to all the world. And when we hear their testimony, which receive through the Holy Scriptures, Sacred Tradition, and through others simply telling us about it (which they know through the Holy Scriptures and Sacred Tradition, by the way), GOD GIVES US the supernatural gift of FAITH to believe what we are hearing or reading, and then we can choose to accept it or reject it that gift.
“He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.”
How can Jesus say such a thing! Because He is God and this is the way God has designed for us to come to know and love Him, that we might return to Him and know and love Him perfectly for all eternity. If you don’t like it, tough! Who are you to say that your designs, what you would want, are better than God’s designs?
Pray for Faith!
God will NEVER give up on you, because He loves you and wants you to know and love Him again, as you once did. You may not believe in Him, but He believes in you. We call Him the “Hound of Heaven” for good reason.
God bless
Guess, what, bud, this is not what God has chosen to do. He came in the “fullness of time” i.e. at the exact time that HE chose, which was the PERFECT time to come, whether you, personally, some agnostic (now) in 2014, agree with His designs or not.
We are called to live BY FAITH: “The just man will live by faith.”
In fact, we did witness His miracles (all Catholics, that is, since we are the Body of Christ). The twelve apostles, who are the first Catholic bishops, ate, drank, and lived with Him for 3 years. THEY WITNESSED Jesus’ miracles, because some people, at some point in history, would have to witness with their eyes and ears what God had designed from all eternity to reveal to us, which He did through His Son, and then these witnesses would proclaim their witness to others and to all the world. And when we hear their testimony, which receive through the Holy Scriptures, Sacred Tradition, and through others simply telling us about it (which they know through the Holy Scriptures and Sacred Tradition, by the way), GOD GIVES US the supernatural gift of FAITH to believe what we are hearing or reading, and then we can choose to accept it or reject it that gift.
“He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.”
How can Jesus say such a thing! Because He is God and this is the way God has designed for us to come to know and love Him, that we might return to Him and know and love Him perfectly for all eternity. If you don’t like it, tough! Who are you to say that your designs, what you would want, are better than God’s designs?
Pray for Faith!
God will NEVER give up on you, because He loves you and wants you to know and love Him again, as you once did. You may not believe in Him, but He believes in you. We call Him the “Hound of Heaven” for good reason.
God bless
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dcana
Guest
Come Holy Spirit, fill the hearts of thy faithful and enkindle in them the fire of thy love. Send forth thy Spirit and they shall be created. And Thou shalt renew the face [and faith] of the earth.
Blessings
Blessings
S
SpeakKindly
Guest
I was thinking about your struggles with faith today and I think that if you can accept that Jesus existed, and taught things that are written on the Bible, and try to come up with logical and truthful reasons for why Christianity still exist and why you want to be a Catholic, and why what you believe to be true in Catholicism is, and then try to look at the most logical objections to the crucifixion I think you’ll find that there are no fitting objections. I think you only doubt the crucifixion because the arguments against it haven’t actually persuaded you, so I’d say that there are many arguments against the resurrection, but not anything to truly stick, at least not for myself.
There’s no fitting reason for the martyrs of the early Church, the virtues that exist in the examples of the saint’s lives, there’s no reason to be Catholic…unless Jesus’ death and resurrection were real. It really doesn’t matter if we can provide modern scientific evidence because scientism is a false idea. Modern science didn’t even exist until many centuries later, so you’re asking for something to be filtered into a form of learning when it’s not possible because that is not applicable.
If you look at atheism, what answers besides “I don’t know” are you truly given, what does it offer you, besides a very narrow way to know about reality?
There’s no fitting reason for the martyrs of the early Church, the virtues that exist in the examples of the saint’s lives, there’s no reason to be Catholic…unless Jesus’ death and resurrection were real. It really doesn’t matter if we can provide modern scientific evidence because scientism is a false idea. Modern science didn’t even exist until many centuries later, so you’re asking for something to be filtered into a form of learning when it’s not possible because that is not applicable.
If you look at atheism, what answers besides “I don’t know” are you truly given, what does it offer you, besides a very narrow way to know about reality?
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dcana
Guest
O, God, you have taught the hearts of the faithful by the light of the Holy Spirit. Grant that by the gift of your Spirit, we may be always truly wise, and ever rejoice in His consolation. Through Christ Our Lord. Amen.
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GaryTaylor
Guest
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SpeakKindly
Guest
that’s basically what I was getting at, and I don’t believe any of them are valid arguments.
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dcana
Guest
Good evening, Doubtfire. At least it’s evening here where I’m at. I just wanted to add please don’t take offense at what I wrote. I mean no offense - that’s just the way I write and think…rather directly and simply. I pray that at least you may take a little something good from it, but much more good from what more calm and reasoned posters have to say.
God bless
God bless
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dcana
Guest
“I do not seek to understand in order that I may believe, but rather, I believe in order that I may understand” - St. Anselm (11th c.), following St. Augustine (4th-5th c.): “Believe so that you may understand.”
Credo ut intelligam
Credo ut intelligam
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D0UBTFIRE
Guest
Don’t worry, I don’t take offense when someone is so obviously sincere. I appreciate your words.
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dcana
Guest
Thank you. That makes me feel much better.
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mdcpensive1
Guest
One of the things that let us know that the Resurrection was received to the liking of the Father is that Jesus did rise. If He did not rise then the sacrifice He made on Calvary was not pleasing to the Father. Therefore, we should believe in the resurrection.
mdcpensive1
mdcpensive1
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