Why wouldn't God give Satan and the demons a second chance? while we are forgiven 70x7 times?

[Sarcelle]

Then how did they appear in space and time? What is the difference between existing outside of space and time, and not existing at all?

Existence does not depend being within space and time. God exists, yet He is outside of time. When we die, time for us will be no more, yet we still exist.

As one poster already recommended, read Peter Kreeft’s Angels and Demons.

 

[moondawg]

When we die, time for us will be no more, yet we still exist.

If that’s true, why do you pray for **time **in purgatory to be less?

 

[glendab]

Hello Moondawg.

If that’s true, why do you pray for **time **in purgatory to be less?

Might help if you keep in mind that time is a measurement of some *thing other than time. We use the term time to describe the passage of this thing. That thing *in Purgatory is a process whereby the soul is purified of all the stains of sin and attachment to them. How ever long this takes is spoken of by the purely human construct called time. Literally you need to think outside the box on this one, the box being the human construct called time.

Glenda

 

[Kay_Cee]

Hello Kay Cee.

Nice, but you left out one little detail, (and we know the devil is in the details) the fact that the personification of evil needs to be loved, adored and worshiped by those around it and will deceive others into doing so which is one of the outcomes of turning towards evil. It seduces people and they actually begin to long for evil as if it is good. Part of this is the psychology of why the angels fell - they say Lucifer the first to fall envied the worship he saw the Christ getting and wanted it for himself and was the “reason” he rebelled because he couldn’t have it. But that doesn’t mean he doesn’t try. Think Satanists today. Who is it they worship? None other than Lucifer. They symbolize their religious affection for the prince of darkness with a star of many points. Really perverse stuff. :bigyikes: Time to change the subject. I scare me.

Since the scene takes place in heaven, the demons weren’t looking for anyone to adore them, at least not yet. However, I do get into that later in the book and also in my next novel.

Nice writing though. You should do more.

Glenda

Thanks. I’m finishing up my third novel. If you want to read the book that scene is a part of, just click the link in my signature below. It’s free. Or, if you prefer Kindle, I’ve got it on Amazon for $.99 till the end of the year with all net profits going to my parish.

 

[janiruchan]

I think your question is off. God is Love; John told us that. This Love means that there are always second chances. That offer or possibility is there–even for Satan and the demons–but Satan and the demons would never consider it. It is not God who is not doing the giving but Satan and the demons who, by their choices, cannot accept.

nice. sounds more convincing to me… I get it was reallly the choice of Satan not of God, right? since it would contradict His nature if He willed to really cast them away. (Im not sure if Im just trying to comfort myself by this thought since God is also a just judge)

I am reminded of what C.S. Lewis would say…it is not God who sends us to hell, but us who lock the inside door to heaven.

 

[thistle]

Their will is fixed.

I suggest Frank Sheed’s Theology for Beginners. Excellent book.

I second this recommendation.

 

[Dorothy]

I second this recommendation.

I third the recommendation!

 

[Bahman]

I know this explanation falls under private revelation but here goes.

St. Faustina once asked Jesus why the angels were not pardoned when they rebelled. He answered that their knowledge of God was greater than that of the greatest human saint which made their sin more egregious.

Also once they made their decision as one poster notes above, their will became fixed. Remember, the angels exist outside of space and time.

Hence, Human can also fall as they fell from heaven, hence their will become fixed.

 

[mikekle]

I always thought it was strange/ curious that satan rebelled as he did, especially since he had FULL knowledge about God, so he knew how powerful God actually was/is…yet he still tried to overthrow heaven…??? If satan had this full knowledge of God, he would have known he did not stand a chance, only other thing I can think of to explain this, is possibly God is NOT as all powerful as we believe, or its something we cannot comprehend.

Plus, its not just Satan, he convinced 1/3 of ALL Gods angels to side with him…This makes no sense at all, that THAT many angels who also had FULL knowledge of Gods nature and power…yet they still sided with satan?

There has to be something about God or Gods nature that we do not understand in this regard…Angels would be intelligent enough to recognize if they stood ZERO chances of succeeding at such a rebellion, obviously they thought they had some kind of chance…meaning there is ‘something’ they know, that we do not.

 

[Dorothy]

A lot of things may seem strange to us because we have finite minds and God is infinite.

Because the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, we can understand according to our capability the depth of love that God has for us, and therefore can trust Him and the teachings of the Church.

Have a blessed and holy New Year!

 

[glendab]

Hello Mikekle.

I always thought it was strange/ curious that satan rebelled as he did, especially since he had FULL knowledge about God, so he knew how powerful God actually was/is…yet he still tried to overthrow heaven…??? If satan had this full knowledge of God, he would have known he did not stand a chance, only other thing I can think of to explain this, is possibly God is NOT as all powerful as we believe, or its something we cannot comprehend.

Plus, its not just Satan, he convinced 1/3 of ALL Gods angels to side with him…This makes no sense at all, that THAT many angels who also had FULL knowledge of Gods nature and power…yet they still sided with satan?

There has to be something about God or Gods nature that we do not understand in this regard…Angels would be intelligent enough to recognize if they stood ZERO chances of succeeding at such a rebellion, obviously they thought they had some kind of chance…meaning there is ‘something’ they know, that we do not.

I think this may help: think of the angel having the fullness of knowledge possible for an angel. No angel can know things in the fullest sense, only God can have that kind of knowledge. But the angel can have the fullness of knowledge particular to that angels state of being. It wasn’t so much a something they knew that we do not. It was a choice that being a being with a will creates. They saw their choice before them and chose unwisely for themselves and God acted as He did based upon their choice.

The thread is about there being only one choice, one opportunity to choose and part of the reason for this lies in the type of beings they are, angels as opposed to humans. Because of their very nature, the angels only got one opportunity to choose and the way this is written about in our terms is insufficient to adequately describe the magnitude of these events. We cannot understand it fully and we cannot describe it adequately either. We have to work with what knowledge we have a basically chalk the rest up to another of our endless Catholic Mysteries. Angels are messengers of God and they carry out His will perfectly and only His will. When they fell, only those angels who made the first and only choice for God remained as God’s servants. And that is what they do. Nothing else. There will never be another choice for them to make. And all of this went on before Adam and Eve were made.

Glenda

 

[Bahman]

I always thought it was strange/ curious that satan rebelled as he did, especially since he had FULL knowledge about God, so he knew how powerful God actually was/is…yet he still tried to overthrow heaven…??? If satan had this full knowledge of God, he would have known he did not stand a chance, only other thing I can think of to explain this, is possibly God is NOT as all powerful as we believe, or its something we cannot comprehend.

Plus, its not just Satan, he convinced 1/3 of ALL Gods angels to side with him…This makes no sense at all, that THAT many angels who also had FULL knowledge of Gods nature and power…yet they still sided with satan?

There has to be something about God or Gods nature that we do not understand in this regard…Angels would be intelligent enough to recognize if they stood ZERO chances of succeeding at such a rebellion, obviously they thought they had some kind of chance…meaning there is ‘something’ they know, that we do not.