Widow/widowers re-marry question

[Rence]

Helenrose, the people are the church. What is the churchs problem is the peoples problem. And whats the peoples problem is the churchs problem.

The church are the people. God is head of the church. Fact.

That’s not true at all and is against Church teaching. Whether one agrees with the Catholic Church’s teaching or not is a moot point because the Church is not a democracy and the hierarchy of the Church sets the rules and standards, which the followers follow…not the other way around. If a person has a problem with Church teaching, they have a choice. Choice one is to be in communion with the Church and do as the Church teaches, and choice two is to not be in communion with the Church. A Catholic who wishes to be in good standing with the Church follows Church teaching. Fact.

For example, though it is your opinion (to which you are entitled) that widows and widowers shouldn’t get remarried, it’s only your opinion and Catholics know that they are free to marry and can do so as they wish. Therefore, if a person who has been widowed wants to remarry, they have the Church’s blessing to do so, regardless of someone else’s opinion. However, if one is of the opinion that widows and widowers should not remarry, then they simply don’t remarry and remain single. It’s all good.

 

[HelenRose]

Helenrose, the people are the church. What is the churchs problem is the peoples problem. And whats the peoples problem is the churchs problem.

The church are the people. God is head of the church. Fact.

I will restate.

For some people it is a problem that their spouse is not a virgin. This is a problem for them to deal with. The Magisterium or the Catechism of Catholic Church do not address this as a problem for widows or widowers. The Magisterium or the Catechism of Catholic Church does not address this as a problem for people who have repented of past sins and marry.

If an individual has trouble with this, well, it is best that they make sure that their future spouse is not a widow, widower, sinner, or repentant sinner.

 

[Rence]

Why is it the norm in society down through time and even know that men in particular don’t want children from a previous marriage?

It is not the norm. Men marry women who have children from previous marriages all the time.

Would it not be better for the in-laws to look after the widow /widower since she or he is an in-law and already apart of the family of her dead husband or dead wife.

For some people that might be an option. The Church says the widow can remarry, and so she is free to do so if she wishes.

The jews had laws that stated that the women should marry the brother in-law or be looked after. So in essence is this not more respectable ?

No, it’s not ‘more respectable’, it’s simply an option. The widow is free to marry another, and it certainly doesn’t have to be a member of the same family.

Why does Saint Paul tell the widows to re-marry for ? Whats the meaning of it ?

To avoid temptation and sin. He kinda says that…

Why does Saint Paul not keep with jewish tradtion ?

Because followers of Christ are not Jewish. We are Catholic. When the Catholic Church was formed, it was decided by early Church leaders that Catholics were not obligated to follow Jewish laws. In fact, they were not allowed to follow Jewish laws. This is why we are not forbidden from eating pork, and we are not required to circumcise our sons, and we don’t ‘keep the Sabbath’, etc.

 

[Rence]

I will restate.

For some people it is a problem that their spouse is not a virgin. This is a problem for them to deal with. The Magisterium nor the Catechism of Catholic Church address this as a problem for widows or widowers. Nor, does the Magisterium nor the Catechism of Catholic Church address this as a problem for people who have repented of past sins and marry.

If an individual has trouble with this, well, it is best that they make sure that their future spouse is not a widow, widower, sinner, or repentant sinner.

They better make sure their future spouse has never ever dated either. After all, they may bump into him in Krogers in ten years

 

[HelenRose]

They better make sure their future spouse has never ever dated either. After all, they may bump into him in Krogers in ten years

 

[HelenRose]

That’s not true at all and is against Church teaching. Whether one agrees with the Catholic Church’s teaching or not is a moot point because the Church is not a democracy and the hierarchy of the Church sets the rules and standards, which the followers follow…not the other way around. If a person has a problem with Church teaching, they have a choice. Choice one is to be in communion with the Church and do as the Church teaches, and choice two is to not be in communion with the Church. A Catholic who wishes to be in good standing with the Church follows Church teaching. Fact.

For example, though it is your opinion (to which you are entitled) that widows and widowers shouldn’t get remarried, it’s only your opinion and Catholics know that they are free to marry and can do so as they wish. Therefore, if a person who has been widowed wants to remarry, they have the Church’s blessing to do so, regardless of someone else’s opinion. However, if one is of the opinion that widows and widowers should not remarry, then they simply don’t remarry and remain single. It’s all good.

 

[catholicsaint]

Well it is a Godly thing to keep your virginity ontill marriage, regardless how many women or men you date. I think if you don’t it can cause problems like emotially problems or excess baggage you give to your husband/wife.

 

[marytk]

////… And may I add that I found this bible verse in the old testament that is too do with what iam saying, “And he shall take a wife in her virginity. A widow, or a divorced woman, or a woman who has been defiled, or a prostitute, these he shall not marry. But he shall take as his wife a virgin of his own people”
It just really confuses me that Saint paul said that widows should remarry. But should they only re-marry people who are widowers or in the case of biblical times older men that never got married ??. I…:

I just read the passage you quoted in the last week or so. That was particulary for priests. It seems they had higher or harder expectations of them.(This law came up in a novel I read decades ago. It was affecting the lives of a couple in Israel in modern times)

 

[Rence]

Well it is a Godly thing to keep your virginity ontill marriage, regardless how many women or men you date. I think if you don’t it can cause problems like emotially problems or excess baggage you give to your husband/wife.

I agree that you should keep your virginity until marriage regardless of how many persons you date…that’s why chastity is so important. It can cause a lot of problems for sure. However, if one already knows that a potential spouse has not been chaste in their past, and one just can’t get over it, then one should not marry that person in the first place. That would save everyone from all sorts of dramatics.

However, if the person has repented and is now chaste, the Church has already forgiven that person. So if one is going to marry a person who has been imprudent in their past, one should be an adult and get over it. If the Church has forgiven a person’s sins of the past, we are not entitled to continue to hold them accountable.

 

[HelenRose]

Well it is a Godly thing to keep your virginity ontill marriage, regardless how many women or men you date. I think if you don’t it can cause problems like emotially problems or excess baggage you give to your husband/wife.

I can’t argue with that and if this is terribly important to an individual; that individual has every right in the world to find a spouse that he or she can marry who has agreed to and has followed through with the same standard.

However, neither the Magisterium nor the Catechism of the Catholic Church makes such a demand.

 

[catholicsaint]

Thank you Rence, excellent answer.

Helenrose, can you please tell me what demands the catholic church makes. Since you have said they make no demands on the 2 people being virgins before they marry ?

Helenrose, all I know is maybe 2 or 3 generations ago parents demanded that young people kept there virginity ontill marriage, or they atleast strictly thaught that. And iam nearly sure that the catholic church world-wide had that princible that 2 people getting married should be virgins. Am I wrong ??

I think that ideal of 2 people being virgins is still a demand or kind of a demand.

 

[HelenRose]

Thank you Rence, excellent answer.

Helenrose, can you please tell me what demands the catholic church makes. Since you have said they make no demands on the 2 people being virgins before they marry ?

Helenrose, all I know is maybe 2 or 3 generations ago parents demanded that young people kept there virginity ontill marriage, or they atleast strictly thaught that. And iam nearly sure that the catholic church world-wide had that princible that 2 people getting married should be virgins. Am I wrong ??

I think that ideal of 2 people being virgins is still a demand or kind of a demand.

The Church teaches quite definitely that if a man or a woman who has had sex before they were married, they have committed a sin. They have sinned before God. It was wrong, wrong, wrong. Is there any other way to expressed God’s disapproval.

However, if they have repented and confessed their sin to a priest, their sins have been forgiven. If they continue to live a chaste life according to the station in life, they are free to marry without fear. And who ever marries them can marry without fear. Because God loves us so much, He forgives.

Yes, it is a sin to have sex before marriage. The Church teaches that. But thank God we can be forgiven for our sins.

Should you advise young people to not have sex before marriage? Certainly. The problems created by having sex before marriage are many.

I am not sure what you want to Church to do. Deny marriage to those who have sinned before marriage?

I worry also. I have children, grandchildren, many nieces many nephews whom I worry about because they are making terrible decisions about their lives. So I think I know where you are coming from.

But I can not demand that they change what they are doing.

I can only pray for them, and know that when they realize what they are doing, they can come to the Church and be reconciled to God.

The first and foremost commandment of the Church is Christ’s commandment: Love God with all your heart with all your soul and with all your might. The second commandment is to love your neighbor as you love yourself.

 

[Gorgias]

Gorgias, I have a question for you

Why is it the norm in society down through time and even know that men in particular don’t want children from a previous marriage?

Well, that seems like a rather broad statement; many men welcome the children that their wives had borne in a prior marriage!

However, historically, in the ancient Hebrew context, isn’t it the case that the children of the prior marriage would be inheritors of their father’s estate? More to the point, the children through whom the man (who married a widow) would consider his line to proceed would be his children with his wife, not his wife’s step-children. And, in fact, we see exactly this kind of dynamic in the Bible! I’m thinking of a wife who exhibited this kind of prejudice against children who weren’t hers: Sarah, wife of Abraham!

Would it not be better for the in-laws to look after the widow /widower since she or he is an in-law and already apart of the family of her dead husband or dead wife.

The jews had laws that stated that the women should marry the brother in-law or be looked after. So in essence is this not more respectable ?

Aah… Levirate marriage. That was meant as a solution for inheritance issues. If a woman became a widow and was without children, she would marry her husband’s brother for the sake of bearing a child with him. That child would then be considered the son of his mother’s dead husband, for the sake of keeping his line alive and getting his inheritance.

It’s important to note that this only applied if the widow had no children by her deceased husband; if she did, then it was forbidden – in the Bible! – for a man to marry his deceased brother’s widow!

Why does Saint Paul tell the widows to re-marry for ? Whats the meaning of it ?

Like I mentioned, I think that St Paul was worried about widows (especially young widows!) falling into sinful behaviors.

Why does Saint Paul not keep with jewish tradtion ?

Well, he is talking to Gentiles here, you know! So, it wouldn’t make sense to introduce the notion of widow-marrying into a culture that would see it as abhorrent…

 

[Gorgias]

Helenrose, all I know is maybe 2 or 3 generations ago parents demanded that young people kept there virginity ontill marriage, or they atleast strictly thaught that.

Well… they may have demanded it, but have young adults faithfully kept to that principle? Anyone who’s done any genealogical research can tell you that it’s not all that uncommon to see babies born 5, 6, 7 (or less!) months following a wedding. “Making an honest woman” out of one’s lover was not uncommon, historically…

 

[The_Wizard]

The Church teaches quite definitely that if a man or a woman who has had sex before they were married, they have committed a sin. They have sinned before God. It was wrong, wrong, wrong. Is there any other way to expressed God’s disapproval.

However, if they have repented and confessed their sin to a priest, their sins have been forgiven. If they continue to live a chaste life according to the station in life, they are free to marry without fear. And who ever marries them can marry without fear. Because God loves us so much, He forgives.

Yes, it is a sin to have sex before marriage. The Church teaches that. But thank God we can be forgiven for our sins.

Should you advise young people to not have sex before marriage? Certainly. The problems created by having sex before marriage are many.

I am not sure what you want to Church to do. Deny marriage to those who have sinned before marriage?

I worry also. I have children, grandchildren, many nieces many nephews whom I worry about because they are making terrible decisions about their lives. So I think I know where you are coming from.

But I can not demand that they change what they are doing.

I can only pray for them, and know that when they realize what they are doing, they can come to the Church and be reconciled to God.

The first and foremost commandment of the Church is Christ’s commandment: Love God with all your heart with all your soul and with all your might. The second commandment is to love your neighbor as you love yourself.

HelenRose, Excellent! You get an A++++++++++++

 

[deBoisvert]

CS,
The passage you have quoted from Leviticus is specific to the Kohanim.

deBoisvert

 

[dmwessel]

Hellow, I have a question regarding widow and widowers. If a husband or wife dies is the widow or widower considered a virgin again by Jesus ?. Now the reason I ask this question is that I have wondered that the widow or widower is not a virgin in both there cases and that I have allways thought that Jesus wanted men and women who are Christan to get married to pure virgins. And may I add that I found this bible verse in the old testament that is too do with what iam saying, “And he shall take a wife in her virginity. A widow, or a divorced woman, or a woman who has been defiled, or a prostitute, these he shall not marry. But he shall take as his wife a virgin of his own people”
It just really confuses me that Saint paul said that widows should remarry. But should they only re-marry people who are widowers or in the case of biblical times older men that never got married ??. It just seems to my understanding that maybe Saint Paul is saying that it does not matter if the women or men are virgins once they are widowed. Could it be because there husbands/wives are dead and maybe some sense in it that way. Sorry just it really makes me think !!. In biblical times would a man take a widow with children to be his wife ? My gut feeling says no. Would it be that most widows in biblical times would be the responsibility of both her family and her in-laws. Did Jesus approve of brother in-laws marrying there brothers wives if the brother passed away ?

It’s not literal virgins because Matt. 25 calls those people *virgins * but we know it’s referring figuratively to people that are following God’s laws (or in the case of the 5 foolish, people that think they are following them).

 

[thistle]

Rence , even if a man married a widow, he could have problems with his wife having emotional attachment to her husband that died. And if there was kids, it would be a battle because the children might not fully consider the new husband as there new father. I would imagine that it would be hard for any women or man to accept other peoples children in a marriage. It just sounds so complicated really. Maybe better if both people were widows equally with children that were getting married.

Frankly, that is nonsense.