Wierd ?praise God? I Think So!

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Rogerteder

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Ok here is the deal:D I am an avid weight lifter. I have been lifting 5 times a week for years now. I know almost everyone at my gym very well. I have been there for over ten years, and I am an outgoing person. Long story short here!!! There is a guy in my gym who is a total athiest!!! HATES RELIGION!!! He and I have argued for like 3 years about religion. When I first talked (about 3 years ago) to him he asked me about proving God’s existence. I used the miracle of the sun at Fatima (remember this is 3 years ago). My argument was basically that three children were said to recieve visions of the Blessed Mother. The Blessed Mother affirmed everything Catholic. Commanding people to recieve communion, pray the rosary, do pennance, etc. The Blessed Mother also said that there will be a sign on a particular day that will confirm her appearance and message. I then explained the miracle of the sun, and how 70, 000 people witnessed this (and went to the site because of the children’s message about the sign), and some were even athiests in the Portuguese government.
Okay, he would bring up this isue (Fatima) every now and then and we would talk about it. Of course my argument was that this miracle proves there is a God, and that Catholicism is true. Okay well two nights ago I had a dream (sware to God) that this guy converted because of Our Lady of Fatima. Today, in the gym (now just last week we argued about something about the Catholic faith) he told me he approached the Pastor of Saint Patrick’s church (Roman Catholic) about becoming a Catholic. Turns out he had been researching Fatima(based on our conversation), and that is what convinced him that God exists and the Catholic church is IT!!! His exact words to me were, “WHAT CAN I DO?? WHERE CAN I GO??? I HAVE TO BECOME A CATHOLIC?” Praise God!!! I think so!!!👍
 
Normally, I’m not supportive of using private revelation as a jumping off point for conversion, but this certainly seems to have worked!

I personally would have argued for the existence of God from reason, as St. Thomas Aquinas did. I would still recommend this sort of approach, since the solid foundation of reason is important for a solid faith.
 
Many people do not become interested in the Church through reasoning. Reasoning is good once the interest is piqued and the emotions are somewhat engaged. Jesus did not attract followers with reasoned arguementation. Teach as Jesus taught and you will be surprised at the number who will follow. Apologetics and Evangelization are not the same process. 🙂
 
rwoehmke said:
Many people do not become interested in the Church through reasoning. Reasoning is good once the interest is piqued and the emotions are somewhat engaged. Jesus did not attract followers with reasoned arguementation. Teach as Jesus taught and you will be surprised at the number who will follow. 🙂
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Modern people have abandoned essential truths, even going so far as to abandon belief in the natural law and in God, whose existence is demonstrable from reason.

When you’re dealing with people who reject something so essential, I find that recourse to Divine revelation is usually ineffective. With some people, you have to establish the basics - get their mind rolling on the right track - before you can get them to accept the truths of the faith.

With people who are open to the faith, simply preaching the incarnation, crucifixion, and resurrection is perhaps more effective.
 
Reason vs. personal revelation. The Holy Spirit obviously gave the right words for the person and the situation. Good job.
 
Before doing anything with your mouth: Pray.

Learn how to make a reasoned and charitable defense of the faith.

Learn about 5 or 6 different approaches use the approaches of Aquinas, Chesterton, Bonaventure, Newman, St. Francis, the Socratic method, whatever it takes. Prudence is the key. Saying the right thing at the right time.

Harry Crocker made a memorable statement at a lecture: “In our unreasonable day and age, you can’t get them to the reason of St. Thomas until you’ve shown them the love of St. Francis”

That’s a broad sweep since St. Francis wasn’t a dope and St. Thomas was exceedingly loving. But the point is easily understood.
 
This is an intersting thread…lots of good opinions.

We don’t “convert” people of course…omly God can; but sometimes He really does use the most unlikely tools or the means we’d least expect.

I heard a priest say (I wish I could remember his name) that, “…With the Blessed Mother, God has found a way around our free will…so to speak.” (I’m still pondering that one).
 
Rogerteder, I believe you did an excellent job of handling this! And also believe Jesus & His Mother are very proud of you! 👍
 
Fantastic story. An example of how we are given opportunities everyday to spread the Word of God to all. Our Heavenly Mother will bring many souls to Her son.

Paul
 
rwoehmke said:
Many people do not become interested in the Church through reasoning. Reasoning is good once the interest is piqued and the emotions are somewhat engaged. Jesus did not attract followers with reasoned arguementation. Teach as Jesus taught and you will be surprised at the number who will follow. Apologetics and Evangelization are not the same process. 🙂
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Oh boy is that ever a great quote. And this is a great thread.

I have nothing further at this time. 🙂
 
Rogerteder said:
Ok here is the deal:D I am an avid weight lifter. I have been lifting 5 times a week for years now. I know almost everyone at my gym very well. I have been there for over ten years, and I am an outgoing person. Long story short here!!! There is a guy in my gym who is a total athiest!!! HATES RELIGION!!! He and I have argued for like 3 years about religion. When I first talked (about 3 years ago) to him he asked me about proving God’s existence. I used the miracle of the sun at Fatima (remember this is 3 years ago). My argument was basically that three children were said to recieve visions of the Blessed Mother. The Blessed Mother affirmed everything Catholic. Commanding people to recieve communion, pray the rosary, do pennance, etc. The Blessed Mother also said that there will be a sign on a particular day that will confirm her appearance and message. I then explained the miracle of the sun, and how 70, 000 people witnessed this (and went to the site because of the children’s message about the sign), and some were even athiests in the Portuguese government.
Okay, he would bring up this isue (Fatima) every now and then and we would talk about it. Of course my argument was that this miracle proves there is a God, and that Catholicism is true. Okay well two nights ago I had a dream (sware to God) that this guy converted because of Our Lady of Fatima. Today, in the gym (now just last week we argued about something about the Catholic faith) he told me he approached the Pastor of Saint Patrick’s church (Roman Catholic) about becoming a Catholic. Turns out he had been researching Fatima(based on our conversation), and that is what convinced him that God exists and the Catholic church is IT!!! His exact words to me were, “WHAT CAN I DO?? WHERE CAN I GO??? I HAVE TO BECOME A CATHOLIC?” Praise God!!! I think so!!!👍
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That is great news. Congradulations on helping this guy see the truth. I’m curious, did you ever pray for him, or did you only argue with him?
 
How does it feel to be used by the Holy Spirit? Awesome isn’t it.

👍
Prayers & blessings
Deacon Ed B
 
Dauphin said:
Normally, I’m not supportive of using private revelation as a jumping off point for conversion, but this certainly seems to have worked!

I personally would have argued for the existence of God from reason, as St. Thomas Aquinas did. I would still recommend this sort of approach, since the solid foundation of reason is important for a solid faith.
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**I doubt that the 5.5 million Aztecs who converted from a blood-laden paganism to Catholic Christianity used reason when they came upon Our Lady of Guadalupe. Millions were converted within just a few years. I guess you might need to rethink the graces inherent in private revelation? 😉 **
 
peary1 said:
**I doubt that the 5.5 million Aztecs who converted from a blood-laden paganism to Catholic Christianity used reason when they came upon Our Lady of Guadalupe. Millions were converted within just a few years. I guess you might need to rethink the graces inherent in private revelation? 😉 **
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Yeah, but the Aztecs probably had a lot more common sense than modern man. 😛
 
That’s wonderful news! Thank you for sharing the story - very heartening to hear 🙂
 
Dauphin said:
Yeah, but the Aztecs probably had a lot more common sense than modern man. 😛
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ha…so true because at least they were sure that some divine being existed…i guess when they heard what the true God could do…it was better than their gods:p
 
Rogerteder said:
He and I have argued for like 3 years about religion.
…Today, in the gym (now just last week we argued about something about the Catholic faith) he told me he approached the Pastor of Saint Patrick’s church (Roman Catholic) about becoming a Catholic.
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God bless you for your steadfastness. A lot of people would have given up on him long ago.
Rogerteder said:
Praise God!!! I think so!!!👍
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Praise God and honor to His faithful servants.
 
Rogerteder said:
…
Of course my argument was that this miracle proves there is a God, and that Catholicism is true. Okay well two nights ago I had a dream (sware to God) that this guy converted because of Our Lady of Fatima. Today, in the gym (now just last week we argued about something about the Catholic faith) he told me he approached the Pastor of Saint Patrick’s church (Roman Catholic) about becoming a Catholic. Turns out he had been researching Fatima(based on our conversation), and that is what convinced him that God exists and the Catholic church is IT!!! His exact words to me were, “WHAT CAN I DO?? WHERE CAN I GO??? I HAVE TO BECOME A CATHOLIC?” Praise God!!! I think so!!!👍
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wow! Praise God!
 
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