Wife wants to reconcile....BUT

[Pug]

YinYangMom:

The only information we have is that she hit him with a pan and served four months in jail as a result…[cut]…I stated correctly the church’s teaching that he does not have to live with her, but he will always be married to her,

What are the express rules that say this particular man does not have to live with his wife? I understand that he might not have to, but that he himself actually does not have to seems indeterminate. He did not state that he finds her to be a current threat to anyone. His stated concern is more along the lines of he would rather do something else instead of sit around trying to reconcile with her.

I’d think a person could join the marines and still keep a sufficiently common household. If that is to happen, a delay in joining up might be needed.

 

[cynic]

YinYangMom:

Chill.
I didn’t scold anyone.

You are presuming this is a violent woman with serious mental problems.

Nowhere in the OPs post did he indicate this.

The only information we have is that she hit him with a pan and served four months in jail as a result.

He did not provide any details as to what led her to go at him with a pan.

Considering no one just whacks someone on the head with a pan without provocation, it is safe to assume two people were engaged in some sort of heated exchange leading up to said event, which makes both parties culpable. I am not saying he deserved it. I am saying he participated in the exchange which led to it. He could have, and most likely should have, walked away and counted to ten way before then, as she should have as well. Apparently, neither did.

.

The only justification for that type of assault is in self defence. It doesn’t matter if they were having an argument, what was said etc, and serving 4 months in jail means it probably was not in self defence. What would you say if a man hit a woman with a frying pan? Disgusting thought isn’t it?

From what he said she sounds like a dangerous narcisist, but then again that could be bias on the OP part…

 

[rayne89]

BioCatholic:

actually my wife and i arent in love anymore. basically we hate each other. she klinked me with a frying pan, and it landed her in jail. albeit i helped put her there, where she stayed for 4 months until her sentence was commuted.

she has since made my life a living hell. i can honestly say that if she left the planet (or even the continent) my life would be sooooo much better.

i have getogethers at my house of my police, paramedic, and classmate frriends. and most of them are there to avoid being at home with their wives. oftentimes, ill let one or more guys stay over because they just dont want to go home. im the guy with a house all his own now.

i dont think i know a man who, when talking to me honestly, says he is happy in his marriage. i sure know for a while that i pretended to be happy and just did what she said and wanted to keep her quiet and off my back.

i cant fathom the fact after 8 years you are still that happy. after a couple of years for me, i dreaded going home. i know the church’s teaching on divorce, but id positively rather go through life single than spend another 50 years with that woman. and she feels exactly the same way.

The above is from and August 27th post from the OP

 

[rayne89]

BioCatholic:

there isnt a thing in thie universe that can save my marriage. while i dont know if she will file for divorce, i know for sure she will never come home.

and i really dont care if she does. i am really enjoying my alone time now. i can now focus on defending my Master’s thesis, work extra paramedic shifts, and hangout with all my friends anytime i want.

my house has become the sanctuary for my buddies. what most men tell their wives, and what they really think is night and day. [in my experience].

if for one day, men said what was really on their mind, and gave completely honest answers to women and their wives, the world would self-destruct. divorce rates would skyrocket, and woman-to-man domestic violence would increase exponentially.

from the guys i know that have divorced, probably the most common factor that started the divorce was, “I started saying what was really on my mind”. “I stopped doing what she said or told me”. “i didnt let her walk over me anymore”.

i ask some other married guys why they put up with the antics of their wife, and they tell me “because she wont have sex with me otherwise”. alot of men will please their wife just so the wife will stay happy and want to have sex.

all i know is that i am counting my blessings that that woman is gone from my home. God works in mysterious ways, and this might just be one of them as far as i am concerned.

August 29th -the above posts kind of give an idea of what the OP’s feelings on marriage are.

 

[Lisa4Catholics]

rayne89:

August 29th -the above posts kind of give an idea of what the OP’s feelings on marriage are.

Good grief!:nope: Heaven help us! I am begining to wonder whether there will be a rash of divorces amongst his friends:ehh: I am sorry but from the comments he has made I have a hard time believing he ever wanted to be married:nope: I do not condone violence, but the 2 posts shown makes me wonder if the wife snapped from emotional abuse? I love my husband but he is an addict and if he is using he will bombard with hateful language and cut me to the core with words, did I clobber him?No! But I can honestly say I would rather be hit myself.

 

[bear06]

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=66816

More background info on the OP’s situation.

Thanks for the info. We, still, however are only getting one side of the story. The whack in the head may or may not have been a reaction to something that happened in a previous fight.

That said, from the info BC gave in that thread, it sounds as if he was baiting. We, as spouses, are supposed to be concerned for the welfare of our spouses souls and baiting someone isn’t doing that.

BC, it sounds like before you can be any good to a wife or the Corp, you might want to get some counseling from a priest. I doubt a life of adventure is going to give you what you are looking for and maybe a life with your wife won’t either but you’ve got to go back to the vows you made. What’s the saying? A man is only as good as his word. Yes, your wife may have blown it but that doesn’t give you permission to do so too.

 

[kev7]

Well… there is no reason for your wife hitting you over the head. Violence is wrong and she paid for it in jail.

What you have to ask yourself is this… Is this woman going to learn to be a more faithful catholic? Has she set herself right with God after this? Have you done the same for that matter?

Before I would make any choice here I would first try to do what God wants. Go to church together and pray together about this.

You can read all manner of books and seek all manner of counseling… but the fact will remain. If you can’t pray together you will always be lost.

If you can’t pray together and both ask God for help then you won’t have much of a marriage even if you do join the military.

Just don’t join the army for the sake of getting away from your wife. There are many married people who are in the military. There is no reason to assume that you can’t provide for your family by way of the military.

But just understand, what God wants and what you want are often two different things. What God wants is most likely not what your wife wants either. Which is why you both have to pray about it all.

 

[kev7]

Della:

Ah, but WHY did she do that? What prompted it? We don’t know. She may have had good reason for all we know, meaning no offense to you, BC.

Also, and much more importantly, BC, you sound like child running off to join the circus instead of a man ready to serve his country through the good times and the bad. Are you sure you didn’t go into your marriage with the same attitude? With a fantasy in your head that couldn’t really exist? I think you need some good counseling before making any more commitments. And I think your dad is just projecting onto you what he would like not what is necessarily right for you, not that he has any bad intentions. It is typical of many parents that they think they can bale their kids out of unpleasant circumstances by getting them to fulfill their dreams in their place. You can’t do that. You have a wife and your own life to live. Don’t run after whatever pleases you but suck it up and do what needs to be done first. Then indulge yourself after.

From your post I think you are the one that needs counseling.

There is no reason for hitting someone over the head with an object. This woman even went to jail for it and rightfully so.

The military IS a valid career option. In fact the military does a lot to make sure that their people are well taken care off. A career in the military can be far more enduring then a corporate one. So I wouldn’t call it an indulgence.

We should also understand that the military might make a man out of this guy.

 

[axolotl]

rayne89:

August 29th -the above posts kind of give an idea of what the OP’s feelings on marriage are.

This is the post that I think of when I see BioCatholic

how is that grounds for anullment? while i FULLY understand that something like that can hurt, doesnt one and forsake all others from that point on? i.e taking a vow before God at the ceremony. as a corrolary, if one has not sacrementally forsaken all others, isnt seeing other people fair game?

otherwise an engaged couple would be considered “married”, and any infidelity would be considered “adultery”. which we all know is NOT the case. as far as i know, seeing other people during the engagement isnt a “sin” so to speak? there is no sacremental committment in an engagement, so isnt seeing other people “out of bounds” for the other party to have a say in?

i did it. my older brother did it. my youngest brother periodically has a girlfreind on the side apart from the fiancee. i guess our reasoning was that if we werent committed in front of God and married, then some harmless dating on the side was OK.

i mean, if the Catholic church is dead set on “protecting” marriage, why are they assigning “adultery” or “infidelity” grounds for anullment to situations that occurred BEFORE the couple had all the rights and priviledges bestowed by marriage? i.e. adultery and such? why are they teaching that only married couples can have married priviledges, but then handing out anullments for breaking a non-existant marital bond that they are trying to “protect”?

i understand that “committment to being faithful” is part of the deal. but cant one be fully committed AFTER the marriage has taken place. like me. not once have i ever touched another woman since the wedding. beforehand is a different story. afterwards, an emphatic NO.

as well as this one

i dated other women while i was dating and engaged because i could. i was taught that marriage means marriage when you are married, and up until that point you arent entitled to the rights and responsibilities. my dad told me the day before my wedding “if you arent sure or you want out, we will make it right for you and support you”. it was also encouraged by the fact that she decided on a “no sex” period before the wedding. [please understand these were days before i have made my attempt to hang out with God again].

i figured if she had the right to refuse, i had the right to go elsewhere because neither of us were married yet.

i still cover for my youngest brother with his fiancee from time to time. it is so obvious that if she cant see it, wow. but i told him dont expect me to hem and haw after he is married. its his problem then.

what it comes down to is that if you look at me and my oldest bro, neither of us have cheated on our wives. fiancees, yes, wives, no. there is no “vow” you take while you are engaged to “forsake” all others, so we just assumed that all is fair. however, we take the marriage vows very seriously, and dont plan on breaking them because we gave our word before God. you just dont do that with engagement.

I think both BioCatholic and his wife need some serious counseling, together and separate, as well as some maturing.

 

[Benedictus]

YinYangMom:

You are presuming this is a violent woman with serious mental problems.

I would think that the frying pan to the head might possibly indicate that, somehow, she could have the potential to be somewhat violent.

 

[AmISearching]

vluvski:

The Marines will always be there for you to join, but you may not get another chance to reconcile with your wife.

I don’t disagree with the POINT of what you are saying - but I did have to chime in and say that the Marines will not always be there for him to join - depending on his age - the Marines have the youngest cutoff for joining (if I remember correctly - I’m an AF brat myself), and - at severaly times in the last few years, the military has had to become more strict about their requirements for joining because they had so many more interested than they had positions for (well at least for the AF and I believe for the Navy and the Marines too - the Army has always been the branch that has had the most trouble getting recruits). Joining the military is not just something someone can decide on their own to do - the military has to accept them, and its not a “right” to serve in the military.

That doesn’t mean that his relationship with God and with his wife does not need to be considered first - just that one can’t “put off” joining the military indefinately without risking the fact that they might not be able to join later…

 

[shannin]

BioCatholic:

so after 4 weeks in Louisiana and the Mississippi gulf Coast as both a police officer and paramedic aiding the local and federal detatchments, i found myself realizing that i deep down really want to join the Marines like my dad did, and my 2 brothers.
i always understood the bonds you make in situations like that, as well as in daily life as a medic/cop are stronger than any other at all. but my brothers and dad always told me that serving in the marines goes far beyond that, where you gain hundreds of thousands of brothers and sisters.
the guys i was with, and the things we saw, i have never felt closer to anyone in my entire life. i really want to join as an officer, and serve in Iraq with my brothers.
HOWEVER, the wife of mine who clobbered my with a frying pan and subsequently spent 4 months in jail now has found it in her heart to “forgive” ME, and wants to try reconciling. i am actually not all for it, and have the chance to start Officer Canidate School with the Marines in 2 weeks now that i finished my Master’s over the summer.
i really dont want to sit around anymore, especially trying to work things out with that woman while i could be really making a difference.
why should i be the one to wait around when shes the one who wants to reconcile? what is more important? one single marriage, or getting out there and really making a difference? i feel that my marriage isnt as important as serving the country and humanity.
i actually had the time of my life in the hurricane areas. i never have felt more alive, especially in the first days in New Orleans and Biloxi when the situation was really really dangerous. i totally loved going on patrols at night, and doing search and rescue. isnt it a stupid idea to try and reconcile a marriage when what i want to do is so dangerous?
if i dont go and do what i want to, ill spend the rest of my life regretting and resenting that i didnt. even though we are still married, the Marines said they dont need my wife’s consent for me to join.
my dad is ecstatic that i want to become a marine, but my mom is off the wall mad that i am going to leave my wife behind. ive never had a split decision reaction like that from them before, so im a little confused…

I say join the Marines. If your wife sincerely wants to work things out, she will come with you. However, clobbering someone over the head with a frying pan is physical abuse and no one should have to put up with that. It sounds to me as though she has anger management problems and may need help.

 

[YinYangMom]

Benedictus:

I would think that the frying pan to the head might possibly indicate that, somehow, she could have the potential to be somewhat violent.

I can assure you **every **human has the potential to be somewhat violent under certain circumstances.

This was one incident.
We can not infer from that it has been an ongoing problem.

 

[YinYangMom]

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=66816

More background info on the OP’s situation.

Thank you for the background.

As you can see from this thread, much of that was not evident here, I’ll now have to read through that thread to see if my position changes any.

 

[YinYangMom]

Pug:

What are the express rules that say this particular man does not have to live with his wife? I understand that he might not have to, but that he himself actually does not have to seems indeterminate. He did not state that he finds her to be a current threat to anyone. His stated concern is more along the lines of he would rather do something else instead of sit around trying to reconcile with her.

I’d think a person could join the marines and still keep a sufficiently common household. If that is to happen, a delay in joining up might be needed.

It has to do with personal injury to the person or the children - that encompasses emotional abuse as well as physical. The church does not say you have to remain in physical proximity to your spouse if they are dangerous to you or your children. This would be particularly true when the party doing the injuring is in denial about their problem and refuses to seek treatment/help.

So while the person can live separate from the abusive spouse, and should they civilly divorce the person, they are still married in the eyes of the church and cannot enter into another relationship. Also, should the abusive spouse finally come out of denial and seek the therapy he/she needs, then the separated spouse does have an obligation to work on the marriage again through said therapy. He/she is not free to just walk away because the trust is broken. Trust can be reestablished with help. It has happened numerous times in various situations ranging from infidelity to alcoholism. The entire Old Testament is about trust being established, broken, reestablished, broken, and finally fulfilled in Jesus Christ - and yet, we continue to break our trust with Him through our actions.

Marriage is not a guarantee for happiness.
It certainly can lead to a live of happiness, but it always takes work to maintain that energy, that desire, that committment.
Best to be very, very certain about the other person before giving one’s “I Do”.

And I agree with you, in this particular thread, there was no indication she was a consistent threat so the pan incident alone wouldn’t give him license to live separately from her for the rest of their marriage, but I was allowing for the possibility that it is an ongoing problem, and had that been the case then he’d be free to move out. But not free to divorce or move on with someone else.

 

[YinYangMom]

rayne89:

The above is from and August 27th post from the OP

So why did he select her for marriage in the first place then?
Why did he expect to be happy the entire time?
Why did he expect marriage to be easy?
Why did he bother marrying in the church if he didn’t plan to remain married to this woman for the rest of his days?

Don’t answer those, they just are the thoughts which come to mind after reading his post.

It indicates to me this man is selfish.
It indicates to me this woman is selfish.
It indicates to me this marriage probably qualifies for an annulment.

 

[shannin]

I’d be interested to know both of their intentions at the time the matrimonial sacrament took place. It could be that this is not a valid marriage in the eyes of the Church. He needs to talk to a priest.

My understanding is that the Church does not expect anyone to put up with physical or emotional abuse. As to whether this was a valid sacrament, he needs to speak with a priest.

 

[iamrefreshed]

I read about your story on your other thread Bio.

If it’s true, which I doubt, you need to seek serious psychological help before attempting reconciliation or the Marines.

You put your wife in prison out of anger, vengence and vanity.

If you can be cured, I would like to hope you and your wife can reconcile.

If you don’t seek treatment, do her the favor and run to the Marines. She would be better off.

What a petulant and selfish man-child you are!

Forgive my harsh words but you need them.

 

[mschoir01]

Have you gotten to know any veterans of the kind of combat you may be facing? As a Vietnam era veteran’s wife, I believe you should find the newest and the oldest veterans of foreign conflict you can find and talk to them before you decide to enlist. No relatives - they are too close. Do some reading up on the effect of war on the lives of soldiers, particularly the marines, and their families. War is a life altering and potentially life ending situation and should be entered into seriously. What it is not is a grand adventure to some hyper-masculine world where the losers end up maimed or dead.

Go speak to the veterans at your local VA hospital and see how they are treated and what kind of care they receive. It’s not like on TV. Our young soldiers that have the misfortune to be injured may receive great care in the field, but their lives change drastically once they are home.

Think carefully about this decision. Pray for God’s will in your life. There’s a war on. The fighters of it and their families will be paying the price for it for the rest of their lives.