Wife with Vaginismus / Unconsummated Marriage

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Thanks.

True, she has never been diagnosed with vaginismus and I am not a doctor. But, trying to seek information online this was my conclusion. To answer your questions:

• she has never had a pelvic exam
• she has never been able to use tampons
• it’s been too painful for her to get anywhere near penetration
• we did speak about sex before we got married and she did hint that there may be some difficulty but I didn’t realise that it could be so long term
• yes, she is a virgin too
• she tells me there was no abuse in the past

In the past, I have thought that I need to make a decision whether to stay or leave. I don’t want to leave so I guess I’ve made my decision. However, I guess I’m still thinking about it and that’s why I made my original post. I think too that I expected those teenage urges to go away as I got older but that hasn’t happened at all. And, it’s not easy when there is so much talk of sex in the general media. Sometimes I fell like the only person in the world in my situation. Of course I know that is not true!

Again, I’d like to thank everybody who has posted responses and to those who have said a prayer for us. I really do appreciate it.

Your wife has something wrong with her. Seek medical help. Why have you not done this for your beloved. Something could be life threatening.

 

[pianistclare]

Eight years. One doctor. No pelvic exam. An apparent unwillingness to try harder to please her husband. This speaks to me of psychological and spiritual issues that are far deeper than the physical issue. The OP is to be commended for wanting to stay with his wife, but there is no question he is being disrespected by her and has been all along. He should have put his foot down long ago: his wife needs to get a thorough examination from a qualified gynecologist. If she has psychological issues as well, get counseling. Doing nothing means getting more of what he’s been getting. Not a good place to be.

Let this be an example for those who believe in waiting for marriage to have sex: there needs to be more disclosure than was given to the OP. A “hint” is not enough. Got to run those hints down. If a prospective spouse isn’t willing to open up, that’s an indication that maybe one should have second thoughts about marriage to that person.

I was going to say all this…but didn’t want to hurt the OP. But, in hindsight…it needs to be said.
I wonder what she is like otherwise? Has she got other hang-ups?
She needs counseling and a thorough medical work up. NOW.

 

[pianistclare]

Your wife has something wrong with her. Seek medical help. Why have you not done this for your beloved. Something could be life threatening.

NEVER DIAGNOSED? then what’s up with this thread title?
What’s going on here???

 

[Zzyzx_Road]

I was going to say all this…but didn’t want to hurt the OP.

If we were talking 3 or 4 months into the marriage, sure I’m with you, take it easy, soft words are fine. But no, it’s been 8 years of very little action on her part, it is long since time for more blunt language. Will say further that it sounds like the OP walks on eggshells around his wife on this topic. Sure a man’s libido lessens when he hits his 40’s, but the OP sure did not sign up for no sex at all.

 

[Falco]

Besides vaginismus, it could be an imperforate hymen (unusually thick and large maidenhead that resists penetration), lichen sclerosis atrophicus,or lichen planus which stop the skin from stretching, or something as simple as she is very petite and you are superendowed - an incompatabity of sizes. Use a lubricant - it makes a heap of difference.

If your wife has resisted finding a solution to her problem, don’t expect her to take to an active sex life once a solution is found. I think she just doesn’t like the idea of sex - either the act itself, or the result - children. I suspect there will always be problems of some sort with her.

Consummation is needed for a marriage to be valid. If a couple are known, before the wedding, to be incapable of having sex, the church will refuse to marry them. You may, however, be allowed to marry if you are capable of sex, but choose not to, for a mutually agreed period of time (a Josephite marriage). However, when one of the partners then chooses to have sex, sex must be undertaken. You cannot have a marriage without sex. Rules of the church you belong to. So, you are entitled to a divorce if you want one, and then apply for an annulment, which you will be granted no problems.

So, if you want a life which includes a sex life, and children, you could consider that divorce and annulment. If you love your wife more than sex and children, you stay with her and you both stay virgin.

 

[fpt]

Is she ready to assume the normal pains linked to the loss of her virginity, intellectually speaking, morally speaking, emotionally speaking, and mentally speaking?

Is he ready to assume his role of conjugal lover, intellectually speaking, morally speaking, emotionally speaking, and mentally speaking, via the practice of foreplay and of sexual foreplay on her body, in love and in the tenderness?

Is* he* ready for a long session of the conjugal act? Is she ready for a long session of the conjugal act? Take time, a long session is helpful.

Sorry, sorry and so sorry for the use of words " the loss of her virginity ". After a reflexion, I regret those words, because, in my humble opinion, they are linked to a negative aspect. The fact of giving her virginity, of offering her virginity and of donating her virginity to her husband are good words.

I rephrase: " Is she ready to assume the normal pains linked to the donation of her virginity to her husband, intellectually speaking, morally speaking, emotionally speaking, and mentally speaking? "
The fact of giving her virginity, of offering her virginity and of donating her virginity, and the fact of receiving her virginity are wonderful presents.*

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

NEVER DIAGNOSED? then what’s up with this thread title?
What’s going on here???

The OP looked up the Vaginismus on the web. According to the web I have ovarian cancer, scurvy, AIDS, Ebola and the black death.

The OP needs to set his frustrations aside and help his spouse get medical and mental attention. This is his duty as her husband, and surly his duty before he whines about her not being able to perform her duty…

 

[jimmy]

I would look into the divorce. She should have been perfectly clear when you got married that there would be no sex. This whole idea disgusts me.

 

[DarkLight]

I would look into the divorce. She should have been perfectly clear when you got married that there would be no sex. This whole idea disgusts me.

I’m really not sure where people are getting this idea.

With the symptoms described, the only way to know you can’t have sex is to attempt to have sex. I don’t see any reason to believe that the wife did not intend to have sex ever.

 

[jimmy]

I’m really not sure where people are getting this idea.

With the symptoms described, the only way to know you can’t have sex is to attempt to have sex. I don’t see any reason to believe that the wife did not intend to have sex ever.

He says there was a hint before they got married that there might be a problem. Which implies that it was a very vague hint that he might not even have thought of or considered until he was neck deep in this ****** situation.

 

[DarkLight]

He says there was a hint before they got married that there might be a problem. Which implies that it was a very vague hint that he might not even have thought of or considered until he was neck deep in this ****** situation.

I read that more as, the wife knew there were some issues, but didn’t really expect it to be this much of a problem - she very likely thought it was something they could push through together. Women don’t by and large get married with no intention of having sex ever. Women who want to stay virgins just don’t get married.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

He says there was a hint before they got married that there might be a problem. Which implies that it was a very vague hint that he might not even have thought of or considered until he was neck deep in this ****** situation.

There are lots of things I did not think of or consider about my spouse and sex before we got married. The OP is frustrated and apparently has not had a real conversation about this with his wife in 8 years. He has not taken what could be a scared woman in for a doctor exam in the area of pain, he has not said what his wife says about her feeling of obligation (or not to him) All we have is an OP who is frustrated with a lack of sex and has googled the cause, and considered prostitution as an answer. I think all of this jumping down the wife’s throat is a little presumptuous.

 

[jimmy]

There are lots of things I did not think of or consider about my spouse and sex before we got married. The OP is frustrated and apparently has not had a real conversation about this with his wife in 8 years. He has not taken what could be a scared woman in for a doctor exam in the area of pain, he has not said what his wife says about her feeling of obligation (or not to him) All we have is an OP who is frustrated with a lack of sex and has googled the cause, and considered prostitution as an answer. I think all of this jumping down the wife’s throat is a little presumptuous.

What straight man wouldn’t be frustrated? The man holds off till marriage only to find out that it isn’t going to happen even after marriage. It really gives the meatloaf song some meaning. So now he’s praying for the end of time. The only way this marriage can ever work out is if she actually goes and gets help, which it seems is unlikely. She doesn’t want help; she has only been to the doctor once. If she is unwilling to get help then he should get out and look for a real marriage with a woman who actually wants a sexual relationship.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

What straight man wouldn’t be frustrated? The man holds off till marriage only to find out that it isn’t going to happen even after marriage. It really gives the meatloaf song some meaning. So now he’s praying for the end of time. The only way this marriage can ever work out is if she actually goes and gets help, which it seems is unlikely. She doesn’t want help; she has only been to the doctor once. If she is unwilling to get help then he should get out and look for a real marriage with a woman who actually wants a sexual relationship.

I don’t know what gay or strait has to do with it.

But why not equalize your compassion on someone who may have a serious or life threatening medical condition. 40 and never had a pelvic exam? Something is not right. But condemn her at the altar of his libido if you will…

 

[Lookingforjoy]

What straight man wouldn’t be frustrated? The man holds off till marriage only to find out that it isn’t going to happen even after marriage. It really gives the meatloaf song some meaning. So now he’s praying for the end of time. The only way this marriage can ever work out is if she actually goes and gets help, which it seems is unlikely. She doesn’t want help; she has only been to the doctor once. If she is unwilling to get help then he should get out and look for a real marriage with a woman who actually wants a sexual relationship.

We don’t even know what the doctor told her at that first visit. Perhaps she told her that she has an incurable condition. And we also don’t know if the OP has fully expressed how much ts means to him. While I agree that she should go and get help, the OP should come at it from a place of love and concern for her well-being.

 

[pensmama87]

What straight man wouldn’t be frustrated? The man holds off till marriage only to find out that it isn’t going to happen even after marriage. It really gives the meatloaf song some meaning. So now he’s praying for the end of time. The only way this marriage can ever work out is if she actually goes and gets help, which it seems is unlikely. She doesn’t want help; she has only been to the doctor once. If she is unwilling to get help then he should get out and look for a real marriage with a woman who actually wants a sexual relationship.

She might also not realize that help is possible. She may have given up. She may be so terrified of the pain she’d rather chance getting a serious illness including cancer than be subject to an exam.

As another posted noted earlier in the thread, treatment options for pelvic pain have expanded recently and providers in general are becoming more sympathetic. A lot of women have horror stories about visiting the gynecologist (the history of the field isn’t exactly stellar, unfortunately.) I could easily see the OP’s wife visiting a not-so-hot doctor who dismisses her pain, shames her, or subjects her to unnecessary pain, and that being it for her.

It’s absolutely true that there is some serious problem in the marriage regardless - that this issue would go basically undiscussed. I advised marital counseling in my initial post and I think it’ would be beneficial to both spouses. I don’t think we can just assume that she doesn’t care about the suffering her husband is undergoing. It may be that she tries not to care, but doesn’t know what else to do. Her husband doesn’t seem to be able to discuss it with her, and based on the info from the OP I don’t think we can definitively lay all the blame for that on the wife (and blaming generally doesn’t help fix problems, anyway.)

If the OP cares about his wife, I would suggest he get them into marital counseling pronto, and work on a way with communicating his concerns not only about their sex life but also his wife’s health.

 

[jimmy]

I don’t know what gay or strait has to do with it.

But why not equalize your compassion on someone who may have a serious or life threatening medical condition. 40 and never had a pelvic exam? Something is not right. But condemn her at the altar of his libido if you will…

Gay or straight has nothing to do with it other than the fact that he is straight and she is his wife whom he expected to be having sex with. That might not be so frustrating for a gay guy but as I said what straight guy wouldn’t be frustrated. They have been married 8 years and haven’t had sex. She has been to the doctor once about it in an 8 year period. And you condemn him because he hasn’t gotten her help. She isn’t a child who can be forced to go to the doctor; she is an adult woman who apparently, from all the evidence has no interest in getting things fixed and having a normal relationship.

As long as she is unwilling to get help it is her fault. The fact that he is here with a diagnosis that he had to get off the internet shows that the doctor didn’t give her an incurable diagnosis, unless she lied to him and told him there was no diagnosis. You guys would have him wait until he dies with a woman who is unwilling to try.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Gay or straight has nothing to do with it other than the fact that he is straight and she is his wife whom he expected to be having sex with. That might not be so frustrating for a gay guy but as I said what straight guy wouldn’t be frustrated. They have been married 8 years and haven’t had sex. She has been to the doctor once about it in an 8 year period. And you condemn him because he hasn’t gotten her help. She isn’t a child who can be forced to go to the doctor; she is an adult woman who apparently, from all the evidence has no interest in getting things fixed and having a normal relationship.

As long as she is unwilling to get help it is her fault. The fact that he is here with a diagnosis that he had to get off the internet shows that the doctor didn’t give her an incurable diagnosis, unless she lied to him and told him there was no diagnosis. You guys would have him wait until he dies with a woman who is unwilling to try.

Bringing gay and strait into it is odd., But if you must, actually, a gay man, as a Catholic, would have a lifetime of sexual frustration as well…

I am alarmed by your quick condemnation of her given that you only have a guy on the boards complaining about sex. Do you care nothing for her? For her health and happiness and holiness. Perhaps not, perhaps that is the job of her husband. Your first step is to call Saul and get a divorce. What this person needs is encouragement to stay faithful, encouragement for him to seek marriage counseling and for her to seek it as well as medical treatment for something that could kill her, or at least damage her entire life and marriage.

it is a trend on these boards to blame one sex or the other when you only know one side, all the women do it, and the men as well. It is neither logical nor Holy empathy that drives such leaps.

 

[DarkLight]

She might also not realize that help is possible. She may have given up. She may be so terrified of the pain she’d rather chance getting a serious illness including cancer than be subject to an exam.

As another posted noted earlier in the thread, treatment options for pelvic pain have expanded recently and providers in general are becoming more sympathetic. A lot of women have horror stories about visiting the gynecologist (the history of the field isn’t exactly stellar, unfortunately.) I could easily see the OP’s wife visiting a not-so-hot doctor who dismisses her pain, shames her, or subjects her to unnecessary pain, and that being it for her.

It’s absolutely true that there is some serious problem in the marriage regardless - that this issue would go basically undiscussed. I advised marital counseling in my initial post and I think it’ would be beneficial to both spouses. I don’t think we can just assume that she doesn’t care about the suffering her husband is undergoing. It may be that she tries not to care, but doesn’t know what else to do. Her husband doesn’t seem to be able to discuss it with her, and based on the info from the OP I don’t think we can definitively lay all the blame for that on the wife (and blaming generally doesn’t help fix problems, anyway.)

If the OP cares about his wife, I would suggest he get them into marital counseling pronto, and work on a way with communicating his concerns not only about their sex life but also his wife’s health.

I may not be married, but as someone who’s had to deal with certain pain problems with women’s health, doctors can be very difficult. Unfortunately I’ve had experiences of basically just being treated like I was lying, even pushed through an incredibly painful exam while I was crying (I couldn’t get my breath together long enough to say stop) and then basically dismissed when I complained about the pain like I was just oversensitive. The pain persisted for some time, too. Needless to say it put me off getting that done again!

Such things are unfortunately far more common than they ought to be - an amazing number of doctors seem to confuse “shouldn’t hurt” with “doesn’t hurt.” And it just ends up adding shame to an already painful condition.

 

[jimmy]

Bringing gay and strait into it is odd., But if you must, actually, a gay man, as a Catholic, would have a lifetime of sexual frustration as well…

I am alarmed by your quick condemnation of her given that you only have a guy on the boards complaining about sex. Do you care nothing for her? For her health and happiness and holiness. Perhaps not, perhaps that is the job of her husband. Your first step is to call Saul and get a divorce. What this person needs is encouragement to stay faithful, encouragement for him to seek marriage counseling and for her to seek it as well as medical treatment for something that could kill her, or at least damage her entire life and marriage.

it is a trend on these boards to blame one sex or the other when you only know one side, all the women do it, and the men as well. It is neither logical nor Holy empathy that drives such leaps.

Encourage him to stay faithful to what? There is no sexual relationship between them, and it seems that there is no hope for one. In the last 3000 days they have been married she went to the doctor on one of those days. I highly doubt she has any intent of getting help. She has no right to hold him hostage based on something she is unwilling to put even the slightest effort into.

We can only use the evidence we have and the evidence says she won’t go get help and he didn’t know that he would never have sex. if that’s what the evidence says then that is the conclusion we must make. It isn’t right to assume he is lying or deceiving us. If he is lying then this whole thread is meaningless except as a moral exercise.

The only advice you guys have is that he should be nice. That is what it amounts to.