Will souls with luke warm faith enter heaven

[Sheryl_Ann]

I know many Catholics and non Catholics that do believe in God and Jesus, but they attend mass or services infrequently and engage in actions that we consider sins like fornication, missing mass on Sunday, using birth control, just to mention a few. These people are good and loving friends and family. Many of them would do anything for you. These people do believe Jesus is Gods son and has died for our sins. Will these people go to hell because of these sins? I think they have just fallen into society’s ideas of right and wrong. Some of them have a hard time ( and justifiably so) listening to the church preaching what they do not practice as far as sexual morals, i.e. Priest sex scandal, I would feel terrible if I knew they were going to hell. What do you all think?

 

[Churchman25]

It depends on whether they know what they are doing is wrong. For example if they are fornicating but dont really think that it is morrally unacceptable to do so then then I doubt they are actually commiting grave sins it still sin probably vienal. Also If they are not catholics they should not be recieving or going through the motions but whether or not thats sin I don’t know because they are not Catholic. The ones that are Catholic though should be instructed that they have to attend every mass and holy day, because all this could be is a lack of knowledge regarding the Catholic faith.

 

[Joe_5859]

I know many Catholics and non Catholics that do believe in God and Jesus, but they attend mass or services infrequently and engage in actions that we consider sins like fornication, missing mass on Sunday, using birth control, just to mention a few. These people are good and loving friends and family. Many of them would do anything for you. These people do believe Jesus is Gods son and has died for our sins. Will these people go to hell because of these sins? I think they have just fallen into society’s ideas of right and wrong. Some of them have a hard time ( and justifiably so) listening to the church preaching what they do not practice as far as sexual morals, i.e. Priest sex scandal, I would feel terrible if I knew they were going to hell. What do you all think?

I think that Jesus is the judge of their souls, not me. We can’t know with absolute certainty that an individual is going to wind up in hell.

We can know with certainty that certain actions are sinful. So we need to pray for others. I know that I’m a sinner in need of mercy, and I pray for mercy to be shown others. How that will all work on Judgment Day is (thankfully) something I don’t need to know.

Conversion is a process—and slower for some than for others. While we certainly want to avoid a lax view of just leaving everyone to their sins, we also do not want to come across as the self-righteous, judgmental Christian. That generally only drives people away. We need to love the people God puts in our lives and be a strong witness to the faith to them explaining to the best of our ability the truth and beauty of Catholic teaching when those opportunities arise. And we entrust the whole endeavor to the work of the Holy Spirit.

 

[PJM]

I know many Catholics and non Catholics that do believe in God and Jesus, but they attend mass or services infrequently and engage in actions that we consider sins like fornication, missing mass on Sunday, using birth control, just to mention a few. These people are good and loving friends and family. Many of them would do anything for you. These people do believe Jesus is Gods son and has died for our sins. Will these people go to hell because of these sins? I think they have just fallen into society’s ideas of right and wrong. Some of them have a hard time ( and justifiably so) listening to the church preaching what they do not practice as far as sexual morals, i.e. Priest sex scandal, I would feel terrible if I knew they were going to hell. What do you all think?

"But because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold, nor hot, I will begin to vomit thee out of my mouth."Revelation) 3:16]

Eph.1:4 “even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world,** that we should be holy and blameless before him”**

Matt.5: 48 “You, therefore, must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect”
“ Matt.19: 17 “And he said to him, "Why do you ask me about what is good? One there is who is good. If you would enter life, keep the commandments."
Jas.2: [24] You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone.

Heb.6: 10 “For God is not so unjust as to overlook your work and the love which you showed for his sake in serving the saints, as you still do.”

Rev.2: 23 “and I will strike her children dead. And all the churches shall know that I am he who searches mind and heart,** and I will give to each of you as your works deserve.”**

1 Peter 1: 17 “Now if you invoke as Father him who judges impartially according to each one’s works, conduct yourselves with reverence during the time of your sojourning, “

Rom.2: 13 “For it is not the hearers of the law who are righteous before God, but the doers of the law who will be justified.”

Sir.15: 17 "Before a man are life and death, and whichever he chooses will be given to him.

FINAL JUDGEMENT WILL BE AS IT MUST BE BASED NOT OUT WHAT FOR WHATEVER REASON; WE HAVE CHOSEN TO BELIEVE, & LIVE; RATHER IT WILL BE ON WHAT GOG HAD MADE POSSIBLE FOR EACH SOUL TO KNOW, ACCEPT AND LIVE.

Intrinsic evils:

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s1c1a4.htm

CATHOLIC CATECHISM

1751 The object chosen is a good toward which the will deliberately directs itself. It is the matter of a human act. The object chosen morally specifies the act of the will, insofar as reason recognizes and judges it to be or not to be in conformity with the true good. Objective norms of morality express the rational order of good and evil, attested to by conscience.

1753 A good intention (for example, that of helping one’s neighbor) does not make behavior that is intrinsically disordered, such as lying and calumny, good or just. The end does not justify the means. Thus the condemnation of an innocent person cannot be justified as a legitimate means of saving the nation. On the other hand, an added bad intention (such as vainglory) makes an act evil that, in and of itself, can be good (such as almsgiving).39

1754 The circumstances, including the consequences, are secondary elements of a moral act. They contribute to increasing or diminishing the moral goodness or evil of human acts (for example, the amount of a theft). They can also diminish or increase the agent’s responsibility (such as acting out of a fear of death). Circumstances of themselves cannot change the moral quality of acts themselves; they can make neither good nor right an action that is in itself evil.

II. GOOD ACTS AND EVIL ACTS

1755 A morally good act requires the goodness of the object, of the end, and of the circumstances together. An evil end corrupts the action, even if the object is good in itself (such as praying and fasting “in order to be seen by men”).

The object of the choice can by itself vitiate an act in its entirety. There are some concrete acts - such as fornication - that it is always wrong to choose, because choosing them entails a disorder of the will, that is, a moral evil.

1756 It is therefore an error to judge the morality of human acts by considering only the intention that inspires them or the circumstances (environment, social pressure, duress or emergency, etc.) which supply their context. There are acts which, in and of themselves, independently of circumstances and intentions, are always gravely illicit by reason of their object; such as blasphemy and perjury, murder and adultery. One may not do evil so that good may result from it.

So self- inflicted ignorance, laziness, or subjective justification will NOT as the NORM< be sufficient to override the examples of MORTAL sins you have detailed, without repentance and Confessed Forgiveness. Jn 20:19-23

GBY

 

[Monica4316]

Here’s how I see it…

God really wants to save each soul, much more than how much we want it. He died for each soul. He accompanies them throughout their lives calling them, giving actual graces, trying to bring them to Him… Some may finally rrspins as they are dying, which is why we NEED to pray for the dying, but that is a grace and many die as they live

There is such a thing as invincible ignorance but it requires being very devoted to the truth and seeking it best you can… Simply doing something out of hardness of heart due to sin, laziness to find the truth, not wanting to give up something… That would be culpable. Furthermore there are sins we deep down know are sins due to natural law. So a person may be invincibly ignorant about something not in natural law, but with certain things they are written into our hearts. Impurity, murder, such things - either give a sense of shame or instant guilt (until a person begins to harden their conscience, which makes it even worse ).

Many people might also know the Church teaching say on formication or contraception but excuse themselves, not wanting to give it up. That is culpable…

So we can’t say about individuals, but in general… Our Lord said wide is the path to destruction. That’s why we pray for souls.

It is sad… And the people who live in this way do still have many good points, of course, because they have a humanity that God made. We need to pray that they turn to Him so that the good in them will grow and not be lost altogether at death. We need to make sacrifices for their repentance. We can’t tell the soul or the condition of the heart of an individual person… But its not wrong to be concerned for someone when they are committing grave sins. We shouldn’t judge their soul, but as we don’t know, we need to pray.

Hope that helps!

 

[TK421]

Lukewarmness is a very dangerous state of being. Some saints have commented that those who are lukewarm are in greater peril than those who are vicious, because the vicious people still possess conviction even if it is directed towards the wrong cause.

We entrust everybody to God’s mercy and we pray for the conversion of sinners, especially of ourselves, since we are our greatest enemy, but for everybody else as well. God desires for all men to be saved.

The Final Judgment of a soul is a mystery and nobody has been given knowledge of this, and that is because God wants us to be humble, he doesn’t want us to either presume or to despair, and he wants us to stay dependent on his Son and to love and trust him.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

God will decide this, not me, but I’m guessing that people who are generally good but do the things you mention will spend significant time in purgatory before being allowed to enter Heaven.
I’m also willing to bet that these people make up most of the people on earth, or at least in Western society.

 

[tgGodsway]

Hello PMJ,

That was scary… not the topic, but all the verses you quoted on this thread. I have to tell you, not one of them was quoted in it’s right context. that is scary stuff.

It is true how at the judgment seat of Christ the Church at Laodicea and all who are like her will receive a rejection because they were Luke warm. Christ language was deliberately graphic to drive home the point.

But the judgment seat of Christ (2nd. Cor. 5:10; Rom.14;10) is a judgment of the saved, not of the lost. The rejection that will be found at this judgment is based on “works” or lack there of. (1st. Cor. 3:13)

But to be rejected and denied is not the same thing as to be disowned. He loves us too much to allow any of us to crawl out of his hand.

Eternal salvation is offered to us as a free Gift (Eph. 2:8) not of good works, lest any man should boast, but there is a judgment of the saved and each one will be given a reward or a relinquishment of reward based on works. But that’s it.

My heart was pumping after reading all those scriptures through the lens of crisis!

 

[James248]

Hello PMJ,

That was scary… not the topic, but all the verses you quoted on this thread. I have to tell you, not one of them was quoted in it’s right context. that is scary stuff.

It is true how at the judgment seat of Christ the Church at Laodicea and all who are like her will receive a rejection because they were Luke warm. Christ language was deliberately graphic to drive home the point.

But the judgment seat of Christ (2nd. Cor. 5:10; Rom.14;10) is a judgment of the saved, not of the lost. The rejection that will be found at this judgment is based on “works” or lack there of. (1st. Cor. 3:13)

But to be rejected and denied is not the same thing as to be disowned. He loves us too much to allow any of us to crawl out of his hand.

Eternal salvation is offered to us as a free Gift (Eph. 2:8) not of good works, lest any man should boast, but there is a judgment of the saved and each one will be given a reward or a relinquishment of reward based on works. But that’s it.

My heart was pumping after reading all those scriptures through the lens of crisis!

1st Timothy, “If we deny Him, He will deny us.”

 

[otjm]

1st Timothy, “If we deny Him, He will deny us.”

I am not exactly sure how this contributes to the discussion.

Being lukewarm is no more a denial of Christ than a married person who has been married for years and is less than “enthusiastic” about their spouse is a denial of their marriage vows.

 

[James248]

I am not exactly sure how this contributes to the discussion.

Being lukewarm is no more a denial of Christ than a married person who has been married for years and is less than “enthusiastic” about their spouse is a denial of their marriage vows.

Tggodsway said that God loves His children so much that He won’t let Hos children fall away.

 

[tgGodsway]

Both Roman Catholics and post-Protestants do not get the denial issue. It stems from a huge misunderstanding to the purpose of the Judgment seat of Christ.

Contrary to popular belief, the purpose of the judgment seat is NOT to decided where you will go, heaven or hell. It is NOT to decide WHO YOU ARE, or WHERE you will go, but what you have earned in good works.

Jesus said, “whosoever shall DENY me before men, him will I also Deny before my Father which is in heaven.” The customary interpretation is that our Lord will deny us heaven itself. The Greek counterpart for DENY in Matthew 10:33 also means to disavow, to contradict, and to refuse.

Interestingly in Matthew 16:24 this same word DENY comes up when Jesus calls disciples. He said, " If any man will come after Me, let him DENY himself and take up his cross and follow Me. The Greek counterpart in this passage is different. The English language covers up this difference. The word means to DISOWN.

The book of Hebrews calls the judgment Seat of Christ the “terror of the Lord” because many people will stand there in shock to the gravity of what is at stake. They didn’t do anything for the Lord. They were saved by grace through faith apart from works (wonderful!) but! … after salvation they sat on their hands for their entire life. God’s goodness and mercy will not disown them because he loves them, but he will definitely reject and refuse them all that he had for them as an inheritance.

The Great White Throne judgment of the Lost (a thousand years later) will work under the exact principle as this one. It will be a judgment of works to the lost, to give each one exactly what they deserve, in hell. Rev. 20:11

 

[PJM]

Hello PMJ,

That was scary… not the topic, but all the verses you quoted on this thread. I have to tell you, not one of them was quoted in it’s right context. that is scary stuff.

PLEASE EXPLAIN YOURSELF AND THIS COMMENT. EACH OF THE QUOTES i SHARED WAS ORIGINAL AND UNALTERED

t is true how at the judgment seat of Christ the Church at Laodicea and all who are like her will receive a rejection because they were Luke warm. Christ language was deliberately graphic to drive home the point

You seem to be going literal here. when it is a MORAL LESSON, an allegory.

But the judgment seat of Christ (2nd. Cor. 5:10; Rom.14;10) is a judgment of the saved, not of the lost. The rejection that will be found at this judgment is based on “works” or lack there of. (1st. Cor. 3:13)

SORRY, but I’m finding it difficult to follow the relevance of these as you intend them to be

2Cor.5: 10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive good or evil, according to what he has done in the body.

this is precisely my point

Rom.10: 14 But how are men to call upon him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without a preacher?

PUTTING ASIDE FOR THE MOMENT FALSE TEACHERS

GOD WILL, BECAUSE GOD MUST PASS FINAL JUDGEMENT BASED NOT ON WHAT WE HAVE SELECTIVELY CHOSEN TO ACCEPT, BELIEF AND LIVE; RATHER IT WILL BE IN DIVINE JUSTICE BASED ON WHAT HE, GOD, HAS MADE POSSIBLE FOR EACH SOUL TO KNOW, ACCEPT AND LIVE.

But to be rejected and denied is not the same thing as to be disowned. He loves us too much to allow any of us to crawl out of his hand

That is only WISHFUL THINKING. AND DENIES God’s infallible sense of TRUE Justice

**TAKE UP YOUR CROSS **

Mt 5:48 Be you therefore perfect, as also your heavenly Father is perfect.
**
Lk 14:27 And whosoever doth not carry his cross and come after me, cannot be my disciple.**

Phil 2:8 He humbled himself, becoming obedient unto death, even to the death of the cross.

Mk 8: 34 And calling the multitude together with his disciples, he said to them: If any man will follow me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me

Mt 16:24 Then Jesus said to his disciples: If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

Mt 5:16 For I tell you, that unless your justice abound more than that of the scribes and Pharisees, you shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven

Lk 9:23And he said to all: If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me

Gal 6:14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ; by whom the world is crucified to me, and I to the world.

Eternal salvation is offered to us as a free Gift (Eph. 2:8) not of good works, lest any man should boast, but there is a judgment of the saved and each one will be given a reward or a relinquishment of reward based on works. But that’s it

The One TRUE Church & Faith of Christ which existed for 1,500 years before the Reformation AND 500 years after it is the Direct, exclusuve HOLDER OF ALL of the Keys to Heaven.

Mt 10:1-5; Mt 16:15-19, John 17:17-20; Mt 28:18-20; Eph 2:20-22; Eph 4:1-7 are just some of the evidence of this reality my friend.

My heart was pumping after reading all those scriptures through the lens of crisis!

AND perhaps it should be so. You ARE on a CATHOLIC FORUM because the Holy Spirit has led you here. THEY ARE IN THE BIBLE FOR A REASON.

Pray much about it.

GBY

Patrick

 

[tgGodsway]

At work now but I will piece it together for you later.

 

[otjm]

Tggodsway said that God loves His children so much that He won’t let Hos children fall away.

So how do his comments answer or fail to answer the OP?

 

[tgGodsway]

PJM
Okay…. My point is in reference to luke-warm works, ( Rev. 3:15) neither hot nor cold, and how Jesus will spew this Church out of his mouth. Why? because He will be disgusted by their lack of zeal to serve God. Yes John used a figure of speech here but his points are not hard to understand.

He’s talking to the Laodicean Church. He is reproving them because of their lack of spiritual zeal. The larger context shows there were seven Churches, all receiving reproof and correction.

But more to the point: Many people use this passage as some kind of “final judgment” to determine one’s eternal destiny. It is not.

In Roman Catholic theology, for one, a final justification is waiting for those who (at the end of their life) will supposedly receive, because they have done enough faith and works to get through the gates of heaven. (that amount is never specified exactly.)

Unfortunately many Protestant denominations are not far from Rome. One passage used often to support these points is this one here in Rev. 3 the Church at Laodicea. This divine rejection is seen as an eternal banishment from heaven.

My argument is that the purpose for this judgment seat is NOT to justify or condemn God’s people at all in a final justification. Everyone at this judgment seat will have already received justification upon new birth. It is not a “final judgment” over SIN. Why not? because the judgment for sin has passed at the cross when Jesus said, “It is finished,” then he died as the final Lamb of God. We could call this the Passover because Judgment was spared to us just like the Israelites who applied the blood to the door post of their house were spared when the death angel passed over them. See John 5:24.

I have cut and pasted (below) the exact scriptures you used in this thread- I will offer a brief interpretation of each.

Mt 5:48 Be you therefore perfect, as also your heavenly Father is perfect.-PERFECTION IS NOT SINLESSNESS. IT HAS MORE TO DO WITH BECOMING MATURE.​

Lk 14:27 And whosoever doth not carry his cross and come after me, cannot be my disciple.
AGREED! IF YOU DON’T TAKE UP YOUR CROSS AND FOLLOW YOU CANNOT BE HIS DISCIPLES.-

Phil 2:8 He humbled himself, becoming obedient unto death, even to the death of the cross. YES.

Mk 8: 34 And calling the multitude together with his disciples, he said to them: If any man will follow me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me IF ANY MAN WILL DO THIS HE WILL BE BLESSED, AGREED.

Mt 16:24 Then Jesus said to his disciples: If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. AGREED.

Mt 5:16 For I tell you, that unless your justice abound more than that of the scribes and Pharisees, you shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven-YOU MISS QUOTED IT. IT IS IN VERSE 20. UNLESS THE DISCIPLES ADVANCED BEYOND THE RIGHTEOUSNESS OF THE PHARESEES THEY CANNOT ENTER THE KINGDOM. WHAT IS THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN? COULD IT BE GOD’S WAY OF DOING THINGS? UNLESS YOU LIVE MORE RIGHTEOUSLY THAN THEY YOU CANNOT ENTER GOD’S WAYS.

Lk 9:23And he said to all: If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me AGREED!

Gal 6:14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ; by whom
the world is crucified to me, and I to the world. NOT SURE WHY YOU QUOTED THIS ONE.
MY GLORY IS NOT ABOUT ME, BUT CHRIST

 

[PJM]

Tggodsway said that God loves His children so much that He won’t let His children fall away.

I fully agree with the two bible passages you shared, but this statement is incorrect.

WHY:

Matt.5: 48 “You, therefore, must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect”

God in order to be GOD in an absolute sense HAS TO BE “perfect”

Gen 1:26-27 teaches that GOD freely choose to make humanity in His OWN Image:

This is fulfilled by GOD Gifting all HUMAN SOULS with a mind, intellect and FREEWILL.

“Before man is life and death, good and evil, that which he shall choose shall be given him:” [Ecclesiasticus 15:18]

Rev.2: 23 “and I will strike her children dead. And all the churches shall know that I am he who searches mind and heart, and I will give to each of you as your works deserve.”

1 Peter 1: 17 “Now if you invoke as Father him who judges impartially according to each one’s works, conduct yourselves with reverence during the time of your sojourning, “

In order for GOD to be “perfect” He cannot overlook sin and man’s evil life choices. Hence the Temporal Punishment that ALL sis acquire]

The choice of heaven or hell is OURS to make, and is affirmed by Divine Justice

Isa.43: [7] every one who is called by my name, whom I created for my glory, whom I formed and made." & [21] the people whom I formed for myself that they MIGHT declare my praise.

God in order to BE GOD commits Himself to permit each HUMAN Soul to choose for ourselves our Eternal destination:thumbsup:

GBY

 

[Operations66]

It is quite possible, and I think even probable, that such people are given a last chance to repent at the moment of their death. After all everyone has a guardian angel, and your angel wants you to go to heaven. It’s the angel’s job to get you there, after all. I imagine he lobbies for you.

It may seem unfair that you or I lead a good Catholic life to get to heaven, and someone else leads a sinful life but still can get to heaven if God takes them. But we shouldn’t think that way. God wants all souls. He can take anyone He wants.

 

[PJM]

PJM
Okay…. My point is in reference to luke-warm works, ( Rev. 3:15) neither hot nor cold, and how Jesus will spew this Church out of his mouth. Why? because He will be disgusted by their lack of zeal to serve God. Yes John used a figure of speech here but his points are not hard to understand.

He’s talking to the Laodicean Church. He is reproving them because of their lack of spiritual zeal. The larger context shows there were seven Churches, all receiving reproof and correction.

But more to the point: Many people use this passage as some kind of “final judgment” to determine one’s eternal destiny. It is not.

The biblical example is a MORAL TEACHING that we are NOT to be luke -warm. HOWEVER being “luke-warm” by itself will not send one to hell AS YOU NOTED.

A Luke warm soul could ???] spend much time in Purgatory; BUT if it dies without a MORTAL SIN, it it will still attain heaven.

In Roman Catholic theology, for one, a final justification is waiting for those who (at the end of their life) will supposedly receive, because they have done enough faith and works to get through the gates of heaven. (that amount is never specified exactly.)

Again unforgiven MORTAL SIN being the judgment factor.

Unfortunately many Protestant denominations are not far from Rome. One passage used often to support these points is this one here in Rev. 3 the Church at Laodicea. This divine rejection is seen as an eternal banishment from heaven.

Friend I don’t understand your point here:shrug:

My argument is that the purpose for this judgment seat is NOT to justify or condemn God’s people at all in a final justification. Everyone at this judgment seat will have already received justification upon new birth. It is not a “final judgment” over SIN. Why not? because the judgment for sin has passed at the cross when Jesus said, “It is finished,” then he died as the final Lamb of God. We could call this the Passover because Judgment was spared to us just like the Israelites who applied the blood to the door post of their house were spared when the death angel passed over them. See John 5:24.

What you seem to be claiming here is CHRIST HAVING ALREADY DONE EVERYTHING NECESSARY FOR ONES SALVATION…

That friend is a post reformation invention of convenience; and NOT what the Bible and the CC has always taught. … Luther, Calvin ect. are NOT empowered to CHANGE WHAT GOD HAS ORDAINED [Jn 20:19-23]

John 20:19-23 is the ONLY NORM for sin forgiveness.

A Literally PERFECT act of Contrition can suffice for a time; BUT Only until one can and does get to Sacramental Confession. Again UNFORGIVEN Mortal sins is the issue to be addressed.

I have cut and pasted (below) the exact scriptures you used in this thread- I will offer a brief interpretation of each.

Mt 5:48 Be you therefore perfect, as also your heavenly Father is perfect.-PERFECTION IS NOT SINLESSNESS. IT HAS MORE TO DO WITH BECOMING MATURE.​

Lk 14:27 And whosoever doth not carry his cross and come after me, cannot be my disciple.

AGREED! IF YOU DON’T TAKE UP YOUR CROSS AND FOLLOW YOU CANNOT BE HIS DISCIPLES.

What this taking up ones cross entails is doing ALL that the RCC teaches on Faith and Moral Issues.-

Phil 2:8 He humbled himself, becoming obedient unto death, even to the death of the cross. YES.

Mk 8: 34 And calling the multitude together with his disciples, he said to them: If any man will follow me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me IF ANY MAN WILL DO THIS HE WILL BE BLESSED, AGREED.

"For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified." [Romans 2:13]… DITTO OBEYING ALL THAT THE RCC teaches on Faith and Morals.

Mt 16:24 Then Jesus said to his disciples: If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. AGREED.

Mt 5:16 For I tell you, that unless your justice abound more than that of the scribes and Pharisees, you shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven-YOU MISS QUOTED IT. IT IS IN VERSE 20. UNLESS THE DISCIPLES ADVANCED BEYOND THE RIGHTEOUSNESS OF THE PHARESEES THEY CANNOT ENTER THE KINGDOM. WHAT IS THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN? COULD IT BE GOD’S WAY OF DOING THINGS? UNLESS YOU LIVE MORE RIGHTEOUSLY THAN THEY YOU CANNOT ENTER GOD’S WAYS.

The Kingdom of Heaven is the JUST reward of all Souls that Know Christ, and FULLY OBEY ALL THAT HE TEACHES THROUGH HIS RCC, and die without unconfessed and UNFORGIVEN Mortal sins.

Lk 9:23And he said to all: If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me AGREED!

Gal 6:14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ; by whom
the world is crucified to me, and I to the world. NOT SURE WHY YOU QUOTED THIS ONE.
MY GLORY IS NOT ABOUT ME, BUT CHRIST

I had HOPED to point out that HUMBLE Obedience to ALL that Christ teaches THROUGH HIS One True Church including Sacramental Confession {that is WHY its in the bible] are essential for one’s

Christ DID NOT DO IT ALL; what Christ Did do was make salvation possible by OUR life choices. Amen

GBY friend,
Patrick

 

[tgGodsway]

PJM, Thanks for the response but why do people insist on quoting Romans 2:13 on this site soooo… OUT OF IT’S CONTEXT.

If you will just take the time to read the larger context of what Paul said, then, when he gets to “For not the hearers of the law are just before God, BUT THE DOOERS of the law shall be justified.” You will realize that what Paul actually said, is that the doers of the law can never be justified by keeping the Law.

If you just want to lift scripture out of it’s context and throw it out with a bunch of statements, you do a disservice to the many hearers on this site. Ro 3: 20 says, Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

I’m not sure you know what a post-protestant is, do you?

tgGodsway