Wishing to be Protestant again...

[eucharisteo]

Esdra,

*You wrote: ** * Just wondering: Why do you consider this Church (“The Disciples of Christ”) as nasty sect? I found en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disciples_of_Christ and that doesn’t sound that bad. It’s just a protestant church, or am I wrong?

Not that I am interested in this church to become a member or so; I am happy with my Baptist Community.​

The Campbellite orbit of sects has a lot of variety! That should not be surprising, given Campbellites’ history of fissiparousness that, proportionate to their numbers, is scarcely credible even by obstinate Baptist scale of measure. The Disciples of Christ denomination mostly (note that “mostly”, Campbellites are maddeningly individualistic) has tamed down considerably since frontier days…

Anyway, I could go on, but I won’t here. The historically Campbellite groups that have wandered into liberalism tone down the divisiveness and legalism of the legacy (such as it is) of what they are heirs, which is why some of the larger and older groups seem less odious in the ways that I have described. Liberal and fundamentalist tendencies, however, still are rampant in the Campbellite sector of North American sectarianism.

Pax, Jerry Parker

Or else burn in hell! In several posts in the past I tried to convey this belief and most everyone got so offended that I receive marks against me because they did not take the time to read through what I was posting about and why. Yes, I’m a former Campbellite. In fact we have a huge family of them with preachers, elders and deacons. I had a burning desire to preach as I still do today.

You spoke of their harsh ways of what could be very clearly defined as proselytizing. I continue to do acts of penance for having been one of those Campbellites people run from, especially Catholics. We learned to use scripture like a weapon of mass destruction. Today we see many divisions and breaks from that tradition. We know of at least 2 that have thrown out baptism as required for salvation and do it like baptists do. We’ve either visited or belong to both. Max Lucado, Church of Christ preacher and writer, is considered among the conservative campbellites as paving people’s way to hell. I heard North Richland Hills make moves in the same direction. We were very miserable but could not see leaving since we’d surely go to hell if we broke. Well, about 4 years ago we made the first move to a local mega non-denominational church and saw the flaws in their baptist theology, rapture, non-trinitarian baptisms, and many other things that disturbed us. Shortly after I did some research and found docuements about the ancient church and the leaders of the time that contradicted many of the things we previously thought about Catholics and showed that the early Christians had to be Catholic and/or Orthodox. There is no way to prance about it honestly. That’s why it baffles me when people say they studied the ACF and remain in there non-Catholic or Protestant faiths. Campellites preach that they are the one true church. All else is on sinking sand…as the song goes. We were of the sect that do not use instrumental music in the worship. The death of my FIL made breaking possible. But my MIL has made it very clear her disapproval and continues to try to convert us back to the truth. She things Catholics are pagan. It’s always interesting to run into people that come from this background and even more interesting that someone not from it actually knows about it. Alexander Campbell and his father were Presbyterians originally and I do believe dabbled a bit in Anglicanism…not to sure about that part. But they surely broke the norm and ironically have many similar views about salvation similar to Catholics, especially Old Catholics.

 

[Anneymay]

Cat,
I left the Catholic church many years ago, in my twenties, and went to a protestant one. The reason? I grew up in a church, mind you, going to mass every Sunday, Holy Day, and sometimes just because my mother thought we needed to go before school. The thing was that even after all the years of attending and seeing the same people over and over again, nothing more than hello was ever exchanged. Heaven forbid the priest should ever stick around to say hello. I went see my protestant friends church and the difference was as night and day. These people knew one another!!! They talked about the bible, knew scripture and had answers. The topper of it all is that these people were happy when they talked about God. They shared what He had done in their lives and what trials they were going through. They prayed for one another and with one another. It was great!!! God came alive to me and not someone up there waiting for me to do something wrong to be judged for. Jesus and even the blessed Mother became real and for the first time in my life, they were part of my life and it felt really good and still is even after all these years. Sadly, churches in general have become so political and petty that I have left them all and have just gone to God. I do miss the socializing and talking about the Lord quite a bit but after having a church, and the people are the church, just about destroy my family with their cruel gossip, I just socialize with Jesus, mother Mary, and God the Father on a regular basis. There are too many of man’s laws (they call it doctrine) that widens the division between God and man. I have seen so many that people don’t know what to think if there is not something in the doctrine to guide them. As I see it, doctrine is causing the Christian community more harm than good. Well I have had my say such as it is. Blessings

Once again, people are dropping out of the discussion because of some vague reason that they no longer wish to be involved etc. etc.

WHY does this always happen?!!!

Why don’t be people stick to it and finish what they started, instead of dropping out when things don’t go their way?

I can see dropping out of an online discussion when you have a sudden crisis, or you get sick and have to go to the hospital, or when your house and computer burn down.

But so MANY MANY people on these forums post their “I’m not going to participate anymore” posts and give some totally made-up reason about “conflict” and this drives me absolutely NUTS!!!

IMO, it’s rude to start a discussion, raise issues, and then back out of it.

If you aren’t willing to continue a discussion (or debate) until satisfaction is achieved by all, then I say stop participating in online discussion groups. Get a blog and just say what you want to say and then don’t accept any discussion.

There is no reason why a thread can’t go on for months and months or years and years. Some of the discussions in the Family Life section are very, very old, and are still relevant.

I challenge those who have decided that the discussion is too hot for them to handle to gird up their loins, take a deep breath, and plunge back in. Or at least start new threads and try to define just one issue on each threaed to discuss.

 

[Cat]

Cat,
I left the Catholic church many years ago, in my twenties, and went to a protestant one. The reason? I grew up in a church, mind you, going to mass every Sunday, Holy Day, and sometimes just because my mother thought we needed to go before school. The thing was that even after all the years of attending and seeing the same people over and over again, nothing more than hello was ever exchanged. Heaven forbid the priest should ever stick around to say hello. I went see my protestant friends church and the difference was as night and day. These people knew one another!!! They talked about the bible, knew scripture and had answers. The topper of it all is that these people were happy when they talked about God. They shared what He had done in their lives and what trials they were going through. They prayed for one another and with one another. It was great!!! God came alive to me and not someone up there waiting for me to do something wrong to be judged for. Jesus and even the blessed Mother became real and for the first time in my life, they were part of my life and it felt really good and still is even after all these years. Sadly, churches in general have become so political and petty that I have left them all and have just gone to God. I do miss the socializing and talking about the Lord quite a bit but after having a church, and the people are the church, just about destroy my family with their cruel gossip, I just socialize with Jesus, mother Mary, and God the Father on a regular basis. There are too many of man’s laws (they call it doctrine) that widens the division between God and man. I have seen so many that people don’t know what to think if there is not something in the doctrine to guide them. As I see it, doctrine is causing the Christian community more harm than good. Well I have had my say such as it is. Blessings

But that’s not what Jesus taught. You have a relationship with Jesus–doesn’t He whisper to you about the importance of the Church and the reasons why you should be involved with the Church? When you read His Word, don’t you see all the passages and verses that encourage Christians to be part of the Body of Christ, i.e., the Church?

He taught that not only are we to have a relationship with Him, but with His Church. John 17. The entire letter to the Ephesians is about “body life,” or life in the Church. Paul and the other New Testament missionaries gave their lives to plant CHURCHES, not just tell individuals about Jesus.

Frankly, if I had to march into the arena to be eaten by lions or gored by bulls, I would rather march in singing with other Christians than just all by myself, or more accurately, “me and Jesus.” Maybe that makes me sound like my relationship with Jesus is weak, but that’s OK. Lots of those early martyrs marched in together, not alone. And I’m guessing that when that time came, they stopped fighting about which hymn to sing as they were taken to their execution, or what color their burial shroud should be i order to most express reverence, and instead, were One in Christ as they died for Him.

We NEED each other! Politics and all. Latin vs. Vernacular. Veiled and unveiled. Friendly or cold. Outgoing or reclusive. Decently or indecently dressed. Young and old. Free of serious sin or caught up in struggles with addictions and excesses. Protestants or Catholics–I personally think that a lot of Protestants will get into heaven because their Catholic spouses, parents, and friends will plead with the Lord and remind Him of the baptism of their Protestant loved ones and point out the sacrifice of the Lord on the Cross for those who believe in Him, and remind Him of all the prayers and Masses that were offered for our Protestant loved ones, and the Blessed Mother will join her pleas with ours, and the Lord will hear those pleas and have mercy on those Christians, Protestants, who are living in “invincible ignorance.”

Society needs the Church! One person can’t do much, but a whole lot of people working together CAN do much good, even if they bicker and argue while they’re passing out the soup or passing the hat for Haiti victims.

Unreached people groups need the Church. Again, one person can’t do much unless they’re rich and have political clout. But many people working together can support missionaries and teachers and preachers and aid workers to the darkest of lands where people are routinely martyred for professing faith in Jesus Christ. Yes, those Christians can accomplish much even if they are arguing and being unfriendly to each other and getting caught up in silly controversies and debates and spending more time online than they should. The Lord can work through His Church anyway, in spite of our sin.

Anneymay and others, I urge you to find the May 2010 issue of Christianity Today, and read the excellent article called “A Family Affair.” This article uses ancient history to argue in favor of Christians aligning themselves with “the family of God” in a church setting.

 

[Amy1966]

LOL, you’re too funny,

You’re the one who makes an assertion that you cannot, and will not substantiate, and you try to deflect by suggesting a new thread be started.

No one is denying the Holy Spirt, (so please stop putting words in my mouth), who do you think guided those who set the Canon of the Bible?

I am sure I am not the only one waiting for you to “destroy” anything. The only thing that you are destroying is your own credibility. Assuming that you have any on the subject.

In closing, play all of the little word games you want, but you have still not answered the question.

Finally you admit it was the work of God, you are making progress. :clapping:

If you look at history from any other source than from within your own church, which even using sources within your own church you will get a variety of answers and the reason is because the general population were already using and recognizing that which was Scripture and that which was not. The DC’s your Bible contains are not of God because they contain numerous errors unless you believe God errors. Do a Google search and you will find many sights that will bring these known errors to your attention. Even Augustine, distinguished Canon divine from Canon that was devotional and not divine but still used the word canon but made distinctions. Jerome was dogmatic that the DC’s were not from heaven. You can come back and say so ans so listed all of these and some will contain dc’s included in Trents list and some will not and the confusion will go on, but when was the official canonization done?

You tell me, when did the catholic church officially canonize scripture?

 

[Amy1966]

i agree. and the list of protestant denominations keeps growing, and getting stranger all the time. joel van olsteen comes to mind. he really likes to tickle peoples ears. and yes, the grace of God does continue to grow…within the Church He established. ill give you three guesses my friend. Peace

You better look inside as the division within your own church continue to grow for some obvious reasons and some not so obvious. Beyond that; each better examine themselves and see if they are in the true faith which is the gospel of repentance by faith in Christ alone.

 

[Amy1966]

Once again, people are dropping out of the discussion because of some vague reason that they no longer wish to be involved etc. etc.

WHY does this always happen?!!!

Why don’t be people stick to it and finish what they started, instead of dropping out when things don’t go their way?

I can see dropping out of an online discussion when you have a sudden crisis, or you get sick and have to go to the hospital, or when your house and computer burn down.

But so MANY MANY people on these forums post their “I’m not going to participate anymore” posts and give some totally made-up reason about “conflict” and this drives me absolutely NUTS!!!

IMO, it’s rude to start a discussion, raise issues, and then back out of it.

If you aren’t willing to continue a discussion (or debate) until satisfaction is achieved by all, then I say stop participating in online discussion groups. Get a blog and just say what you want to say and then don’t accept any discussion.

There is no reason why a thread can’t go on for months and months or years and years. Some of the discussions in the Family Life section are very, very old, and are still relevant.

I challenge those who have decided that the discussion is too hot for them to handle to gird up their loins, take a deep breath, and plunge back in. Or at least start new threads and try to define just one issue on each threaed to discuss.

It is not about you; if you haven’t noticed those that start do reach the point where they have said what they can say and have nothing further to add of substance. Then, the subscriptions stray into other topics and/or become sinful personal insults. Just my observance. The best news is that despite the topic or the disagreements there will be a few from all religions attached to Christianity who will be in heaven on the basis of true faith in Jesus.

Now that you brought it up, it is a good time to leave for truth here is subjective and wish the person who wants to be Protestant to forgo that and become Christian and put aside all religion.

 

[CatholicFireman]

It is not about you; if you haven’t noticed those that start do reach the point where they have said what they can say and have nothing further to add of substance. Then, the subscriptions stray into other topics and/or become sinful personal insults. Just my observance. The best news is that despite the topic or the disagreements there will be a few from all religions attached to Christianity who will be in heaven on the basis of true faith in Jesus.

Now that you brought it up, it is a good time to leave for truth here is subjective and wish the person who wants to be Protestant to forgo that and become Christian and put aside all religion.

And that too would be their choice and their choice alone, hopefully with no outside influences other than The Holy Spirit † to guide that person. Pax†

I just want to clarify that I am happy to be Catholic and have absolutely no plans of ever leaving. I know that it is the true Church.

And that would be the OP’s own words. "Nuff said.

 

[twopekinguys]

Finally you admit it was the work of God, you are making progress. :clapping:

If you look at history from any other source than from within your own church, which even using sources within your own church you will get a variety of answers and the reason is because the general population were already using and recognizing that which was Scripture and that which was not. The DC’s your Bible contains are not of God because they contain numerous errors unless you believe God errors. Do a Google search and you will find many sights that will bring these known errors to your attention. Even Augustine, distinguished Canon divine from Canon that was devotional and not divine but still used the word canon but made distinctions. Jerome was dogmatic that the DC’s were not from heaven. You can come back and say so ans so listed all of these and some will contain dc’s included in Trents list and some will not and the confusion will go on, but when was the official canonization done?

You tell me, when did the catholic church officially canonize scripture?

You just get funnier and funnier as you go on.

If you’re basing all of your thoughts on a Google search or two, then you’re in worse shape than I thought.

You are the one who has made the claim that you could “destroy” arguments, let’s see some destruction. I/we on this forum are not obligated to follow your Google chase.

You made the assertions, you back it up. If you can that is. Let’s see some reputable sources.

If the DC’s are so bad, why are many protestant Bibles starting to include them again?

Come on, get real. Your ship is sinking, and you’re not bailing water quick enough.

Give us these great Google search results your using. Let’s see some of that destruction. Otherwise, you’re just blowing smoke.

 

[benidict]

You better look inside as the division within your own church continue to grow for some obvious reasons and some not so obvious. Beyond that; each better examine themselves and see if they are in the true faith which is the gospel of repentance by faith in Christ alone.

hi amy1966. id ask you to give me some verses that prove faith alone, from the bible. but that argument has been waged so many times its not worth it. also i do not believe the Catholic Church is as divided as some might like. we have people from the Anglican Communion, actually looking for refuge within the Catholic Church. id call that some serious growth. then there are thousands of converts from protestant denominations like myself. i hesitate to call the Anglicans protestant. im alot more kind than most. i think 30000-40000 denominations is a little farfetched. but i could very well be wrong.Peace to you and yours

 

[anode]

hi amy1966. id ask you to give me some verses that prove faith alone, from the bible. but that argument has been waged so many times its not worth it. also i do not believe the Catholic Church is as divided as some might like. we have people from the Anglican Communion, actually looking for refuge within the Catholic Church. id call that some serious growth. then there are thousands of converts from protestant denominations like myself. i hesitate to call the Anglicans protestant. im alot more kind than most. i think 30000-40000 denominations is a little farfetched. but i could very well be wrong.Peace to you and yours

Thousands of converts *from *Rome, too, to all the Protestant denominations, Unitarians, Quakers and even the Anglicans! Most non-Catholic denominations don’t try to keep track of where their converts come from.

 

[benidict]

Thousands of converts *from *Rome, too, to all the Protestant denominations, Unitarians, Quakers and even the Anglicans! Most non-Catholic denominations don’t try to keep track of where their converts come from.

hi anode. you do raise an interesting point. i wonder what the breakdown is for protestants converting to the CC, and Catholics converting to protestantism. anyone have the answer to this? peace

 

[Gumbercules]

I am a convert to Catholicism from evangelical Protestant Christianity.

I also agree that the evangelical and fundamentalist churches are a lot better at love bombing new people when they walk into the church.

However the only fellowship that truly matters is the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, and He leads the Catholic Church only.

Jesus Christ is truly present in all Catholic and Orthodox Churches and no other church, so why would I ever think about reverting for a few potlucks a month?

 

[benidict]

I am a convert to Catholicism from evangelical Protestant Christianity.

I also agree that the evangelical and fundamentalist churches are a lot better at love bombing new people when they walk into the church.

However the only fellowship that truly matters is the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, and He leads the Catholic Church only.

Jesus Christ is truly present in all Catholic and Orthodox Churches and no other church, so why would I ever think about reverting for a few potlucks a month?

yes gumberculeles i can wholeheartedly agree with you. but once you join, the " love bombing" stops. then its time to be made in the denominations image. complete with but not limited to that particular branches lingo, dress code, hair cut, etc. amen to the rest. peace

 

[CatholicFireman]

Thousands of converts *from *Rome, too, to all the Protestant denominations, Unitarians, Quakers and even the Anglicans! Most non-Catholic denominations don’t try to keep track of where their converts come from.

And then they (the enlightened ones) come to their senses and come back home.

I pray they all do. Pax†

 

[eucharisteo]

This brings to mind an interesting statistic I read somewhere online. It said that 70’s of Catholics that convert to Protestant faiths end up reverting back to the Catholic Church. I wonder sometimes if God isn’t in His infinite and mysterious ways is using this knowing that they will convert back to help deepen their faith and bring other souls home to the Catholic Church. That’s what happened in my situation. I left as one and came back as 5.

 

[CatholicFireman]

This brings to mind an interesting statistic I read somewhere online. It said that 70’s of Catholics that convert to Protestant faiths end up reverting back to the Catholic Church. I wonder sometimes if God isn’t in His infinite and mysterious ways is using this knowing that they will convert back to help deepen their faith and bring other souls home to the Catholic Church. That’s what happened in my situation. I left as one and came back as 5.

I tend to agree. Very good for you.

Pax†

 

[eucharisteo]

I tend to agree. Very good for you.

Pax†

yeap! Now I don’t have to burn in the fiery pits of hell.

 

[CatholicFireman]

yeap! Now I don’t have to burn in the fiery pits of hell.

 

[benidict]

This brings to mind an interesting statistic I read somewhere online. It said that 70’s of Catholics that convert to Protestant faiths end up reverting back to the Catholic Church. I wonder sometimes if God isn’t in His infinite and mysterious ways is using this knowing that they will convert back to help deepen their faith and bring other souls home to the Catholic Church. That’s what happened in my situation. I left as one and came back as 5.

that is wonderful. give me hope for friends of mine who are concerned for their children who have left the faith for a protestant denomination. they probably see how much is lacking, in terms of worship, doctrine etc. i guess once the emotional high wears off, it helps them see that the grass is greener on the other side of the fence for a very good reason… if ya know what i mean Peace to you and yours eucharisteo

 

[Metamorphoo]

Once again, people are dropping out of the discussion because of some vague reason that they no longer wish to be involved etc. etc.

WHY does this always happen?!!!

Why don’t be people stick to it and finish what they started, instead of dropping out when things don’t go their way?

I can see dropping out of an online discussion when you have a sudden crisis, or you get sick and have to go to the hospital, or when your house and computer burn down.

But so MANY MANY people on these forums post their “I’m not going to participate anymore” posts and give some totally made-up reason about “conflict” and this drives me absolutely NUTS!!!

IMO, it’s rude to start a discussion, raise issues, and then back out of it.

If you aren’t willing to continue a discussion (or debate) until satisfaction is achieved by all, then I say stop participating in online discussion groups. Get a blog and just say what you want to say and then don’t accept any discussion.

Cat, I drop in for awhile on the discussions, and then I leave. Usually, I do so when I think that it is not productive for me on a spiritual level to continue to stay in a thread. I don’t want anyone to be mad about me leaving. I just don’t think it is healthy to stay in debates that are getting too heated.