Without the Church, we can never be a Catholic?

[cho_pilo]

Please comment on the bolded bit below.

The Church is the reason why you are a Catholic. No other thing can. Without the Church, you can never be one. If you disagree with the Church, you are not already one. Offending the household is offending the Master of the House. In baptism, the Church admitted you in to be bear this title. Now is the time to say once again: "I believe in the Holy Spirit and in the Holy Catholic Church.

 

[gilbs72]

Hi. This is interesting to discuss and be enlightened about. Is there a background to the statement… a context surrounding it?

I believe in the Church. But I also believe WE are the Church… a group of human beings (now a VERY big one) gathered together to worship God through Christ and the Holy Spirit. Not the stone temples, nor just the clergy. The Church is the human side of the covenant (between God and Man)–it is not infallible as the Divine side which is God, but I believe the Church is our best guide to understand God’s plan for us, since it is a collective understanding (from the early Church to today) and is guided by Christ as His bride.

I believe God’s wisdom is infinitely so far beyond what we human beings can comprehend. Who am I but just a speck of dust trying to disagree on something which not even the entire Church through the centuries will ever really grasp? But God has given us the free will to do so (disagree). That is still our choice but whether we remain part of the Church or not depends on what concern one disagrees with and the degree of disagreement. One may be “in sin” or “in error” but still Catholic. Or may have a grave disagreement which may bring others to fall also, and which deserves excommunication.

I’m also interested and open to hear other opinions.

 

[Katholish]

literally when we say that we are “Catholic”, we are saying that we belong to the Catholic Church. It is a proper adjective for the Church, and only analogously does it apply to us. As you might know, the term “Catholic” means “universal”. It is meaningless to say that “I am a universal”, but it is very meaningful to say that I am a member of the universal Church."

Thus, the statement is really saying “without the Church, you cannot be a member of the Church.” This is an obvious truth. It is just as if I said that my status of being a Virginian is dependent on their being a Commonwealth of Virginia. Nothing radical about that.

 

[fhansen]

Please comment on the bolded bit below.

Well, Jesus established the Church, not us. If we did it would look anywhere from a little different to a lot different, kinda like Protestantism I’d assume. More importantly its’ beliefs could range widely, based on whatever authority we chose to use for that purpose.