WOHOOO! Annulment case accepted!

[MJJean]

First congrats on making this step. Don’t bother with the rude people.

Second: Be very careful with this line of thinking that he only hurts his women and doesn’t harm the kids.

I had one who left his barely two year old in the tub with the water running while he held me down, choked me, and beat me about the abdomen. Also, kids see things, I don’t want my kids growing up thinking thats how they should be treated, or it is ok or normal. Or if I had boys, I don’t want them thinking thats how they should treat their wives.

It may be a blessing that he has ignored your children. I know it still hurts them, and that is not good, but it might have been worse if he demanded visitation and you had to send them off to watch their step-mom get punched in the face.

I know your pain, as someone who has been in an abusive relationship, and someone who has been through the annulment (and celebrated when it came through) and as someone converting to Catholicism.

Prayers for you and a speedy decision!

It’s an odd thing, huh? On the one hand I wanted him to at least try to be a decent father. On the other hand, I have to admit I think the kids are turning out/will turn out better without his influence. Thankfully, the courts gave “reasonable” visitation and not actual dates and times. And, also thankfully, my ex moved out of state within months of the divorce being final. Whatever is going on with him and his current wife and children (one is 5 or 6 and the other about 3) isn’t causing me and my kids problems, for which I am grateful. I do feel bad for the kids he has living in the situation they are, but nothing I can do but pray for them.

My witnesses have all reported they got their questionnaires. One has sent it back for sure. I am waiting to hear responses to texts and voicemails to know if the others have yet.

I’m sorry you went through the same things I did. It’s good to hear from people who understand where I am coming from, though.

 

[tafan]

It can be appropriate to rejoice over someone’s death. Did you know that there were Masses of thanksgiving for winning in battle? It is not wrong to rejoice in a tyrant’s death. Quit being simplistic.

Actually, physical abuse can be an indication for an annulment. I have rendered affirmative decisions based solely on physical abuse because there are grounds that this can definitively prove. Since when did you get your degree in canon law?

Oh and how ridiculous is it to say it is only appropriate to pursue an annulment if an annulment is justified! So is it only appropriate to go to the ER if you DID have a heart attack as opposed to suspecting a heart attack?

Don’t be a sanctimonious pharisee. The OP is rejoicing at a good- she is exercising her rights and she has overcome the first obstacle for an evaluation of her presumed marriage. Totally appropriate to be excited. Totally inappropriate for someone to be negative about this. The scandal is not the divorce and not the annulment but the sins that led to the divorce or annulment. There are annulments declared that were not the result of sin, BTW. Any human action is necessarily virtuous or vicious. It is really hard to prove that doing something lawful (pursuing an annulment) is vicious. It is not wrong in and of itself to pursue an annulment, and in many cases it can be morally obligatory.

SerraSemper, first of all, your defense of the OP is much appreciated and well stated.

I do have a sincere question and not looking to be argumentative, I simply want to have a better understanding. What are grounds for annullment that can be definutively proved by physical abuse?
Also, please try to understand the frustration that some people have with annulment process. I have been told, more than once, that a marriage that takes place when the woman is pregnant always had grounds for annullments. I don’t know if this is true, but I do know from first hand experience that it is extremely offensive to some of us. And there was a time that these statements made me very jaded, and cynical and skeptical about the whole annullment process. I don’t feel that way any more, but still resent the statements a great deal.

 

[SerraSemper]

SerraSemper, first of all, your defense of the OP is much appreciated and well stated.

I do have a sincere question and not looking to be argumentative, I simply want to have a better understanding. What are grounds for annullment that can be definutively proved by physical abuse?
Also, please try to understand the frustration that some people have with annulment process. I have been told, more than once, that a marriage that takes place when the woman is pregnant always had grounds for annullments. I don’t know if this is true, but I do know from first hand experience that it is extremely offensive to some of us. And there was a time that these statements made me very jaded, and cynical and skeptical about the whole annullment process. I don’t feel that way any more, but still resent the statements a great deal.

Grounds? Try intention against the good of the spouse. Or 1095.2 or 1095.3. It all depends upon context and history of behavioral patterns. This is why it is not a good idea to rely on popular understandings of what qualifies for an annulment, but to talk with those who actually know what constitutes the institution of marriage. This is why I always advise people to talk to their tribunal personnel rather than their pastors to get the most accurate assessment of their situation.

Same for pregnancies. Sometimes it is a major part of proof for a shotgun style invalid wedding. On the other hand, sometimes it is just a step albeit immoral in the marriage process. A close friend of mine got pregnant but was planning on the wedding anyway. She is in what I’d consider a very valid marriage.

 

[tafan]

Grounds? Try intention against the good of the spouse. Or 1095.2 or 1095.3. It all depends upon context and history of behavioral patterns. This is why it is not a good idea to rely on popular understandings of what qualifies for an annulment, but to talk with those who actually know what constitutes the institution of marriage. This is why I always advise people to talk to their tribunal personnel rather than their pastors to get the most accurate assessment of their situation.

Same for pregnancies. Sometimes it is a major part of proof for a shotgun style invalid wedding. On the other hand, sometimes it is just a step albeit immoral in the marriage process. A close friend of mine got pregnant but was planning on the wedding anyway. She is in what I’d consider a very valid marriage.

Thanks for the answer

 

[Honour]

This is why I always advise people to talk to their tribunal personnel rather than their pastors to get the most accurate assessment of their situation.

Wow, I didn’t know you could do this, my pastor is amazing…but talking to him about my annulment was talking in circles. He kept telling me that I had to to a formal case for my situation, I had been informed by another priest that it would be a much simpler ligamen case…but my pastor kept insisting that his previous marriage had nothing to do woth the validity of our marriage…finally figured it out after several calls to the cannon lawyer…but I had to resist the urge to grab the phone and say" just let me talk to him"!

It all worked out in the end, I just figured the office was too busy to take calls from petitioners. I am very gratefull for my pastor and the tribunal for the work they did on my case, and feel bad about the ex cussing out over the phone someone at the diocese!

 

[4GBPrayerLife]

this is a weird thing to be celebrating.

agree, and Ive been through hell. Even when divorce ends up being the biggest blessing celebrating it is disrespectful to the sacrament of holy matrimony.

But I am glad OP that you are moving forward and find the annulment process healing and effective closure.

 

[MJJean]

agree, and Ive been through hell. Even when divorce ends up being the biggest blessing celebrating it is disrespectful to the sacrament of holy matrimony.

But I am glad OP that you are moving forward and find the annulment process healing and effective closure.

You know, I’d agree if my marriage to my first husband was a sacrament. It was not. We were both practicing Pagans at the time. Neither thought of marriage as anything more than a legal contract and social status. I know I did not intend the marriage to be permanent and I strongly suspect my ex did not intend it to be permanent, either. Neither intended fidelity before or after the ceremony. And we also contracepted as neither wanted any more children.

In my case, the offense against the Sacrament of Holy Matrimony was pretending to enter into a marriage. And for that I am truly sorry.

My current marriage, even though entered into a decade before my husband returned to the Church, was entered into with the intention of it being what the Church teaches regarding marriage. If my current marriage ended I would be devastated and I certainly wouldn’t apply for annulment. If applying for an annulment somehow became the only moral choice, I’d be much more somber and certainly not celebratory.

I was actually quite surprised when I started learning the Church’s teachings on marriage and realized that my husband and I were actually practicing what the Church teaches long before his return to the faith and my introduction to it. We, in practice, had a catholic marriage. My ex and I did not.

The difference between the two ceremonies, what lead up to them, and how both parties felt, what they intended, behavior during marriage, etc. has illustrated to me how and why the Church respects all marriages even those not performed by the Church. And I thank the Church and am truly grateful for the annulment process so that people like myself can prove that an actual marriage did not exist despite some paperwork and a ceremony taking place.

 

[MJJean]

Grounds? Try intention against the good of the spouse. Or 1095.2 or 1095.3. It all depends upon context and history of behavioral patterns. This is why it is not a good idea to rely on popular understandings of what qualifies for an annulment, but to talk with those who actually know what constitutes the institution of marriage. This is why I always advise people to talk to their tribunal personnel rather than their pastors to get the most accurate assessment of their situation.

Same for pregnancies. Sometimes it is a major part of proof for a shotgun style invalid wedding. On the other hand, sometimes it is just a step albeit immoral in the marriage process. A close friend of mine got pregnant but was planning on the wedding anyway. She is in what I’d consider a very valid marriage.

My Tribunal paperwork listed grounds for annulment as:

Me- 1095 and 1101

My ex- 1095, 1101, and 1101.2

I’d assume 1101 would mean partial simulation of marriage expressed by infidelity before and after marriage? Sound about right?

1095 I would think would regard my ex’s possible mental illness expressed by his then and continuing extreme immaturity, inability to understand or fulfill the responsibilities and obligations of marriage.

On my side I would guess it means immaturity (at the time, I’ve managed to grow up since I was 19), lack of judgement, and inability to fulfill the responsibilities and obligations of marriage.

1101.2 I would guess references the abuse (mental and physical) as well as other things he did during the marriage that acted against the good of his spouse (me) such as steal and pawn my personal possessions (jewelry I inherited from my grandfather that was not worth much but was very personally valuable for sentimental reasons, the loss of which devastated me emotionally) and his sabotaging my attempts to get an education as well as sabotaging my attempts at employment when he failed to remain employed.

I don’t think the pregnancy would be part of my case as we married a year after the baby was born, but then again she was the reason I married him at all. I wanted her legitimized, to have both biological parents in her life, and for both myself and my baby to not be socially stigmatized for me not having at least been married to her father for a time.

And, yes, I agree that pregnancy or the birth of a child can hasten a marriage, but the marriage may still be perfectly valid. My husband and I had a child while I was awaiting a legal divorce and then married, but we had been planning to marry as soon as I was divorced and legally free to marry anyway. Our son’s birth was not the primary reason we decided to marry, it was just the reason we married on the date we did.

 

[SerraSemper]

agree, and Ive been through hell. Even when divorce ends up being the biggest blessing celebrating it is disrespectful to the sacrament of holy matrimony.

But I am glad OP that you are moving forward and find the annulment process healing and effective closure.

What is disrespectful to natural or sacramental matrimony is not a just divorce but the mockery of marriage many presumed marriages are of marriage. It is disrespectful to marriage to enter it with the intention against children, not to divorce because of discovering your ex refused to have kids.

 

[glasgowman]

although your ex may have hurt you in the past, you should be praying for him instead of running him down, i also believe that if more people turned to our jesus and our lady and prayed from the heart to save a marriage it will happen, i myself almost split up from my wife to whom i had only married after a twenty odd year relationship, the minute i got married satan entered ,

 

[Lamentation]

I wouldn’t exactly be celebrating the renunciation of vows, even if the reasons are just; it just seems rather crass.

 

[MJJean]

I wouldn’t exactly be celebrating the renunciation of vows, even if the reasons are just; it just seems rather crass.

Would you celebrate the renunciation of a bad legal contract that lead to physical and emotional abuse for nearly 5 years?

This is something a lot of people really don’t get. There was no marriage as marriage is commonly understood, especially here on a religious forum. There weren’t two people speaking vows before God. There was a legal contract that required a ceremony to sign. That’s it. Neither of us believed in God or “til death do you part”. Marriage vows were seen by us as a cute old fashioned custom, not something to be taken seriously.

In case anyone is wondering, I’m in a holding pattern. The gathering of evidence and testimony is complete. The Publication of the Acts is finished. The case was put in line on March 10th to be heard by the Court of First Instance and now I wait.

So frustrating. I actually marry a man I love with the proper understanding of marriage (permanent, exclusive, open to life, and for the good of the spouses) and it’s not valid because the non-marriage legal contract from 20 years ago enjoys the presumption of validity. I can’t wait til this is over, I am finally totally free of the ex, and my husband and I can convalidate!