Women and Dress

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Guys, the potato sack dress already exists. IN High Fashion nonetheless.
 
Yes, a lot of states are starting to address this legally now.

The problem is the original laws were written for big cameras that required setting up. There wasn’t really any way to surreptitiously film in public. So the laws just said if you were in a public place it was ok to take pictures.

Thankfully this at least seems to be a fairly uncontroversial idea legally - you shouldn’t be able to take pictures up a woman’s skirt, or down their top.

Some of that’s also Japanese culture, which puts a high prize on women being quiet and not drawing attention to themselves. I have a suspicion it’s less prevalent in American culture largely because more women would yell or slap the man and it would probably be acceptable. I know over here when I’ve talked about hitting a guy for touching me inappropriately the answer is usually “should have hit harder.”
 
I did not mean to imply that competition is the cause - IMHO, women have been at the receiving end of male domination (sexually and every other way) ever since sin entered - and women of this age are wanting pay-back, by being as “strong” and “physically dominating”, as “crude in language and in imagination” as the men who have been dominating over them. They want be be men, in that sense, not to compete but to be “on top” as men have been over them for so long.

This is not the way of Christ - it is entirely secular, and worldly - it is the deadly “might makes right” religion of the world. Woman will never find happiness trying to be more “man” than men themselves.

Yes, Mary fits my description - and she is the model of woman, the New Eve, Sarcelle - does not that prove my point?
 
mrsdizzyd:
“We have a lopsided preoccupation with the lustfullness of men. Women struggle with lust as much as men.”

I guess Jesus did too (and He designed women and men!)
Mt 5:27 "You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’
Mt 5:28 But I say to you that every one [masculine] who looks at a woman lustfully [for her] has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
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😳🙈

Let’s review the requirements for the

🥔 Catholic 2-Piece Potato Sack Ensemble 🥔
  • one sack with only 3 MODEST cuts: neck hole and arm holes
  • a long sleeve turtleneck must be worn underneath to ensure modesty.
  • one sack with the bottom cut off. Safety pins used to ensure it stay in place!
  • opaque leggings must be worn underneath to ensure modesty
  • military-style boots must be worn lest the ankles show and NO HEELS.
  • this ensemble must be loose fitting NO TAILORING!
  • potato sacks should be at least 24” x 40”
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See this is why I actually like looking at some of the websites for muslimahs.

While I don’t agree with all their dress sense, they at least put some effort into making full coverage outfits still look modern and pretty.
 
Never fear!!! We are still working on sacks in liturgical colors. We look forward to new designs for the various feasts.

There might be some delay on the feast designs. Each needs to meet with Fr. Ripperger’s approval. We don’t want to create any openings for demonic activity. He has already suggested that we sew a St. Benedict medal into each ensemble. 👍
 
Most women do not want payback. Most do not like to be men. They just want to be treated as full humans with the same worth as men. This is one reason why I rejected Islam in spite of me being born in that culture.

Women as you say are the gifts of God to men but in my mind this opens the door to thinking women are appliances for men to use or misuse.
 
fide said:
mrsdizzyd:
“We have a lopsided preoccupation with the lustfullness of men. Women struggle with lust as much as men.”

I guess Jesus did too (and He designed women and men!)
Mt 5:27 "You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’
Mt 5:28 But I say to you that every one [masculine] who looks at a woman lustfully [for her] has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
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Are you suggesting that our Lord didn’t mind if women lusted after men and would not also have considered that an adulterous act?
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I don’t think I have ever equated ‘decency in behavior’ with attire in my life. My sense is the Christian should not care for the things of this world, what to eat, wear, say, etc. Lilies of the field. God, Holy Spirit will provide. What you wear should not be that important. Having said that, I think tradition should be respected - maybe this is where you are going with ‘decency’? I am not about burkas and I can handle Western female modern dress styles but I think taste and modesty should dictate choices - for men and women for that matter. And in terms of worship I think tradition plays a central role, in what you believe and how you practice, right down to what you wear. I think Catholics frankly are some of the worst (negligent) at this - casual dressing at Church I mean - to the point of inappropriate, though it is a problem across the board. (are you talking about in Church or everywhere?) (both men and women)
 
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somecanadian said:
the potato sack dress already exists
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Speaking of sack dresses. Women used to make lovely dresses out of cotton flour sacks. It became so popular that flour companies started intentionally putting pretty prints on their flour sacks to draw customers. Some of them even included dress patterns. Vintage Flour sack cloth is now highly prized amongst quilters.

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Seagull said:
saw this guy - who I thought was rather monk-like -
about 32 or so - beard - somewhat long hair - calm expression -
noticed him sitting here and there at church - which I think is cool.
But last time - he sat in front of me with a black concert tee shirt on - not cool.
A heavy metal Christian band concert tee shirt - STRYPER - ?
At church - as the Priest with a light blue alb on - offers up the Eucharist -
ehh
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So? Isn’t judging someone as the Priest offers up the Eucharist worse?
 
I agree that judging poor choices in attire during services is an offense to God, no question.
 
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Dear Fide, (and Ransiri in answer to OP)

Having read this thread, my thoughts are closest to yours, fide. The issue of dress is really only part of the “discussion” begun in the OP. Please be patient with me, fide and Ransiri who asked: “Should women be more decent in behaviour and especially in dress and if, WHY?”

God created men and women for His Divine Purpose:
The ultimate end of the whole divine economy is the entry of God’s creatures into the perfect unity of the Blessed Trinity…(Catechism of the Catholic Church, paragraph 260)
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– He created us to be holy in unique ways as male and female persons – otherwise He would not have created us to be fruitful in bearing children. The Family is a beautiful “image” of the Trinity of Persons Jesus revealed to us.

Women are created to be Mothers, some physically, some spiritually, and some are mothers in both ways. Mary is both Virgin and Mother and I agree with you, fide, Mary is the Model in a unique way for women. Mary is Mother and Model for the Church. Jesus entrusted Mary to his beloved disciple John who heard from the Cross: “Behold your Mother” and obediently took Mary into his home and into his life. Men are called to learn from Mary as men, as John did, as St. Joseph, and all the male Saints in heaven. Women are called to learn from Mary in a very different way from the way men learn and indeed what each learns is unique.

The mystery of personhood is mystery. Men and women are different by God’s design; in the Catechism we read:
1605 Holy Scripture affirms that man and woman were created for one another: “It is not good that the man should be alone.” The woman, “flesh of his flesh,” i.e., his counterpart, his equal, his nearest in all things, is given to him by God as a “helpmate”; she thus represents God from whom comes our help…
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One does not need to be married to remember the words in Genesis, “It is not good that the man should be alone”. It’s important to hear this! Women need added insight into their unique vocation to be “helpmate” as “she thus represents God from whom comes our help…” God took woman from man creating her different yet equal in dignity – unique gifts of men and women are in reciprocal complementarity.

“She thus represents God from who comes our help” is an amazing truth reinforced by Pope St. John Paul II’s Apostolic Letter “On the Dignity and Vocation of Women” HERE.

This reply, is long, but we need to ponder God’s Plan from the beginning, and His sending Jesus through Mary. The Immaculate Heart of Mary has been neglected – but happy are those drawing closer to her who is so close to God.
 
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I’m a woman. The parts of a man that tend to incite desire in me just by seeing them, are not parts that are covered up by normal, modest, clothing. Hands, back of the neck, forearms are all highly attractive to me, and can get my mind working. But it’s certainly not immodest for a man to wear a short sleeved shirt, or not wear a scarf or gloves to hide his hands and wrists.

It’s up to me to keep myself in check.

Every culture has its own idea of modesty in clothing and behavior, and folks raised in that culture are usually aware of what those are. Most of us know when we are dressing with the intent or likelyhood to draw a sensual reaction from those around us. We can argue for hours, but if you bother to formulate and maintain an informed conscious it will take care of this issue for you.
 
No, a fallen nature, an inclination to sin, disordered desires - these open the door to all sorts of sin including the “culture of death” morality that “might makes right.” All who are weaker, more vulnerable, less powerful in any way at all, become potential victims of the strong, the powerful, the rich and famous, in this fallen world. Women, the poor, the sick, the elderly, any easy victim will be taken advantage of.

Notice that in the world, often the abused becomes the abuser if they get the chance, the oppressed becomes the oppressor, the victim becomes the victimizer as soon as and if they can. And that is not right! That is not the Gospel, that is not the way to eternal life. Jesus has a better way. It is not popular, but it is true.
 
My long experience in being a man, for many years now, has taught me two things on this subject:
  1. women have no idea how men think,
  2. men have no idea how women think.
I seriously doubt that we mean anything even close to being the same thing, about the word “lust”.
 
Alex337 said:
Men are just as capable as women are of self control. They are thinking, reasoning beings with a consciousness granted to them by God. They can control themselves. And women are likewise as impacted by lust as men.
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Nailed it.

Both sexes should do there best not be occasions of sin for other. I think it is really that simple.
 
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