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TheLittleLady
Guest
There are two kinds of people, those who work so they can live and those who live so they can work.
I take it that our poster is in a community that adheres to the second mindset.
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I take it that our poster is in a community that adheres to the second mindset.
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alice24
Guest
Yes, exactly.I´m located in germany, former GDR. Most people here are comfortable with their workplace as their main center of life.
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alice24
Guest
To the legal situation: It´s a good idea to report it for me in case of later issues. The neonazism I was confronted there is for itself a huge probem for me and I hought of reporting it for my security.
I know, I should have said “I have other obligations, sorry” and no further explanations. But, to be honest, I had only one workplace in the past 8 years where this was managable - a state university who took those legal terms very serious, because it was, well, the state. All other companies worked otherwise, and in general, in germany at most workplaces it is an nwritten law to not say no to work without longer explanations to make sure you are really not availible. Even if you are sick most people here expect you to explain that you really have the flu, no matter it´s no ones business.
The thing is, it´s not a legal obligation, but if you don´t play this game you are the first on the “fire me” list. And this would be bad for us right now. In the past, I had not the problem to manage the time like that because I was single and would have lost an evening in the bar with friends, as worst case. Now it´s different.
To the sunday mass issue: again, I don´t have an obligation to go. Mass, or, more correct in the orthodox church, the divine liturgy, is held not every sunday here because we have only one priest for the whole county. It´s bad for me to attend that infrequent, but I try to compensate with TV mass and a vivid prayer life. It´s sad, but not the main problem atm.
My husband and me are doing well with this minimum of time, but he can´t be more flexible with his time. We agreed that he needs to accept his working plan without much discussion and I try to manage my work around him, because he has more hours per week than me and his job is connected with our health care police and would be therefore much more painfull to loose.
I know, I should have said “I have other obligations, sorry” and no further explanations. But, to be honest, I had only one workplace in the past 8 years where this was managable - a state university who took those legal terms very serious, because it was, well, the state. All other companies worked otherwise, and in general, in germany at most workplaces it is an nwritten law to not say no to work without longer explanations to make sure you are really not availible. Even if you are sick most people here expect you to explain that you really have the flu, no matter it´s no ones business.
The thing is, it´s not a legal obligation, but if you don´t play this game you are the first on the “fire me” list. And this would be bad for us right now. In the past, I had not the problem to manage the time like that because I was single and would have lost an evening in the bar with friends, as worst case. Now it´s different.
To the sunday mass issue: again, I don´t have an obligation to go. Mass, or, more correct in the orthodox church, the divine liturgy, is held not every sunday here because we have only one priest for the whole county. It´s bad for me to attend that infrequent, but I try to compensate with TV mass and a vivid prayer life. It´s sad, but not the main problem atm.
My husband and me are doing well with this minimum of time, but he can´t be more flexible with his time. We agreed that he needs to accept his working plan without much discussion and I try to manage my work around him, because he has more hours per week than me and his job is connected with our health care police and would be therefore much more painfull to loose.
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guanophore
Guest
I am sure that is why employers covered by these laws are so careful about not asking. Nevertheless, they do make hiring decisions based on this information (if they can get it) sometimes only if it is assumed, as it may be in this case.
You are right of course, but the attorney I sought out for a work related issue explained this principle to me, and it appears to be the main impetus for unions.
I wish that employers were not allowed to jerk employees around with their shifts and benefits. I overheard some employees talking in the Wal Mart about being given frequent and unpredictable schedule changes. WalMart is notorious for keeping employees just below the requirement of hours to qualify for benefits. They also hold them hostage, as appears to be done to the OP, so that they are not free to take another part time job to supplement their income. If they say they are " not available" for the shift, they will just get laid off with the reason that they are "not available during hours needed by the employer.
Trust in the Lord with all your heart!
Proverbs 3:5-6
5 Trust in the Lord with all your heart,
and do not rely on your own insight.
6 In all your ways acknowledge him,
and he will make straight your paths.
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Pup7
Guest
They’re careful because it’s illegal. I’m not sure why you keep saying you don’t know why they’re careful. They can be sued for asking. It happens.
When I talk about “employment law for the employee” I’m talking about anti-discrimination laws (like not being able to ask me if I can have kids or if I plan to), laws regarding breaks and number of hours to be worked in a day, that sort of thing.
They do it because it’s legal. Not saying it’s right, but it’s legal.
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QwertyGirl
Guest
This isn’t Church teaching at all.
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Dugtrio1
Guest
Well, really, that entire paragraph is me just trying to work out an ideal life schedule. What I wrote isn’t an excerpt from the catechism or anything. But I do think “A Catholic should not work on Sundays” is Church teaching! (And it is indeed “should not,” not “must not,” as in the Church recommends it, but doesn’t absolutely require it.) Most of my first post was my own suggestions for how to make that work.
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guanophore
Guest
I never did say that. On the contrary, I said “I am sure that (it is illegal) is why…”
I understand. Labor laws are there to protect employees. Employment laws are there to serve the employers.
What makes you think that?
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QwertyGirl
Guest
Where is there anything written that says no Catholic is supposed to work on Sunday? No place.
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Pup7
Guest
I’ll own that I misread the sentence and apologize.
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guanophore
Guest
2168 The third commandment of the Decalogue recalls the holiness of the sabbath: “The seventh day is a sabbath of solemn rest, holy to the LORD.”
2174 Jesus rose from the dead "on the first day of the week."104 Because it is the “first day,” the day of Christ’s Resurrection recalls the first creation. Because it is the “eighth day” following the sabbath,105 it symbolizes the new creation ushered in by Christ’s Resurrection. For Christians it has become the first of all days, the first of all feasts, the Lord’s Day (he kuriake hemera, dies dominica) Sunday:
We all gather on the day of the sun, for it is the first day [after the Jewish sabbath, but also the first day] when God, separating matter from darkness, made the world; and on this same day Jesus Christ our Savior rose from the dead.
2176 The celebration of Sunday observes the moral commandment inscribed by nature in the human heart to render to God an outward, visible, public, and regular worship "as a sign of his universal beneficence to all."109 Sunday worship fulfills the moral command of the Old Covenant, taking up its rhythm and spirit in the weekly celebration of the Creator and Redeemer of his people.
2185 On Sundays and other holy days of obligation, the faithful are to refrain from engaging in work or activities that hinder the worship owed to God, the joy proper to the Lord’s Day, the performance of the works of mercy, and the appropriate relaxation of mind and body.
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QwertyGirl
Guest
That doesn’t mean you can’t work at your job on Sunday. That means you are supposed to not let it interfere with your obligation of going to Mass …or hinder your joy proper to the day…or hinder appropriate relaxation of mind or body. Those things aren’t mutually exclusive to working your shift at your job if you need to.
You see, when you make statements like that you cause less discerning people to get all worked up over it. Then they think they have sinned. And it goes downhill for them from there.
Better to remind them to get to Church over the weekend and take some time for themselves, if they can. Nothing sinful about working on a Sunday.
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Pup7
Guest
If you have to work at your place of employment, you are excused.
You can’t miss deliberately. You can’t skip for the fun of it or because you don’t want to go.
Otherwise most of the military Catholics I know are in deep trouble, especially those in a war zone in an Islamic nation who are working 6 days out of 7, 12 hour shifts, out in the middle of nowhere at a forward operating location.
I’d guess cops and firemen and nurses and docs would be out of luck as well.
Guanophore, surely you know this.
https://www.ewtn.com/expert/answers/sunday_mass.htm
You can’t miss deliberately. You can’t skip for the fun of it or because you don’t want to go.
Otherwise most of the military Catholics I know are in deep trouble, especially those in a war zone in an Islamic nation who are working 6 days out of 7, 12 hour shifts, out in the middle of nowhere at a forward operating location.
I’d guess cops and firemen and nurses and docs would be out of luck as well.
Guanophore, surely you know this.
https://www.ewtn.com/expert/answers/sunday_mass.htm
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alice24
Guest
Even if it was, it’s not for me as an orthodox. It’s sad that I can’t attend the liturgy often, but I am really not allone with it, almost every nurse would find herself in the same situation from time to time.
Thank god it’s not about restoring, not yet, it brought us closer together. But for the future it’s too dangerous for our relation ship, I think.
Thank god it’s not about restoring, not yet, it brought us closer together. But for the future it’s too dangerous for our relation ship, I think.
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alice24
Guest
Funny and a bit tragic, I tooked my medicine from the pharmacy with me last week and someone didn’t knew it was my bag and seemed to looked into it- the result is not the long (er) term contract I should have signed, but suddenly a three month contract (!), connected with questions if I may be pregnant when I felt miserable by the flu the same day…
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Pup7
Guest
I don’t know if you can do this in Germany like you can here, but if you can, I’d consult legal counsel in employment law. I’ll keep praying for you, Alice.
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alice24
Guest
Thank you for your prayers Pup, it’s prayer and strength what makes the difference from time to time.
Sadly, the company is on the legal side as I have no proof or witness. I decided to keep the job until my traineeship in two months is finidhed as the working times go well together and searching something new afterwards- without conflict and the danger of a bad certificate of employment (against this certificate I could use legal help, but this would take months and until the case is closed I wouldn’t have good reputation).
We decided to buy a car, even if that means more need to save, but we could look for more far away work then.
Sadly, the company is on the legal side as I have no proof or witness. I decided to keep the job until my traineeship in two months is finidhed as the working times go well together and searching something new afterwards- without conflict and the danger of a bad certificate of employment (against this certificate I could use legal help, but this would take months and until the case is closed I wouldn’t have good reputation).
We decided to buy a car, even if that means more need to save, but we could look for more far away work then.
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alice24
Guest
A little update:
-started my traineeship at the local museum. I got offered not only the 8 weeks trainee, but also an employment until november because one lady leaves (maternity). The contract needs to be subscribed by the city, but it´s 90% sure and would mean short term, but a really comfortable job with more hours per week.
-the museum secretary heard my husband is a historian, too and works really hard at the hospital and told me about a possible hire as a visitor´s guard in their house (one will leave next months into retirement), same hours like my husband now works per week, but no night work, no hard work, I got all the contact dates for him today to send the letter of motivation.
-she told me there are three jobs for historians (middle to high position) planned, but not yet confirmed by the city politicians. She will tell me to send my husband´s letter of motivation for this immediately when the ok is given, so maybe he could “level up” from the museum´s guard job.
-I will definately take the museum job until november and hope to find something afterwards, maybe I get to know someone until then. It´s a good start and far better than everything we had in the last months, and everything moved in two days. It´s too early to be happy now, but the people there seem to honestly try to help us, and I´m glad for this.
I thank you for praying for me
-started my traineeship at the local museum. I got offered not only the 8 weeks trainee, but also an employment until november because one lady leaves (maternity). The contract needs to be subscribed by the city, but it´s 90% sure and would mean short term, but a really comfortable job with more hours per week.
-the museum secretary heard my husband is a historian, too and works really hard at the hospital and told me about a possible hire as a visitor´s guard in their house (one will leave next months into retirement), same hours like my husband now works per week, but no night work, no hard work, I got all the contact dates for him today to send the letter of motivation.
-she told me there are three jobs for historians (middle to high position) planned, but not yet confirmed by the city politicians. She will tell me to send my husband´s letter of motivation for this immediately when the ok is given, so maybe he could “level up” from the museum´s guard job.
-I will definately take the museum job until november and hope to find something afterwards, maybe I get to know someone until then. It´s a good start and far better than everything we had in the last months, and everything moved in two days. It´s too early to be happy now, but the people there seem to honestly try to help us, and I´m glad for this.
I thank you for praying for me
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Seagull
Guest
Wow !
This is the first real blessing I have read from someone posting !
Talk about prayer in motion !
I’m smilingly wide and happy for you !
But I’m a touch jealous too -
But as Joan of Arc says, “ Act - and God will act “
This is the first real blessing I have read from someone posting !
Talk about prayer in motion !
I’m smilingly wide and happy for you !
But I’m a touch jealous too -
But as Joan of Arc says, “ Act - and God will act “
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alice24
Guest
Thank you all so much. My Job until november is still insecure and not confirmed, I await the response every day.
But my dear husband got hired for the museum guard job ( not a terminated contract!!) yesterday. This is a real blessing. We can’t live from this one job, but it’s a huge step in the right direction and I am so glad it’s not stagnating.
Once more, keep working hard and trusting in the lord is a Blessing.
But my dear husband got hired for the museum guard job ( not a terminated contract!!) yesterday. This is a real blessing. We can’t live from this one job, but it’s a huge step in the right direction and I am so glad it’s not stagnating.
Once more, keep working hard and trusting in the lord is a Blessing.
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