Would we recognize a saint if we met one?

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I have my idealistic conception of what a saint would be like. However, I wonder if I met a real flesh and blood saint, if I’d even recognize their sanctity. We tend to think saints would be the nicest people on earth. However, people like Padre Pio could be headstrong and blunt. He was a holy man of God but not in the stereotypical, make-nice, milktoasty doormat conception most people have of saints. In fact, I’d wager some people might even have thought he was rude and insensitive. In fact, there was a late priest at our church St. Thomas Aquinas that had met Padre Pio back in the sixties and celebrated mass with him. Overall, he wasn’t impressed with Padre Pio and commented on how irritated St. Pio got at the slightest interruptions during mass. I’m not putting Padre Pio down. He is one of the greatest, most holy saints of the Church. It’s just that if my late parish priest (a very good, faithful priest in his own right) failed to see the sanctity of this holy friar, it makes me call into quesiton my own conception of sanctity and the ability to perceive it in others.
 
My priest says, we see Jesus in the mirror each day. I don’t feel like I’m a saint however. But, there are people I know who live such a holy & spirit filled life, I feel they are saints (in waiting I guess)
 
In my parish, there’s an old man who for years just sort of hung out around the church. He’d obviously abused alcohol and chemicals during his life. He was angry and belligerent and not a little scary and I stayed out of his way.
Little by little, over the years, I saw a softening in his demeanor. I would greet him, and sometimes we’d talk. We’re both Italian, and I saw that it meant a lot to him to know a fellow Italian. I see him often at confession, and when we talk, I let him know he’s a good man.
He reminds me of St. Francis’ wolf of Gubbio (great story - google it). I asked him when was his birthday, he told me October 4th. Feast of St. Francis of Assisi. Blow me down.
I can’t tell who the saints are…
but there’s a lot of potential out there…
Remember: St. Francis of Assisi was a spoiled playboy, St. Augustine was a libertine with an out-of-wedlock child, and St. Peter denied knowing Jesus.
Everything is grace.
 
I forget where I read it, but it was a quote by someone who lived very closely with one of the great modern saints (I forget which one). The quote was something like: “Saints may be very close the God, but they can be extremely difficult to get along with.”

I suppose this could be due to various things. The typical saint probably chides everyone to love God more, be less selfish, pray more, etc. etc. This can be irritating, I suppose, to be constantly criticized. Also, the biographies of many of the saints show that they were sometimes given special priviledges while they spent more and more time communing with God: they did less work around the monastery or convent, took on the easier or more superficial responsibilities, etc. etc. This “unequalness” can be irritating to the more cynical or unhappy brother or sister in the monastery.

Speaking for myself – and I am no saint! – I was once reassigned to a new office and I took the opportunity to start fresh with my new coworkers. I did not gossip, I said only positive and friendly things, if someone was being talked about in a negative way I would say “Well, I don’t know, that may be, but . . . . .” and remind people that this person had positive qualities as well, I helped others whenever I could, etc. etc. I am sure that I failed at times and was unaware of it, but overall I think I was very successful in my efforts. The results? In an office of 12 other people most of them thought well of me, but I made only one true friend, and there were two people who hated me. And I mean HATED me! Why? Other than speak up in defense of someone who they were speaking ill of, I never crossed them in any way.

This experience taught me that just as those people who hated me were wrong to feel that way about me (in my humble opinion), so I too may be wrong to dislike a person. My “reasons” for disliking that person may or may not be reasonable or justifiable, but it doesn’t really matter. We are tasked by God to love our fellow man. Someone once said that the best way to destroy your enemy (or someone you don’t like), is to love them and become friends with them, then your “enemy” no longer exists. You have conquered your enemy and you have conquered the hate in your own heart (the true enemy), and you have gained a friend. Who knows, that “difficult” person in your office may be a saint, or a saint in the making. Wouldn’t it be nice to have a saint praying for you, both on earth and when they go to heaven?

Sorry if I got a little off tangent!

Let me be more succinct: I think that it is generally very difficult to recognize a small saint – one who leads a saintly interior life, but a more or less normal exterior life. It is probably also difficult to recognize a “large” saint such as Padre Pio, because of their many responsibilities or a strong personality they may appear to be rude or insensitive (unless you know of their great works, obviously). This is why we must constantly remind ourselves that only God is fit to judge others. “Hate the sin, love the sinner.”
 
St. Josemaria Escriva was blunt.

He may have even gotten the boot from this very forum for some things he said.

But, he is a saint.
 
There is that old saying “to live with a saint you need to be a martyr”😃 Saints are canonized for outstanding virtue not for being easy to get along with people, although I think many were and it was this quality that was their outstanding virtue - that despite many heavy interior sufferings they were always amiable. Other saints, like St. Francis Xavier were quite hard to get along with apparently - in fact it is said he expelled novices from the Order for the slightest infringements and many of these expelled novices approached St. Ignatius, who entered them into a noviciate far away from St. Francis. There are many little stories like this that can raise a smile about some of our saints, although in their own lifetime they were something of a trial to be around at times.
Would we recognize a saint if we came across one…it is said of St. Therese of Lisieux that her own sisters in religion in an enclosed convent thought she was a good nun but nothing at all outstanding. They were absolutely amazed when they read her life story.

http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/16/16_14_5.gifBlessings - Barb:)
 
You know, I’ve often wondered about saints “in the making” and I have come to this conclusion…

Saints in the making are responsible for truly humbling, unselfish small and large acts of humanity…from devout, constant, solitary prayer to public and private works of charity… it’s just that we aren’t witness to all these acts and works in one given moment in time…they’re a collection of happenings over time for the most part…

So no, I don’t believe I would recognize a saint in the making but I do always hope that *I will not fail to see *that the most unsuspecting one of us is capable of doing far more good than I ever will.
 
Being a male who is discerning the priesthood, I take a look at all the girls that are around me, looking for good qualities. I know quite a few girls from my youth conference and Young Apostle days that were striving for holiness, and maybe I just see the best in them, but quite a few girls I know are very holy. I also know (but don’t really look for as much) a few holy guys, maybe looking to be priests or just being men of christ.
 
I heard once that when we arrive in heaven, we’ll be shocked to see who is there, as well as who isn’t there.

I don’t think I can discern saints here in this lifetime; from what I have read about the lives of saints, a lot of them don’t come across as particularly likeable. I’m perfectly OK with waiting till the hereafter to find out who they are.
 
  • sometimes, it could be easy to recognize a holy person.
  • other times, it takes a holy person to recognize another.
  • and many times, many holy persons are invisible to our “earthly” eyes.
 
I have my doubts, though I’ve met a few I see as saints despite their many flaws. People who have shown great love and find God in each person they meet. Some of those people hang out here, especially in this Spirituality forum. 🙂

I have also, however, heard people question the goodness of Mother Teresa over this statement, claiming it to show relativism and “false ecuminism”:

“There is only one God and He is God to all; therefore it is important that everyone is seen as equal before God. I’ve always said we should help a Hindu become a better Hindu, a Muslim become a better Muslim, a Catholic become a better Catholic.”

😦
 
I think it is probably next to impossible to recognise a saint in the flesh due to the fact that we can not know another person’s heart. It is very easy to be deceived by outward appearances. Also, even if someone were a saint, I doubt very much that they would be what we would call ‘nice’. There is a widespread equation of the concepts of ‘nice’ and ‘good’, and they are not the same thing at all. ‘Nice’ refers more to someone’s manners, how they present themselves and interact with others. The serial killer Ted Bundy was very charming and nice, but the fact remained that he was a murderer and rapist several times over. ‘Good’, on the other hand, refers to someone’s true inner self, the soul whose every deed is recorded and whose every action is observed by God.

When I was younger I had an experience that taught me the difference between ‘nice’ and ‘good’ in such a way that I have never forgotten it. I had just moved to a new apartment on a dead-end street, and I was getting to know my neighbors. The man who lived in the building directly facing mine was named Jose, and he was very nice and friendly, always with a smile and a joke and good wishes for me. I liked Jose a lot. The house to the north of mine was owned and lived in by an older man called Ray. Ray was taciturn and seemingly bitter, and always seemed to have a sarcastic remark ready. I didn’t like Ray so much. One night I came home from work after midnight and discovered I had locked myself out of my house. I lived on the second floor and I knew my bedroom window was unlocked; I just needed a ladder to reach it. I immediately knocked on Jose’s door. He sleepily stuck his head out the window and after learning what I wanted, told me that yes, he had a ladder but wasn’t going to get it for me because he was so tired, and besides he didn’t want to wake up the whole house by getting up and banging around. I was stunned. I turned around, and there was Ray, who had heard everything and without a word had produced a fine big ladder, which he graciously held steady while I climbed in. I thanked him profusely and went to bed. This valuable experience caused me to completely rethink my value system, and while I still have a tendency to judge a book by its cover, so to speak, I always try to remind myself of Ray and Jose and that night long ago when they taught me that golden lesson by showing their true colors.
 
Jason_Hurd said:
I think it is probably next to impossible to recognise a saint in the flesh due to the fact that we can not know another person’s heart. It is very easy to be deceived by outward appearances. Also, even if someone were a saint, I doubt very much that they would be what we would call ‘nice’. There is a widespread equation of the concepts of ‘nice’ and ‘good’, and they are not the same thing at all. ‘Nice’ refers more to someone’s manners, how they present themselves and interact with others. The serial killer Ted Bundy was very charming and nice, but the fact remained that he was a murderer and rapist several times over. ‘Good’, on the other hand, refers to someone’s true inner self, the soul whose every deed is recorded and whose every action is observed by God.

When I was younger I had an experience that taught me the difference between ‘nice’ and ‘good’ in such a way that I have never forgotten it. I had just moved to a new apartment on a dead-end street, and I was getting to know my neighbors. The man who lived in the building directly facing mine was named Jose, and he was very nice and friendly, always with a smile and a joke and good wishes for me. I liked Jose a lot. The house to the north of mine was owned and lived in by an older man called Ray. Ray was taciturn and seemingly bitter, and always seemed to have a sarcastic remark ready. I didn’t like Ray so much. One night I came home from work after midnight and discovered I had locked myself out of my house. I lived on the second floor and I knew my bedroom window was unlocked; I just needed a ladder to reach it. I immediately knocked on Jose’s door. He sleepily stuck his head out the window and after learning what I wanted, told me that yes, he had a ladder but wasn’t going to get it for me because he was so tired, and besides he didn’t want to wake up the whole house by getting up and banging around. I was stunned. I turned around, and there was Ray, who had heard everything and without a word had produced a fine big ladder, which he graciously held steady while I climbed in. I thanked him profusely and went to bed. This valuable experience caused me to completely rethink my value system, and while I still have a tendency to judge a book by its cover, so to speak, I always try to remind myself of Ray and Jose and that night long ago when they taught me that golden lesson by showing their true colors.
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Wonderful example- I just don’t think that we can really know one way or another what is in someone’s heart. Maybe we should just treat everyone as a “saint in progress” and treat them just as we would a “known” saint.
 
R. L. Stevenson wrote a biography of St. Damian of Molokai. You might pick up a copy and read it to see what a real saint looks like in day to day life. I guess the health department people didn’t like to see him coming when he visited the big island.

Matthew
 
I have met a saint.

I do not say this lightly I say this because I know it is true.

My Grandmother knew the meaning of sacrifice… I grew up with out my mother I guess the party had to go on. My Grandmother gave up her retirement to raise me. We fought quite a bit mostly because I was angry growing up from the muliple abuses that I had to live through.

My Grandmother always had a rosary and when we were at our worst she would pray the rosery with tears in her eyes.
I saw that time and time again. Even in my rebellion it always moved me to see her with rosary in hand praying. The day I walked in and saw her crying and praying so intent on her prayers she did not even hear the door open has always been the most awful pain I carry because I had caused those tears it also was the most beautiful picture I have in my heart for me.

She taught me to forgive over and over again as a child. she taught me how to be a woman of the lord. there was always a lesson in every thing she did. Her favorite saying was " lets turn over a new leaf." and her idea of a cuss word was “by all thats holy.” and then she would pray.

Saints come in every shape and size. Some are recognized by the church. Some give in small ways and never make the list.
Grandma always smelled of fresh milk and roses though she never wore perfume or put on makeup. Maby thats why I rarely wear it.

two weeks ago I asked God for a chance to speak with her. I told her that she was right I do regret everything she told me I would but the pain that hurt the worst was that I never loved her enough when she was here… The answer I heard was its never to late to turn over a new leaf…
 
s4angel said:
I have met a saint.

I do not say this lightly I say this because I know it is true.

My Grandmother knew the meaning of sacrifice… I grew up with out my mother I guess the party had to go on. My Grandmother gave up her retirement to raise me. We fought quite a bit mostly because I was angry growing up from the muliple abuses that I had to live through.

My Grandmother always had a rosary and when we were at our worst she would pray the rosery with tears in her eyes.
I saw that time and time again. Even in my rebellion it always moved me to see her with rosary in hand praying. The day I walked in and saw her crying and praying so intent on her prayers she did not even hear the door open has always been the most awful pain I carry because I had caused those tears it also was the most beautiful picture I have in my heart for me.

She taught me to forgive over and over again as a child. she taught me how to be a woman of the lord. there was always a lesson in every thing she did. Her favorite saying was " lets turn over a new leaf." and her idea of a cuss word was “by all thats holy.” and then she would pray.

Saints come in every shape and size. Some are recognized by the church. Some give in small ways and never make the list.
Grandma always smelled of fresh milk and roses though she never wore perfume or put on makeup. Maby thats why I rarely wear it.

two weeks ago I asked God for a chance to speak with her. I told her that she was right I do regret everything she told me I would but the pain that hurt the worst was that I never loved her enough when she was here… The answer I heard was its never to late to turn over a new leaf…
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Beautiful- thank you for sharing. Your grandmother sounds like a wonderful woman!🙂
 
My grandmother also, was saintly.

Despite the tough life she had, she was always a cheerful person and never had a bad word to say about anyone. In fact, when people began to gossip about others, she had the knack of gently turning the talk toward something else.

She prayed much and taught us grandchildren how to pray.

For me, she was the greatest influence in my return to the Catholic Church.

I believe she is a saint.

Jim
 
There is a Fransician priest in my area that has such a sublime quality of holiness about him that many of my friends think of him as a living saint. This aura, or quality is very hard to define. You can almost feel the presence of Jesus when you are around him. But he would be the last to recognize it, he is a very humble and unassuming man with a great sense of humor. I know he spends a great deal of time in prayer because we asked him about it. He gets up very early to do this, and said that as soon as his feet hit the floor he starts his prayer time. But he is a very busy priest, and very popular. People love to be around him.
 
I think there are many saints walking among us. Some “famous” saints that are canonized and asked for their intersession, but most (I believe) are not so well known saints. Just every day people trying to love Jesus as best they can and trying to “live” the gospel. As another poster said, we will probably be very surprised one day who is in heaven and who isn’t. (hopefully I will make it myself eventually to find out:D )
 
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