Would you hang onto the truth even if it destroyed your life?

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healonzo

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I was listening to a professor lecture the class on the Church, and one of the most profound things I heard was that even if the Church destroyed your life, you would still need to acknowledge the truth of the Church. Throughout history, we have seen many people cling to the truth despite losing their lives. This question is more for thinkers who believe in objective truth.

1.) Would you cling to the truth of 2+2=4 even if it cost you your life?

2.) Would you become/stay a member of the Church if it was the truth?
 
2+2=4 no, I would gladly tell whatever psycho was trying to kill me that 2+2= fish

As for denouncing the Church, I really can’t say as I have never been put into that situation, but it would be my hope that I would remain strong
 
It’s so easy to say, yes, but I pray that I would have the strength of my convictions. As an American, I am often not challenged in that aspect. We take it for granted that we have those freedoms to express ourselves(though we are starting to lose that freedom slowly, eroding away.) I don’t know that any of us can say that we wouldn’t be just like Peter in our humanity, but with God all things are possible.

God help me if I am ever faced with having to stand for the truth for my life, and by your example on the cross, my I be brought to the virtue of final perseverance.
 
No idea until it happens (and I pray it never does, but if it does I hope I pray).
 
Depending on the situation, I might just hang on to the 2+2 thing (I’m just that kind of person who’s obsessive with deatails :rolleyes: ), but I hope that I would be strong in my faith. Then again, I don’t really consider myself capable of living again without the God and His Church in my life, so I think I could be pretty confident I wouldn’t deny it. But I guess I’ll never know until I’m put to the test.
 
Maybe it is necessary to distinguish clinging to truth, and clinging to statements of truth. I mean, you might still believe that 2+2=4, but be quite happy to say that 2+2=5.
In the same way, you might still believe in the Church, but be happy to say that you abandoned it.

I believe Islam allows people to say thay have renounced the Faith, in order to save their lives (without actually renouncing it).

Personally, the more I was pressured to renounce the Church, I more determinely I would refuse. However, in normal circumstances I am first to admit that the Church sometimes makes mistakes.
 
I think the key is whether or not you truly believe.
If you believe, then losing one’s life is no longer a fear like it is to a non-believer.

Me personally, I have my days where I feel firm and others where I am weak 🙂
 
healonzo said:
I was listening to a professor lecture the class on the Church, and one of the most profound things I heard was that even if the Church destroyed your life, you would still need to acknowledge the truth of the Church. Throughout history, we have seen many people cling to the truth despite losing their lives. This question is more for thinkers who believe in objective truth.

1.) Would you cling to the truth of 2+2=4 even if it cost you your life?

2.) Would you become/stay a member of the Church if it was the truth?
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The Church did not destroy their lives. Unbelievers and persecutors and sinful men did. The statement made by the Professor is false to begin with, if that is what he actually said, which I doubt. Even if men in the Church were doing the persecuting, that is not the Church destroying their lives. It is the individual persons. The martyrs made their own choice to cling to the truth and die for Christ under persecution.

Hopefully, if I were under persecution and the threat of death if I did not deny Jesus Christ and His Church, I would have the courage to choose death.
 
healonzo said:
I was listening to a professor lecture the class on the Church, and one of the most profound things I heard was that even if the Church destroyed your life, you would still need to acknowledge the truth of the Church. Throughout history, we have seen many people cling to the truth despite losing their lives. This question is more for thinkers who believe in objective truth.

1.) Would you cling to the truth of 2+2=4 even if it cost you your life?

2.) Would you become/stay a member of the Church if it was the truth?
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  1. No because the validity of 2+2=4 is dependent upon undefined variables. For example 2 apples plus 2 oranges = 4 fruits, but 2 apples plus 2 oranges does not equal 4 apples.
  2. Since I assumed your poll was referring to earthly life, I stated Yes, absolutely. The Church recognizes that our earthly life must be destroyed, we must die. This is also fitting with human nature, we all must die.
If however, your post was stating that we must lose our heavenly life, as well as earthly life, then I would say I must not know Truth.
 
CB_Catholic said:
The Church did not destroy their lives. Unbelievers and persecutors and sinful men did. The statement made by the Professor is false to begin with, if that is what he actually said, which I doubt. Even if men in the Church were doing the persecuting, that is not the Church destroying their lives. It is the individual persons. The martyrs made their own choice to cling to the truth and die for Christ under persecution.

Hopefully, if I were under persecution and the threat of death if I did not deny Jesus Christ and His Church, I would have the courage to choose death.
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I didn’t write that the the professor said that the Church destroyed lives, what I wrote was that even “IF the Church destroyed your life” in a hypothetical way, it would still contain the truth.

Good answer by the way. 🙂 Happy Easter.
 
jochoa said:
  1. No because the validity of 2+2=4 is dependent upon undefined variables. For example 2 apples plus 2 oranges = 4 fruits, but 2 apples plus 2 oranges does not equal 4 apples.
  2. Since I assumed your poll was referring to earthly life, I stated Yes, absolutely. The Church recognizes that our earthly life must be destroyed, we must die. This is also fitting with human nature, we all must die.
If however, your post was stating that we must lose our heavenly life, as well as earthly life, then I would say I must not know Truth.
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Great insight.
 
It should probably be remembered that our first Pope renounced the Truth three times, even after being warned that he would do so.

We all pray for strength, but often fall.

I like to think that if imprisoned in a North Korean labor camp and ordered to renounce my faith with a gun to my head, I would choose to die as a martyr. Perhaps I would.

But I think about how many times I should have spoken up to defend the Church when the stakes were so very much less, when someone made a stupid joke about priests, or spoke about how the Church’s teachings were so out of touch with modern times. Sometimes I remained silent when I should have spoken up.

I do tend to speak out more these days, I think. Maybe as I grow older, I care less about what people think about me. But I always regret the times in my life when I didn’t defend Truth.
 
Ask Joan of Arc how she would answer your question.

Or St. Peter.

Or St. Paul.

Or John the Baptist.

Or our Lord.
 
Arizona_Mike said:
I like to think that if imprisoned in a North Korean labor camp and ordered to renounce my faith with a gun to my head, I would choose to die as a martyr. Perhaps I would.

But I think about how many times I should have spoken up to defend the Church when the stakes were so very much less, when someone made a stupid joke about priests, or spoke about how the Church’s teachings were so out of touch with modern times. Sometimes I remained silent when I should have spoken up.

I do tend to speak out more these days, I think. Maybe as I grow older, I care less about what people think about me. But I always regret the times in my life when I didn’t defend Truth.
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I very much agree with you. I still remember when I was 11 and my 16 year-old cousin saw a bulletin board in my bedroom that I hung a bunch of holy cards, a rosary, etc… She laughed and said, “what are you, religious or something?” Looking back, I wish I had just said, “yes, I am.” But I said something along the lines of that I just happened to have all those things and had nothing to do with them, so I decided to hang it up. I’m sure many of us face these kinds of situations as adults. I agree, for some reason, being shot in the head for not giving up our faith seems easier than dealing with the social persecution we can face for holding onto it.
 
I would like to think I would hang onto the truth no matter what. BUT like most folks, I have no idea how I would really react when in a pressure situation.

I pray God does not put me to the test. And IF it happens, I pray that I have the courage to do what needs to be done.
 
“Would you hang onto the truth even if it destroyed your life?”

This is a trick question, or maybe it is just phrased badly. If something is destroying me I would conclude that that thing is not true, what is true is of God, and God gives life, therefore truth would always be life-affirming not destroying. Fear, pain, torture, etc. that is inflicted by someone or something that hates truth might cause a person to pretend to deny the truth, but to truly totally renounce the truth in one’s own soul is something different.

My question is why are people willing to suffer and die for things that are not true?
 
I have already placed on the altar respect, friends, family, comfort, and I think I would rather give up my life than deny Jesus and His Church. I am fortunate that my friends and family (most of them) accept my conversion of heart.
 
i pray that i have the strength to do so. But i am weak and arrogant and proud, so without great help from He who lost everything, i would certainly fail.

Kind of makes you appreciate the kind of man Job was, doesn’t it? 🙂
 
bmullins said:
It’s so easy to say, yes, but I pray that I would have the strength of my convictions. As an American, I am often not challenged in that aspect. We take it for granted that we have those freedoms to express ourselves(though we are starting to lose that freedom slowly, eroding away.) I don’t know that any of us can say that we wouldn’t be just like Peter in our humanity, but with God all things are possible.

God help me if I am ever faced with having to stand for the truth for my life, and by your example on the cross, my I be brought to the virtue of final perseverance.
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I know exactly where you’re coming from and feel the same! :yup:
 
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