Would you tell your friend's wife?

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Over the past year I’ve had several long conversations with my best friend’s wife about various problems we’ve been dealing with. One related issue is pornography and the various attitudes and levels of use/abuse/addiction certain people in our lives have in regards to it and related things like strip clubs, etc. One thing we have in common is that it has caused huge problems in both our lives. Another thing we have in common is that it’s something that we’ve each eliminated as an influence in our own homes and lives. While we both still struggle with friends and family members who see it as either a minor issue or healthy outlet and continue to try to force it on us, we’ve at least managed to ensure that it’s no longer allowed in our homes in any form, and isn’t used or viewed by anyone in our immediate families.

At least, that’s what she thinks.

Her husband has had a huge problem with porn since we were kids. Even when I believed that pornography addiction was a myth, I could see how it was causing issues in his life and relationships. After they got married it got much worse. He would spend hundreds of dollars per month on it, even when they were both unemployed, and at one point had a stash consisting of thousands of magazines and hundreds of videotapes & DVD’s, not to mention everything that was stored on his computers, each of which had additional hard drives just to help store his porn. It led to major problems in their marriage numerous times. His wife took a stand several years ago and forced him to get rid of all his magazines and videos. Instead of actually selling them, he traded them in for store credit at a porn shop and just came home with a collection that was only marginally smaller than what he left with. She eventually got all the magazines and videos out of the house, but that just led to more and larger hard drives and more time spent on porn sites. She took another big stand a couple years ago and he finally admitted to her that he had a problem and agreed to delete everything from their computers and quit going to those sites.

While things were good for a short time, he obviously never actually deleted everything. She had no clue the full extent of his collection, so when he deleted the easy to find stuff in the documents folder of his PC, she had no idea that he had numerous hidden hard drives not only on his PC but hers and their son’s as well. And while he deleted all his favorites from IE, she didn’t know that he could still access those sites using other browsers. On a couple occasions, he’s told me in detail all the ways he still gets to and hides his porn (he was bragging that he still uses it indiscriminately despite her objections).

From what she’s told me, a lot of the problems they’re dealing with now are identical to the problems they were having when he was open about his porn use. She believes it’s just lingering effects of his nearly three decade addiction, as well as the negative influence from certain friends and the media in general. He acknowledges that they’re having issues, but he blames her for a variety of reasons (one of which is her attitude toward porn) and has never truly admitted he has a problem; when he told her that he did, it was simply to get her off his back. It’s clear to me that the porn is still a cause of at least some of their problems; however, everything each of them has told me was in confidence and I’m hesitant to get in the middle. The one time I suggested to her that he might not have cleaned up his act, she got a bit angry with me, so I’m worried that if I say something directly it could harm our friendships. At the same time, though, it’s difficult seeing her suffer, especially when she’s sure that she successfully eliminated this from their lives. While I should probably mind my own business, it’s hard not to speak up when she tells me how grateful to God she is for helping them overcome these problems. This has been eating at me for a while so I thought I’d ask for some opinions.
 
How close are you to her? Does she consider you a friend, or just her husband’s friend? I think this makes a difference.

She has already shown that she would shoot the messenger of bad news, so telling her could get you in trouble. Your friend could also get very angry with you for telling her. Do you think it is worth it to pay the price for trying to help?

I just wonder if your friend can be helped since he does not want to kick his habit. What would telling her the truth actually accomplish?

I don’t know if this helps, but these are some questions you should find answers to and act accordingly.
 
No. I would avoid long conversations with your best friends’s wife about any problems (past or present) in her relationship with her husband. It develops a type of intimacy that is best avoided between people of the opposite sex. She’s a married woman, and the fact that she’s confiding such things in another man points to other marital problems beyond what you have already mentioned.
 
How about you think of a plan so that the wife would find out that he is still using pornography? I think this is the safest way without you being stuck in the middle. i am not sure how though, like if he is keeping his stash locked or hidden. How about his computer, if his wife has access to it. is there a way to record your conversations when you talk about this, and later for some reason the wife accidentally comes through it…

You could recommend to your friend reclaimsexualhealth.com, or the Candeo website as a way to heal from addiction, or go to a therapist. I know that in order to do this, he needs to want to do it.

Sorry to hear about this. Praying for everyone involved, for his healing and conversion.
 
It sounds like she is in denial of her husband still using porn and you should stay out of it. If she is having marriage problems, then encourage her to seek marriage counseling; if he won’t go with her, then she should go herself. Porn is one of the hardest addictions to break and one has to REALLY, REALLY want to stop and then do the work; I doubt if her husband is at that point.
 
Is your wife friendly with his wife? If so, maybe she could casually suggest that it “sounds like your husband is still heavily into the porn unfortunately…” (or something perhaps even less direct or along those lines) if the marital difficulties come up in discussion between the two of them? As a wife, I would definitely want to know if it were my husband, but it can be a very rough situation for all involved and cause the loss of friendships. However, in the case of your friendship with the husband, perhaps the loss of that closeness might even benefit YOU in your faith and marriage in the long run – since he seems as if he could care less about ending the habit? I guess only you would be able to determine that…
Peace to you and Our Lord’s assistance in whatever transpires.
 
Depending on how old her son is, you might suggest technology solutions to help prevent his access to this material. Her husband has to want to help himself, but it might be appropriate if, as a fellow parent, you discuss how you prevent your kids from accessing inappropriate material. It might help her son avoid the traps his father has fallen into (and apparently has no intention of getting out.)
 
No, I would not tell my best friend’s wife but I would tell my best friend about the conversations I have had with his wife first. Then I would stop having those type of conversations with her as they are not productive in any way. The person with the problem is your best friend and he needs you to help him realize this. The deceit that is happening is a vicious circle that can only end when he steps up to the problem he has. He lies to his wife, she confides marital issues to you, you sit and let her think he doesn’t have any issues when you know he does. This can only stop by you discussing it all and helping him realize what he is about to lose as these big stands against pornography take their toll and he may be running out of options. And, I will pray for all of you. I guess I might add that there are many people on this forum who have shared their struggles and successes with pornography, perhaps if you searched the threads you will find some helpful ideas.
 
No. I would avoid long conversations with your best friends’s wife about any problems (past or present) in her relationship with her husband. It develops a type of intimacy that is best avoided between people of the opposite sex. She’s a married woman, and the fact that she’s confiding such things in another man points to other marital problems beyond what you have already mentioned.
Agree with this. This type of conversation with someone else’s wife is not appropriate for either you or her. I’d not only mind my own business, but I would also stop discussing it with either one of them. This is their issue, and they need help that you can’t provide.
 
[snip] is there a way to record your conversations when you talk about this, and later for some reason the wife accidentally comes through it…

[snip]
This could be against the law in many places in the USA. I am not a lawyer, but I would watch out about recordings.

My prayers for each of you.
 
You hit the nail on the head with “I should probably mind my own business.”
 
I agree that you should stop having long discussions with her. Especially if she and your wife aren’t also close. Next time tell her that she needs therapy either individually or with husband. That you don’t know how else to help her. Then only she’s that couple in group situations. Your friendship with the husband is only a good idea if you are a positive influence. If after 30 years he’s still bragging to you about his porn habit than it doesn’t sound like a positive relationship.
 
I do not think you should say anything to her. If you find a way, you could say something to him. He is the one who is your best friend, no?
 
Would I tell her? No. I’d do my very best to make him tell her. And if those efforts fail, if he decides to keep on keepin on, I’d tell them both that I do not want to take part in another conversation about their marital troubles and porn.
 
The husband has secret porn on hidden hard drives on the computers that belong to his wife and son as well?!?!
I think this is necessary information. Exposing one’s children to porn is child sexual abuse, and his purposeful hiding of porn on his wife’s and son’s computer is showing a blatant disregard for the psychological well-being of his family.
If I were you, I would tell them friend that he either confess to his wife and scrubs the porn off of their computers, or you will inform his wife. Give him a specific time frame.
From that point on, I would have a strict policy to not listen to him bragging about his porn use.
As a wife, I know that I would want to know. I would hope that someone cared more about the truth and about the destruction that such porn use was STILL causing than about if someone gets upset about being told upon.
This behavior being described is a form of adultery, and it is causing the husband to mistreat his wife, to lie to her, to treat her as an object, to expose her and their children to vile pictures and videos. It is no small thing.
I would want to know. 😦
 
How close are you to her? Does she consider you a friend, or just her husband’s friend? I think this makes a difference.
All four of us are extremely close to the point that we consider each other family. I was hesitant to bring this up here because of the inevitable comments about not talking to my friend’s wife, etc. We’ve been friends for years and this is the dynamic we’ve always had. She and I have some very similar family problems so we’ve always used each other as a sounding board and a source for a second opinion/different perspective from what our spouse can give. In other words, our respective spouses are sometimes too close to our situations to give an objective opinion so we’ll call or email each other when we need an unbiased take on something or a well-needed, virtual smack in the head. As far as my friend goes, he’s not as much of a talker as she is so if I didn’t talk to her we wouldn’t know half of what’s going on with them. He’ll even ask her to talk to me about stuff he doesn’t feel comfortable talking about. A lot of our hours-long conversations take place with our spouses in the room. There are plenty of things we talk about that they’d get upset over if they heard us discussing it with family, but as long as they know it’s us talking they don’t care. The only time it’s an issue is if it interferes with dinner. We also view marriage the same way–as in, once we say, “I do,” we become one in God’s eyes, so we see each other as extension of our spouse. There’s no more chance of anything inappropriate happening between the two of us than there is between me and my best friend.
She has already shown that she would shoot the messenger of bad news, so telling her could get you in trouble. Your friend could also get very angry with you for telling her. Do you think it is worth it to pay the price for trying to help?
This is probably my biggest concern. I don’t like hearing that they’re having problems but I don’t know if there’s a good way to clue her into the fact that he’s still having issues without getting them both upset. He used to spend a lot of time at strip clubs and when I expressed disbelief that he had cut that out, they were both angry. I think they’d both get over it at some point, but it could take quite a while. In particular, he’s been known to hold grudges and is sometimes notoriously slow to heal from certain things.
I just wonder if your friend can be helped since he does not want to kick his habit. What would telling her the truth actually accomplish?
My hope would be that it might be that one last push that gets him to see this as a problem. It would also give her some peace of mind so that she quits wondering why they’re still having problems and blaming herself for the things that go wrong. I don’t know that there’s really a good answer or solution here, which really frustrates me.
 
Is your wife friendly with his wife? If so, maybe she could casually suggest that it “sounds like your husband is still heavily into the porn unfortunately…” (or something perhaps even less direct or along those lines) if the marital difficulties come up in discussion between the two of them? As a wife, I would definitely want to know if it were my husband, but it can be a very rough situation for all involved and cause the loss of friendships. However, in the case of your friendship with the husband, perhaps the loss of that closeness might even benefit YOU in your faith and marriage in the long run – since he seems as if he could care less about ending the habit? I guess only you would be able to determine that…
Peace to you and Our Lord’s assistance in whatever transpires.
I suggested this to my wife but she doesn’t feel at all comfortable discussing anyone’s porn use, let alone this situation in particular. She doesn’t even feel comfortable saying something like, “well, when things were like that in our marriage…” then suggesting that she look into it more.

I’ve tried discussing this with my friend but it’s been difficult getting him to accept that it can be a problem for anyone. He’s been able to acknowledge that certain aspects of his use are problematic (mainly the financial issues), but he doesn’t believe that porn use in general is a problem for him. He has softened some a bit in that regard in that he at least listens to what I say and admits when his arguments fall flat. It’s another one of those areas where I’m having a hard time coming up with things to say to him that really get through, though. I’ve tried to convince him to discuss it with his wife since, if it’s truly not a problem then she shouldn’t have an issue with it. He feels she has an unrealistic take on it, though, and he knows she’d feel betrayed after everything else that’s happened.

As for whether my friendship with him is a positive influence, I believe it is, although I think he benefits from it more than I do. To be clear, he’s my closest friend and I love him like a brother, but as far as our individual actions influencing the other, that’s where he reaps more than he sows. We rely on each other for camaraderie and moral support, and I do what I can to give a positive example, especially in this area. He and his wife play a big role in our lives because they’re a couple of the only people we can rely on unconditionally.

I’ve considered that she’s in denial over this. She sees a counselor on a semi-regular basis but I don’t know if this comes up at all. My wife and I have both tried to lead by example inasmuch as we’ve tried to show her that the problems they’re still having are absent from our marriage. I think she may get it on some level, but not to the point where she’s willing to confront him or address it.
 
Does your wife even know that your best friend’s wife is emailing you regarding private issues?

If your wife doesn’t know you are emailing each other regarding relationship issues then I think this is very wrong. How would you feel if your wife would see your best friend or will be emailing him regarding personal matters such as these without your consent.

I hate to say this but many infidelities start out as friendship, why put your marriage at risk.
 
The husband has secret porn on hidden hard drives on the computers that belong to his wife and son as well?!?!
I think this is necessary information. Exposing one’s children to porn is child sexual abuse, and his purposeful hiding of porn on his wife’s and son’s computer is showing a blatant disregard for the psychological well-being of his family.
If I were you, I would tell them friend that he either confess to his wife and scrubs the porn off of their computers, or you will inform his wife. Give him a specific time frame.
From that point on, I would have a strict policy to not listen to him bragging about his porn use.
As a wife, I know that I would want to know. I would hope that someone cared more about the truth and about the destruction that such porn use was STILL causing than about if someone gets upset about being told upon.
This behavior being described is a form of adultery, and it is causing the husband to mistreat his wife, to lie to her, to treat her as an object, to expose her and their children to vile pictures and videos. It is no small thing.
I would want to know. 😦
That’s one of the more curious things about his situation, is that he has their son’s computer locked down with the strictest parental controls he can put on it. His computer is in the living room and he’s only allowed to use it when they’re present (he doesn’t even have the password). He’s also gone to great lengths to hide, password protect and encrypt the drives so that nobody other than him can get to them (without going into all the detail, I’m pretty confident that even I wouldn’t be able to show the drives exist, let alone get to them). Discussing the potential impact it could have on his son is one of the few ways I’ve been able to make any headway with him. He has a hard time defending it as a harmless pastime when I point out how they strict they are about letting their son see anything close to it and all the convoluted things he’s done to hide his collection. And just for the sake of getting it out of his house physically, I’ve argued with him over why on earth he’d ever need half a dozen 1-2 TB hard drives full of it.

I’ve also addressed it from the adultery point of view. He dismissed entirely this the first time I brought it up but took the time to listen the last time I mentioned it. He’s been working on his faith life a bit recently so taking that approach at least gets him to pay attention but it only gets me so far. If nothing else, dealing with him serves as a reminder of just how damaging a problem this is.
 
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