Yes, how the liturgy is celebrated DOES matter!!

[Laetus]

But you are. You are talking about someone making a mistake. You aren’t talking about someone intentionally messing up the Mass.

If you are, you haven’t given any evidence of that.

It’s not a “mistake” for him. It’s what he does.

 

[Laetus]

Are you a lector? No, you must not be. If you were, you would know that even lectors who are prepared and experienced (as maltmom was not) have made mistakes. The reason for that is that we are human beings, and human beings have been known to make the occasional error.
That is not indifference, it is not sloppiness, it is not failure to care – it is human. And Christ left His Church in the care of humans. Perhaps you should tell Him you think that was a mistake.

No, but I am a commissioned reader.

 

[Laetus]

I do get and somewhat agree with what you are saying. However, when I feel close to our Lord at the celebration of the Mass it doesn’t matter as much to me if everything wasn’t done to everyone’s specific liking.

There is a very big difference between liturgical abuse and and accepted practices in a diocese. Certainly, I would prefer a certain type of Mass, but that doesn’t happen to be available to me. The Mass at my parish has been directed and approved by my Bishop and I consider that to be good enough for me.

Luckily, I`m able to ignore relatively insignificant details and focus on both the Liturgy of the Word and Liturgy of the Eucharist. I will pray that you will also be able to experience that peace.

However, the people leaving the Church that you spoke of… do you know where they are choosing to go instead… let me know… that would be an interesting discussion.

This is not a matter of “if everything wasn’t done to everyone’s specific liking.”

 

[Laetus]

Have you ever made an appointment, sat down and had a heart-to-heart, honest talk with the pastor, leaving the antagonistic, rude attitude you have displayed on this thread at the door?

Are you involved (or willing to become involved) of part of your parishes “liturgy committee”, teaching adult faith-formation classes, being a sacristan, being a reader or helping to train readers & sacrastans?

And I don’t want to hear, “well, I tried, but everything is too ‘clique-y’, the pastor doesn’t like me or my ideas, or the woman run everything…, etc.”, because I am really tired of hearing that same old excuse.

If you don’t like what is going on in your parish, GET INVOLVED!
And if you don’t want to do that, then, to be quite honest, IMHO, you have no right to complain.

I really shouldn’t respond to your antagonistic and rude comments but I will. Yes I have spoke to my pastor about this stuff long ago when I thought there might be a possibility of actual renewal. While I will be the first to say a handful of serious abuses did finally get addressed, it’s clear there will be no action when it comes to celebrating Masses with greater care and reverence. It’s just not going to happen.

You speak about a non-extant liturgy committee which is probably a good thing. It was actually worse when we did have a liturgy committee. The people “in charge of the liturgy” do a horrible job and they have for upwards of 15 years. Their annual pilgrammages to the LA Worship Conference in Orange County are notorious. They guard their fiefs as if their lives depended on it. The fighting amongst themselves is painful to watch. It’s brutal and it’s a big waste of time. In turn they aren’t very respected by us pew sitters. They are largely ignored and looked down upon and they realize they are, as does the pastor. There is absolutely no way I would get sucked into that * even if it was possible to get involved. It’s not! It’s a closed shop. Do you understand that?* It makes no difference though. Getting more involved with those people would be a prime way of eventually leaving the Church.

 

[robwar]

Actually you are quite correct. He was originally rejected for the program as being unfit. A couple of weeks of maneuvering and he was in. I am told his wife did his homework for him.

your attitude is amazing. being told that his wife did his homework for him is a rumor and you don’t know if that is true. Why don’t you pray for him or go to another parish. partaking in rumors and “being told” and then spreading it around, especially on the internet is sin.
your complaints about your parish and the running of the mass seems very harsh and unforgiving. it’s a shame. you are there to receive Jesus in the Eucharist the source and summit of our faith. some of our most amazing saints were men with learning problems such as this deacon and like Fr. Solanus Casey, St. John Vianney, St. John Cuperton and to belittle this duly ordained Deacon on the internet is shameful. I am a lector and I know that sometimes I have made mistakes in reading. We are all human and God still loves us and uses us. Going to mass to pick apart what the priest or deacon or others who are serving is worse than the mistakes you are complaining about.

 

[Laetus]

your attitude is amazing. being told that his wife did his homework for him is a rumor and you don’t know if that is true. Why don’t you pray for him or go to another parish. partaking in rumors and “being told” and then spreading it around, especially on the internet is sin.
your complaints about your parish and the running of the mass seems very harsh and unforgiving. it’s a shame. you are there to receive Jesus in the Eucharist the source and summit of our faith. some of our most amazing saints were men with learning problems such as this deacon and like Fr. Solanus Casey, St. John Vianney, St. John Cuperton and to belittle this duly ordained Deacon on the internet is shameful. I am a lector and I know that sometimes I have made mistakes in reading. We are all human and God still loves us and uses us. Going to mass to pick apart what the priest or deacon or others who are serving is worse than the mistakes you are complaining about.

Actually it’s not… Of course you’re not aware of the details. Comparing this man to Fr. Solanus Casey, St. John Vianney, St. John Cuperton is offensive.

You are trying to compare sometimes making a mistake with what this man does to the celebration of the Mass? How sad this thread why hijacked about discussing this man. Tomorrow our very gentle PV will be the celebrant so he will BE CERTAIN to be there. The pastor does a somewhat decent job of reining him in but when it’s a visiting priest or the PV he’s free to do as he pleases and it gets ugly. Oh joy!

 

[maltmom]

Laetus, I went back to the beginning of the thread. I saw where you have 3 churches in your area and that going to one of the others is not an option. You mentioned looking at the church listings for LA. You said that you are on the west coast. Are you close enough to try one of the churches there? I truly would love for you to find a church where you can find a Mass where you can worship God and feel at peace. I will pray that you are able to do so.

 

[robwar]

Actually it’s not… Of course you’re not aware of the details. Comparing this man to Fr. Solanus Casey, St. John Vianney, St. John Cuperton is offensive.

You are trying to compare sometimes making a mistake with what this man does to the celebration of the Mass? How sad this thread why hijacked about discussing this man. Tomorrow our very gentle PV will be the celebrant so he will BE CERTAIN to be there. The pastor does a somewhat decent job of reining him in but when it’s a visiting priest or the PV he’s free to do as he pleases and it gets ugly. Oh joy!

you are the one who brought your Deacon up and from what you yourself described is someone who might have LD of some sort and to “gossip” about him over a public forum such as this. your lack of compassion because he doesn’t do the mass to your liking is so sad. reverence in mass starts with you, your attitude and deposition. to go around and blame others such as this deacon for what you are considering is wrong is pathetic.

 

[agnes_therese]

No, but I am a commissioned reader.

And you’ve never, ever made a mistake as a commissioned reader? Wow. You are the only one I’ve ever heard of.

 

[Cat]

Laetus, I went back to the beginning of the thread. I saw where you have 3 churches in your area and that going to one of the others is not an option. You mentioned looking at the church listings for LA. You said that you are on the west coast. Are you close enough to try one of the churches there? I truly would love for you to find a church where you can find a Mass where you can worship God and feel at peace. I will pray that you are able to do so.

I kind of think that this will never happen with Laetus.

Laetus, what do you WANT us to tell you? What do you WANT to happen? Please tell us what your best-case scenario is.

Many of us have made suggestions, which in most cases, you have rejected, and you have accused many of us of judging you harshly.

I was especially shocked that you took Oneofthewomen to task for suggesting that you get involved with your parish. I thought that her suggestion made a lot of sense, and according to you, this will never make a difference.

So what WILL make a difference? I’m stymied here, buddy!

If you read back in the thread, you will see that I am prepared to concede that in some respects, you are right and that many Masses are celebrated in a lackluster style. So I’m not your enemy.

But I am really getting discouraged here, reading all your negative answers to all the people who are trying to help you out. I’m getting the feeling that you want Pope Benedict XVI to swoop down upon your diocese, draw and quarter your bishop, take all your priests and deacons back to Rome for re-training, and and take over your parish himself, bringing with him all his crew of priests, musicians, Master of Ceremony, altar servers, lectors, cantors, etc. so that the Mass in your parish will be utterly sublime.

You know this isn’t going to happen, right?

So what DO you want to happen? I’m not following you at all, and I’m not sure what you want all of us to say to you. I think other CAF posters are having some of the same thoughts I’m sharing with you now.

Help us out here. Give us some clues about what you think needs to happen. Just one thing–please keep it practical. You say that you want the Mass to be celebrated with greater care and reverence. What specifically needs to happen for the Mass in your parish to be celebrated with care and reverence (besides dumping this deacon who you claim is a pretender to the dioconate)? Who needs to step in, what does that person (people) need to do, how much money is involved, etc.–keep it practical.

Thanks!