Yes, I am sinner , but I am saved sinner.

[JoeyWarren]

You fail to understand, however, that when one is born again they are a new creation in Christ Jesus … **we are not given a license to sin **… we are dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus. Read Romans 8:1 on the power of sanctification … and Romans 6 on righteousness and sanctification for further edification.

Charlye

You are one of those that believe once you are saved, you are impervious to sin. You are so wrong.

Read it in context first with respect to the entire New Testament then come back and you can chat with those here.

 

[Kitty_Chan]

Hi JoeyWarren,
As I told you before, I understand and agree that the “once saved always saved” mentality can be very dangerous for those who use it as an excuse to “live like the devil and not worry about the penalty”.
We are told to “Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?” (2 Corintians 13:5)
Those who do not show the fruits of true faith are likely fooling themselves about even having true faith. We should always be trying to obey and please our Lord and God in gratitude for His wonderful Grace.
God Bless.

brkn1

hello, just reading this thread and wanted to add a hear hear to your thoughts.

I always liked a line from Vertigo by U2

“and though your soul it cant be bought, your mind can wander. . .”

 

[charlye]

You are one of those that believe once you are saved, you are impervious to sin. You are so wrong.

Read it in context first with respect to the entire New Testament then come back and you can chat with those here.

Did I say I was impervious to sin? Don’t be absurd. Your argument that a born again Christian can sin all he wants and “never mind the consequences” is preposterous.

When believers sin, and we all do, we have an advocate in Christ Jesus, who lives to intercede for us to the Father. Our only intercessor, by the way. I am eternally secure because I have placed my faith in Jesus and have the Holy Spirit as the pledge of my inheritance.

And I have no problem reading Scripture in context because my guide is the Holy Spirit … not the RC magisterium. Why don’t you just read the Scriptural references and then we’ll “chat”.

Charlye

 

[DCD]

Charlye,

The problem with this : “And I have no problem reading Scripture in context because my guide is the Holy Spirit … not the RC magisterium.” Then the Holy Spirit is leading millions of people in tens of thousands of denominations into disarray not all truth.

Peace,
David

 

[JoeyWarren]

Charlye said:
Did I say I was impervious to sin? Don’t be absurd. Your argument that a born again Christian can sin all he wants and “never mind the consequences” is preposterous.

It’s not my argument. It’s the logical result in an OSAS belief.

 

[JoeyWarren]

When believers sin, and we all do, we have an advocate in Christ Jesus, who lives to intercede for us to the Father. Our only intercessor, by the way. I am eternally secure because I have placed my faith in Jesus and have the Holy Spirit as the pledge of my inheritance.

Do you have peope ask you to pray for them? If so, you then become an intercessor. You are interceding on their behalf. People like you, try your best to quote 1 Tim 2:5 out of context. You completely ignore previous verses;

Originally posted by Paul to Timothy:
1 I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
2 For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

Here is how you read this scripture:

-]
As Posted by Paul: 1 I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
2 For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
/-]5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

 

[JoeyWarren]

One intercessor? Are you sure?

Originally posted by Paul:
Rom 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

Rom 8:27 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.

Rom 8:34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

Rom 11:2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel saying,

1Ti 2:1 I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;

Read the Bible without the filtering Protestant Glasses.

 

[charlye]

Charlye,

The problem with this : “And I have no problem reading Scripture in context because my guide is the Holy Spirit … not the RC magisterium.” Then the Holy Spirit is leading millions of people in tens of thousands of denominations into disarray not all truth.

Peace,
David

Hi David … you might be a bit more careful in what you say about the Holy Spirit. He is not divisive … He leads all believers into all truth with no help from anyone.

What you fail, or refuse, to recognize is that when a person becomes a born again Christian, he/she isn’t relying on a church/denomination/ritual … it is a one-on-one experience with God’s Holy Spirit. And that person is then guided by the Holy Spirit in his/her spiritual growth, which includes reading of Scripture.

Do you believe that I could not be indwelt by the Holy Spirit because I am not a roman catholic? Do you believe that the Holy Spirit works only through your church … or does He work individually through the people?

Charlye

 

[JoeyWarren]

Hi David … you might be a bit more careful in what you say about the Holy Spirit. He is not divisive … He leads all believers into all truth with no help from anyone.

What you fail, or refuse, to recognize is that when a person becomes a born again Christian, he/she isn’t relying on a church/denomination/ritual … it is a one-on-one experience with God’s Holy Spirit. And that person is then guided by the Holy Spirit in his/her spiritual growth, which includes reading of Scripture.

Do you believe that I could not be indwelt by the Holy Spirit because I am not a roman catholic? Do you believe that the Holy Spirit works only through your church … or does He work individually through the people?

Charlye

Charlye, let’s say that you and I are the only two people left on the face of the earth.

Charlye you have the Holy Spirit and have interpreted scripture. I Have the Holy Spirit and have interpreted scripture. Our Interpretations are different. Only one of us can be right. God has only one Truth not Two.

One of us is Of God and the other is not.

If we both claim to possess the Holy Spirit with the gift of interpretation, Why should I believe your interpretation over mine?

 

[charlye]

Charlye, let’s say that you and I are the only two people left on the face of the earth.

Charlye you have the Holy Spirit and have interpreted scripture. I Have the Holy Spirit and have interpreted scripture. Our Interpretations are different. Only one of us can be right. God has only one Truth not Two.

One of us is Of God and the other is not.

If we both claim to possess the Holy Spirit with the gift of interpretation, Why should I believe your interpretation over mine?

If we are both indwelt by the Holy Spirit, Joey, our interpretations will be the same, as it is He who interprets Scripture for us. It is not an individual revelation.

I believe it comes down to whether or not one knows he/she is indwelt by the Spirit of God. The Holy Spirit will not condone anything that is in total opposition to the inspired word of God, so if you’re looking for validation for uninspired tradition, you’re on your own.

You didn’t answer my question. Do you believe the Holy Spirit works through individual people? Or is it only in conjunction with your church as a whole?

Charlye

 

[JoeyWarren]

You didn’t answer my question. Do you believe the Holy Spirit works through individual people? Or is it only in conjunction with your church as a whole?

Yes to both.

 

[JoeyWarren]

If we are both indwelt by the Holy Spirit, Joey, our interpretations will be the same, as it is He who interprets Scripture for us. It is not an individual revelation.

Start a new thread on this subject and I will engage you on it.

 

[Researcher]

I have always felt that those who believe “once saved always saved” are taking a big gamble with their eternaty. To base ones hope in salvation on one small phrase in the Paul’s letter to the Romans is rolling for a long shot.

Certainly, we can not merit our own salvation by our works if we have been presented with the teachings of Jesus Christ. We must fully accept Jesus into our hearts and our minds. This is the point of Baptism. Our former self dies and we are reborn in Jesus. This is what it originally meant to be born again.

We must also include with this however what Paul tells to the Collosians that having the faith to move mountains is worthless if we do not have love. So what is this love? It is the devotion to God with all our heart, mind, soul and strength. It is caring for our neighbors in need. In short, we must put our faith into action - we must do these good works of charity. Paul even states that amoung faith, hope, and love the greatest of these is love. So clearly we must do these good works to complete our salvation.

The devil has more faith in Jesus than any of us do.

Faith and works go together like a hand in glove. They must not be seperated as Paul tells us.

 

[Researcher]

If we are both indwelt by the Holy Spirit, Joey, our interpretations will be the same, as it is He who interprets Scripture for us. It is not an individual revelation.

I believe it comes down to whether or not one knows he/she is indwelt by the Spirit of God. The Holy Spirit will not condone anything that is in total opposition to the inspired word of God, so if you’re looking for validation for uninspired tradition, you’re on your own.

You didn’t answer my question. Do you believe the Holy Spirit works through individual people? Or is it only in conjunction with your church as a whole?

Charlye

The Holy Spirit can and does exist in us all. But did not the Holy Spirit first come to the church at Pentacost? So what I interprit today from reading scripture must be consistant with what was inspired back then. Does this not have reason as a basis? If my interpritation is not consistant than then one of us does not have the Holy Spirit but a deceptive spirit for there is only one truth and that has always been within the church founded by Jesus. It is this church that was given the authority to forgive and bind sins. It was Peter who received the keys to the kingdom. It is Peter’s successor who sits on the chair in Rome.