You can pay me back

[JRKH]

I find it interesting that you second and thrd posts paint a considerably different picture of your FIL than your OP did…where you stated that he was normally - “generous and sweet”…

Makes it really hard to offer valid advice when getting such incomplete and conflicting (name removed by moderator)ut.

Ahhh well…such is the fun of the internet…

Peace
James

 

[JLCecilia]

JRKH, I know, I know. I still believe above all of this garbage that he is a decent man, I think I just got siderailed defending myself. I don’t need to be so snarky.

 

[rayne89]

I don’t think that FIL is really sacrificing anything. For Pete’s sake, he went out and bought himself a new tractor and hay bailer with HIS money and you can bet he didn’t consult his wife on that. A freak hail storm hits and he goes out and buys a shelter and has a it installed underground. I think his WIFE is the one doing the sacrificing b/c you KNOW she’s mortified by the state of their home. Two of the doors to their house aren’t even usable b/c of settling, so we have to come in through the garage or use the side door that he doesn’t bother weedeating or cleaning off the wasps nests. He hit a deer in his wife’s suburban and it was technically totalled, but he drug his feet replacing it and she really didn’t even get much of a say in what he replaced it with. If they still had the darn thing, they coulda taken the kids in their car and we wouldn’t be having this discussion.

I’m not disagreeing with you. I get this more than you think I do. I wasn’t really asking the question in regards to your FIL. The statement by itself outside of your FIL’s behavior struck me because some parents will sacrifice their own comforts to help even grown children. So the statement without the back story didn’t seem like some you as person would feel.

My MIL has to ask permission from her husband to come visit us. One time he gave her a list of chores she had get done before she could come. She accepts a lot of behavior from her husband that infuriates me. My FIL does what he wants, when he wants, how he wants.

My husband doesn’t like conflict -he too does not voice an opinion much. And I also manage the money. I think (and I could be mistaken) you would like your hubby to say “You know dad I appreciate you wanting to help us with the van. I realize the rotors need to be replaced we can afford to do that but this other little stuff can we wait until we can afford to pay for it ourselves. I’d rather pay for it when I can afford it than have you lend us the money.”
But the problem is your husband doesn’t want conflict with his dad so he’d rather do what is dad wants than disagree with his dad’s suggestion. Which is incredibly frustrating to you because you resent being put in this position, and resent owing money unnecessarily. And you FIL does things that irritate you in general and this is just one more thing to add to the list.

You aren’t wrong. The problem isn’t really your FIL. Your DH is not the kind of person that would say “I appreciate it but we don’t need to do all that right now” and/or the kind person that says “Let me talk it over with the wife because she is more familiar with our budget and see how this all fits in.” That doesn’t make him a bad husband. Everyone has strengths and weaknesses. Add the fact that FIL loaned your husband money to do something that caused conflict in your marriage. And you are still working through that.

Whatever decision you make, I would try the one that causes the conflict between you and your husband. You took a blow with the vasectomy. If accepting this money will only add resentment in your marriage you will weaken it further. But forcing your husband out of his comfort zone could add resentment on his part. Only you know your relationship well enough to to make that decision -and possibly your priest could assist you in counsel if you have a one that is familiar with your difficulties and who’s advise you trust.

 

[JLCecilia]

I know this is easier said than done, and it’s a little self-centered for me to make DH choose, but this is one of those leave-and-cleave situations where I’d rather DH chose me over his dad. Even if he feels stiffed, I highly doubt FIL would hold it over our head and pout and refuse to ever help us again. I’m kind of curious why DH has any qualms at all about saying no to his dad. I think it’s one of those ‘I’ll never hear the end of it b/c he’ll nag me till I do it’ things. If only that worked for ME!

 

[JRKH]

JRKH, I know, I know. I still believe above all of this garbage that he is a decent man, I think I just got siderailed defending myself. I don’t need to be so snarky.

Understood…Of course I hope you know that you don’t have to “defend yourself” with us. All we are trying to do is give our best opinion based on the data provided. What you do with the feedback is entirely up to you.
After all, you know the situation better than we do.

Peace
James

 

[Xantippe]

Rayne89 said:

“You aren’t wrong. The problem isn’t really your FIL. Your DH is not the kind of person that would say “I appreciate it but we don’t need to do all that right now” and/or the kind person that says “Let me talk it over with the wife because she is more familiar with our budget and see how this all fits in.””

That is very true. I would add, though, that the OP’s husband needs to start being that person, just for the sake of their marriage. He cannot be off Lone Ranger-ing with the family finances. “I need to talk to my wife/husband about that,” is one of the great stalling tactics, and I think every husband or wife needs to learn to use it. I use it on tradespeople and anybody who is trying to sell me something I don’t want to buy right now. Plus, it’s just good marital practice not to make any major purchases without spousal buy-in.

 

[JLCecilia]

Well, that’s that. I should have known DH would side w/ his dad. No matter the reasons he gave me last night, I still think bottom line is he just can’t say no to his dad. He was valid to say that regardless of how I feel about it all, it doesn’t change the fact that the car needs fixed and there’s no guarantee that it will hang on four more months till we get our return. And then we proceeded to argue about money. I told him we will just pay for it ourselves out of our Christmas Club money and just not do all the other things we wanted to do. I may be making him ‘pay’ for it in a sense, but I still an very opposed to ‘owing’ anybody money. There’s just this underlying feeling of - well, if you didn’t have so many d**n kids, you wouldn’t be in this predicament. Yes, wounded pride. To add insult to injury, I have to go without my car for a week while the mechanic looks at it and stuck with MIL’s car that doesn’t have enough seating for all of my children in case I need to run an errand. I know, I know, it’s only a week, but it’s just one more straw being heaped on me.

He said accepting his dad’s offer is no different than MY dad just giving us money left and right. I told him we should just pay back my dad for the $1k he gave us that didn’t end up going for what it was supposed to (not that he’d care) and pay DH’s dad back for the vasectomy and make a pact not to allow monetary gifts from our parents any more. He will never have a leg to stand on b/c of borrowing $$ for the vasectomy and I will never have a leg to stand on b/c my parents paid my dental bill.

He said if he had to, he would go back to his old job where could go back to making better money, the sacrifice would be that he wouldn’t be getting the 3-5 of experience in programming that’s required for him to ultimately get the job we’re both banking on for me to be able to quit and stay home. Neither this option (possibly NEVER gaining the experience he needs and being stuck in a dead-end job and not moving up the pay scale) nor living in THIS budget for another 3 years are very appealing to me. All hopes of being a SAHM are dashed at this point. I am going to miss out on the the most precious years of my last baby’s life.

From bad to worse.

 

[Xantippe]

JLCecilia said:

“And then we proceeded to argue about money. I told him we will just pay for it ourselves out of our Christmas Club money and just not do all the other things we wanted to do.”

That is totally sensible. If you could repay FIL’s loan, you can replenish your Christmas fund.

“To add insult to injury, I have to go without my car for a week while the mechanic looks at it and stuck with MIL’s car that doesn’t have enough seating for all of my children in case I need to run an errand. I know, I know, it’s only a week, but it’s just one more straw being heaped on me.”

A whole week? Wow. Our car has also been a frequent visitor lately to Club Mechanic, but it has never taken that long, even when it had mystery ailments that the mechanic couldn’t figure out.

“He said accepting his dad’s offer is no different than MY dad just giving us money left and right.”

Tell him that when FIL gives you guys cash, you’ll take the cash. You’re not taking loans from your family, after all.

It’s OK if you and your husband both decide that you’re not going to take any loans or any cash gifts from either side of the family, but is that really realistic in your situation? It sounds like you guys are on the knife edge, and all you need is a light push, and you’ll need more money. Ask him if that’s what he really wants.

“I told him we should just pay back my dad for the $1k he gave us that didn’t end up going for what it was supposed to (not that he’d care) and pay DH’s dad back for the vasectomy and make a pact not to allow monetary gifts from our parents any more. He will never have a leg to stand on b/c of borrowing $$ for the vasectomy and I will never have a leg to stand on b/c my parents paid my dental bill.”

Can you get him to agree to not take any loans from his family without getting your approval? And you can agree in return not to take any cash gifts from your family without his approval?

 

[Xantippe]

JLCecilia said:

“He said if he had to, he would go back to his old job where could go back to making better money, the sacrifice would be that he wouldn’t be getting the 3-5 of experience in programming that’s required for him to ultimately get the job we’re both banking on for me to be able to quit and stay home. Neither this option (possibly NEVER gaining the experience he needs and being stuck in a dead-end job and not moving up the pay scale) nor living in THIS budget for another 3 years are very appealing to me.”

Oh–so there is an end-point. It sounds very unpleasant and humbling to go so long not having what you want, but if it’s just for the next three years, try to make peace with that.

“All hopes of being a SAHM are dashed at this point. I am going to miss out on the the most precious years of my last baby’s life.”

I’m more worried about your marriage at the moment. It doesn’t sound like you are functioning as a team right now financially and in relation to families of origin. Combine that with religious issues (the vasectomy) and you have a lot of disagreements in areas that are vital for a functioning marriage. Your marriage is making funny sounds and giving out clouds of oily smoke–it’s time to take it to the shop.

Don’t catastrophize about never, ever being able to be a SAHM. If you get more financially comfortable, you may find that your bigger kids need more and more help as they get older. A lot of women quit later in life, as they discover how much management and supervision tweens and teens need.

 

[PennyinCanada]

To be honest it sounds like you’re letting your own ego get in the way of good sense.

Perhaps in their family gifts of large sums of cash like that aren’t a thing for them and self-sufficiency was valued, however in that situation your FIL understood you were in a bind and forwarded you the money. Yet your reaction to this seems to be finding ways to justify you being defensive about it --perhaps embarassment or shame that he’s helping you out (again)?

Because it seems weird you are attacking him for being generous because it has some sort of emotional benefit for him. So what? That’s a part of human nature, our egos and emotions reward our compassion. If I were to feed a homeless man a sandwich, am I not allowed to feel good about it even though my motivation was to not see a man starve?

Pride is a bitter pill to swallow, especially in a situation where your humility is forced by circumstance, but what you basically said is that “My ego is too big to allow my father in law to have any sort of satisfaction in helping my family out. I’d rather put my car out of commission or put my kids in a potential death trap rather than let him ‘win’.”

It’s an act of love, don’t let your pride assume that he’s trying to antagonize or belittle you.

I didn’t read all the opinions and posts. My husband and I were chatting about what we would do with the money if we won the lottery. The first thing I said was that I would love to give his sisters money to do the repairs around their homes that need fixing, just so it can get done and they can have some peace of mind. Nothing like having an old furnace that may konk out in the middle of winter or a vehicle on it’s last legs, and the roof needs a repair too. Too many expensive things at once can make one worry.

Interestingly enough, my husband said they may or may not take the money, but you can be sure they’ll hate you for it. I totally had no idea what the heck he was talking about. Then I read your post. Really??? Someone is offering you money so you and your kids can be safe in a vehicle, and you are angry? I would give him a hug and kiss and say Thank You for your kindness. We will be happy to pay you back in a few months. I would not be holding any resentment or bitterness in my heart for such a kindness.

As for nit-picking that it’s a loan. Big deal. If my parents gave me a gift, I am still their ‘child’. When 2 men are involved, and one says it’s a loan, it’s treating him like an equal. Of course he can pay it back, he’s a capable person, able to take care of his family. Also, if there are siblings that may start complaining and mumbling that ‘mom and dad gave them money and we never saw a cent from them when we could have used some cash too’, well guess what, dad can say it’s a loan and not a gift, so mind your own business. I certainly had an in-law who was like that, who could ruin Christmas because someone else got a gift that was more expensive then hers, and she was in her 40’s. Honestly, what a way to ruin relationships. She would make hard feelings over a few bucks.

As a Catholic, I wish to remind you that sterilization is a mortal sin. Please do not partake in the Eucharist until you have gone to confession and had repentance for cutting off God’s grace in your marriage. I"m sorry, I could not let that comment slide, about waiting to be able to pay for it yourselves. It sounds like you didn’t have an issue with the surgery, only that he borrowed the money from family for it. I don’t know, maybe he’s not a Catholic, but it had to be said, if not for you, then for whoever might be reading this thread.

 

[Xantippe]

PennyinCanada said:

“As for nit-picking that it’s a loan. Big deal. If my parents gave me a gift, I am still their ‘child’. When 2 men are involved, and one says it’s a loan, it’s treating him like an equal. Of course he can pay it back, he’s a capable person, able to take care of his family.”

They already owe FIL for a previous debt and it doesn’t sound like they are any closer to being able to pay that off. It sounds like it will be several years until their financial situation improves.

This is setting the stage for a lot of hurt feelings. The OP already feels bad about this loan and bad about the relationship.

You can look all through the Bible and not find any reference to debt as being a good thing, or loans being a good way to help family members. And yes, there are lots of mentions of debt in the Bible, and every single one I am familiar with is negative.

See Proverbs 22:7: “The borrower is the slave of the lender.” There are lots more.

“Also, if there are siblings that may start complaining and mumbling that ‘mom and dad gave them money and we never saw a cent from them when we could have used some cash too’, well guess what, dad can say it’s a loan and not a gift, so mind your own business.”

If there are other siblings, the FIL can write it into his will that the unpaid loan balance can be subtracted from the OP’s husband’s share of the estate. That’s if there is an estate, of course, but I strongly suspect there will be one.

“As a Catholic, I wish to remind you that sterilization is a mortal sin. Please do not partake in the Eucharist until you have gone to confession and had repentance for cutting off God’s grace in your marriage. I"m sorry, I could not let that comment slide, about waiting to be able to pay for it yourselves. It sounds like you didn’t have an issue with the surgery, only that he borrowed the money from family for it. I don’t know, maybe he’s not a Catholic, but it had to be said, if not for you, then for whoever might be reading this thread.”

The OP is quite aware of that, and she is an innocent party. That was part of the offense of the past loan that it was for a vasectomy for her husband, which she did not want him to have, and furthermore did not want to pay for with a loan from FIL. The OP’s husband and his father already have a track record of leaving the OP out of the loop with regard to major financial transactions. (It’s possible that this is tit-for-tat for previous cash gifts from the OP’s family, but in that case, both the OP and her husband need to get together and approve any further gifts and loans together. The OP’s husband is married to her, not his dad.)

 

[Mrs_Sally]

You are both emotionally dependent on your parents instead of each other it sounds like. Your DH is still looking to dad to help him make the ‘right’ decision and you are looking to your parents to still treat you like their 'little girl" with random gifts and spoiling.

Car repairs and dental work are important - and usually only get more expensive if put off. The vasectomy aside (because that is not really about money), those are expense that it is good to get taken care of.

It sounds like you and DH do have a savings plan (the Christmas fund) that you both need to stick to better. Re-prioritize your spending so that you can save up for major repairs and bigger things. You may need to scale down on things like Christmas presents, hobbies, and other entertainment. Thankfully at your kids young ages, there is tons of free and low-cost fun like a picnic at the park or making blanket forts on snow days!

You’ll need to be willing to give up the gifts from your parents (that aren’t actual presents for birthdays/Christmas) just as you want him to give up the loans from his family. It sounds like he feels just as uncomfortable taking money from your parents as you do from his.

The poster who said that this is all about much more than money was right. Pray for your husband and your marriage. A strong marriage will get you through much worse troubles than paying for car repairs!

Well, that’s that. I should have known DH would side w/ his dad. No matter the reasons he gave me last night, I still think bottom line is he just can’t say no to his dad. He was valid to say that regardless of how I feel about it all, it doesn’t change the fact that the car needs fixed and there’s no guarantee that it will hang on four more months till we get our return. And then we proceeded to argue about money. I told him we will just pay for it ourselves out of our Christmas Club money and just not do all the other things we wanted to do. I may be making him ‘pay’ for it in a sense, but I still an very opposed to ‘owing’ anybody money. There’s just this underlying feeling of - well, if you didn’t have so many d**n kids, you wouldn’t be in this predicament. Yes, wounded pride. To add insult to injury, I have to go without my car for a week while the mechanic looks at it and stuck with MIL’s car that doesn’t have enough seating for all of my children in case I need to run an errand. I know, I know, it’s only a week, but it’s just one more straw being heaped on me.

He said accepting his dad’s offer is no different than MY dad just giving us money left and right. I told him we should just pay back my dad for the $1k he gave us that didn’t end up going for what it was supposed to (not that he’d care) and pay DH’s dad back for the vasectomy and make a pact not to allow monetary gifts from our parents any more. He will never have a leg to stand on b/c of borrowing $$ for the vasectomy and I will never have a leg to stand on b/c my parents paid my dental bill.

He said if he had to, he would go back to his old job where could go back to making better money, the sacrifice would be that he wouldn’t be getting the 3-5 of experience in programming that’s required for him to ultimately get the job we’re both banking on for me to be able to quit and stay home. Neither this option (possibly NEVER gaining the experience he needs and being stuck in a dead-end job and not moving up the pay scale) nor living in THIS budget for another 3 years are very appealing to me. All hopes of being a SAHM are dashed at this point. I am going to miss out on the the most precious years of my last baby’s life.

From bad to worse.

 

[rayne89]

As a Catholic, I wish to remind you that sterilization is a mortal sin. Please do not partake in the Eucharist until you have gone to confession and had repentance for cutting off God’s grace in your marriage. I"m sorry, I could not let that comment slide, about waiting to be able to pay for it yourselves. It sounds like you didn’t have an issue with the surgery, only that he borrowed the money from family for it. I don’t know, maybe he’s not a Catholic, but it had to be said, if not for you, then for whoever might be reading this thread.

She already a had previous thread about this. You should look it up. She is well aware of what the Church teaches and was not in favor of her husband having a vasectomy.

 

[rayne89]

Well, that’s that. I should have known DH would side w/ his dad. No matter the reasons he gave me last night, I still think bottom line is he just can’t say no to his dad. He was valid to say that regardless of how I feel about it all, it doesn’t change the fact that the car needs fixed and there’s no guarantee that it will hang on four more months till we get our return. And then we proceeded to argue about money. I told him we will just pay for it ourselves out of our Christmas Club money and just not do all the other things we wanted to do. I may be making him ‘pay’ for it in a sense, but I still an very opposed to ‘owing’ anybody money. There’s just this underlying feeling of - well, if you didn’t have so many d**n kids, you wouldn’t be in this predicament.

You are hurt. You feel unsupported.

Way back when we took NFP classes I remember them talking about how a a sterilization damages a marriage in ways that are not always obvious. Remember God will get you through this. Every time your husband does anything big or small, even very small (not that I’m saying this is very small) that makes you feel unsupported, not understood, that your feelings don’t count- it will rip open that very large wound when he took the step to end your fertility together against your wishes.

This is the time to fall at the feet of Jesus, to ask His mother Mary to wrap her arms around you and comfort you -and to ask for the graces to heal this.
Do not let Satan come and use this pain to rip your marriage apart. He will try. He will to use the hurt, the resentment, the heartache, the feelings of being alone and unsupported, of not being listened to, the feeling that what you want doesn’t count -he will use these feelings to put distance between you and your husband.

The “once again he listened to his father over me”, the “he took money from the man that made it possible to destroy the ability for us to ever have more children” “the man that thinks we have too many d**n kids” “that looks at my precious children as a burden” “He sided with him instead of me his wife.” -these are thoughts that Satan wants you to have. Because they destroy peace, they push you and your husband apart. I can imagine Satan has thoughts for your husband too. “She’s being unreasonable” “She accepts money from her parents all the time but when my dad wants to help that’s not ok” “Why take this risk of the car breaking down? If something goes wrong I’ll look like an *ss in my dad’s eyes and I’ll never hear the end of it.”

It is not going to be easy. But God will get you through this. Pray, pray and pray some more. Look for every opportunity to bring healing in your marriage.

If it wasn’t about a car repair it would be something else. Any money that comes from your husband’s father will always be a kick in the teeth no matter how well intentioned or how badly its needed because your husband took money from him to go against your beliefs, your wants, your heart, your marriage.

All hopes of being a SAHM are dashed at this point. I am going to miss out on the the most precious years of my last baby’s life.

This is the pain of your husband’s sterilization stabbing you in the heart. “He took money that robbed me of ever having another baby, and now he’s taking more money from the same man, adding to our debt and which rob me of all I have left -the precious years of the last baby I will ever have.” You are grieving and your pain is understandable. My concern is if you do not see what is before you your children will robbed of having the example of two parents in one home or will see the peace be stolen from their family life.

You can not change what has happened. And so what you have left to do to give it God and ask for Him to help you heal, to help your marriage heal. Ask God to help you find forgiveness, to heal the hole in your heart that you have. It may take time but place your trust in God. I will be praying for you both.

 

[Gordon_Sims]

JLCecilia, I don’t know that I can offer any advice but I can definitely sympathize with what you’re going through. On two different occasions we’ve had family members insist that we make major home improvements that we couldn’t afford. When we told them this, they ended up offering to pay for them as a gift, then later told us they were only loans and that they expected repayment. On countless other occasions we’ve had family give us gifts or help us in some other way then later hold it over our heads. I don’t understand what motivates someone to act that way. I never willingly take loans from family or friends because of the issues it causes, and if I’m in a position to help friends or family financially, it’s always as a gift with no strings attached.

 

[JLCecilia]

Xantippe and rayne89, thank you for the thoughtful, touching posts. The HS laid it on my heart that since DH had his vasctomy on the 9th of the month, that I should pray a novena from the 1st-9th of each month. I added to that to give up my lunch on the 9th (as some form of reparation) and to make a small act of kindness for DH (in some sense, loving my enemy - I know that’s a strong word, but it sort of fits the bill in this case). I just get him a pack of his favorite candy and write him a nice note thanking him for all his hard work. After only doing this once so far since the vasectomy (just 2.5 mo ago), I can already see changes in him. Just small things, but it’s so rewarding to see my prayers come to fruition.

At our immediate family’s Christmas, ‘we’ as a family decided several years ago to quit buying gifts for the grown-ups. DH has one brother who, together with his wife, struggle more than us and asked to opt out. But, you’re not going to tell my other, very generous and well-to-do BIL that he can’t give. So he gives his parents an ‘anniversary’ gift at Christmas (their anniv. happens to be in December). DH and I started doing this as well. We give a ‘couples’ gift to his folks and to each of his brothers and their wives. Normally it’s just gift certs to dinner and the movies. It’s our small way of thanking everyone for their generosity, but also b/c DH actually feels bad for his family b/c we have so many kids they have to buy gifts for (eye roll). No matter how tight it is, this small gift takes priority. But, it also happens to be a lot easier/cheaper than buying individual gifts for the grown ups. It all works out.

 

[Xantippe]

JLCecilia said:

“…but also b/c DH actually feels bad for his family b/c we have so many kids they have to buy gifts for (eye roll).”

They can spend however much they want to spend. However much they choose or don’t choose to spend is their business. In larger families, people exchange names.

When I was a kid, a couple Christmases running, my aunt and uncle (who were starting a business) gave me lemon scented chapstick as my gift. I thought it was the BEST. Looking back, they were probably trying really hard to keep Christmas costs low.

Likewise, my daughter has a friend who for her 11th birthday, wanted sparkly pipe cleaners. We got a bunch of them for her, but that was a very inexpensive gift.

Often, it’s the thoughtful gifts that are inexpensive.

 

[Xantippe]

By the way, it’s possible that this anniversary gift is also causing the poorer BIL discomfort, as it is also something that he can’t reciprocate.

I would encourage you and your husband to keep your eyes open and make sure that these anniversary gifts aren’t a problem. I think it happens a lot in families that without intending to do so or cause any harm, the most prosperous relative tends to set the standard for giving and spending, in a way that’s bad for the poorer relatives who have to strain to keep up. In my family, I have one much more prosperous aunt and uncle (the chapstick family, oddly enough), and they have unfortunately gotten control over the location for the big extended family vacation. They bought a share in a property in the area (that’s exactly big enough for their side of the family), so every single vacation has to be there, which means that only a fraction of the family can afford to go (and some of those who do go probably shouldn’t).

 

[Xantippe]

Plus, you guys really don’t have that many kids.

 

[Mrs_Sally]

Xantippe and rayne89, thank you for the thoughtful, touching posts. The HS laid it on my heart that since DH had his vasctomy on the 9th of the month, that I should pray a novena from the 1st-9th of each month. I added to that to give up my lunch on the 9th (as some form of reparation) and to make a small act of kindness for DH (in some sense, loving my enemy - I know that’s a strong word, but it sort of fits the bill in this case). I just get him a pack of his favorite candy and write him a nice note thanking him for all his hard work. After only doing this once so far since the vasectomy (just 2.5 mo ago), I can already see changes in him. Just small things, but it’s so rewarding to see my prayers come to fruition.

This is so wonderful! That’s a great way to show love to your DH, despite what he has done to hurt himself and you with the vasectomy. May God richly reward you for those signs of love!

At our immediate family’s Christmas, ‘we’ as a family decided several years ago to quit buying gifts for the grown-ups. DH has one brother who, together with his wife, struggle more than us and asked to opt out. But, you’re not going to tell my other, very generous and well-to-do BIL that he can’t give. So he gives his parents an ‘anniversary’ gift at Christmas (their anniv. happens to be in December). DH and I started doing this as well. We give a ‘couples’ gift to his folks and to each of his brothers and their wives. Normally it’s just gift certs to dinner and the movies. It’s our small way of thanking everyone for their generosity, but also b/c DH actually feels bad for his family b/c we have so many kids they have to buy gifts for (eye roll). No matter how tight it is, this small gift takes priority. But, it also happens to be a lot easier/cheaper than buying individual gifts for the grown ups. It all works out.

We’ve gone through several iterations of how to exchange gifts in our family also - and DH and I both come from relatively small families! I think each couple/family needs to come to their own decision about budgets. If the more well-off part of the family want to spend a lot, they can. But they shouldn’t then try to require anyone to meet their spending or complain about the gifts they do receive!

Since the youngest person in our extended family is 16, we tend to exchange a lot of gift cards. It’s not as much fun to watch people open presents, but that gives us an reason to emphasis other parts of the celebration.

There are two months to Christmas - enough time to plan, but hopefully not time to get into disagreements and falling out beforehand! I’ve said a prayer for you this morning.